The Musician's Gig Room Chat V1 - Songwriting and Sound Design for all! - Creationism Corner

[QUOTE=Warship;51226124]I agree with most things you said. I kinda regret posting it because I can do better and it was completed in less than 5 hours. But not every track has to be a masterpiece either I suppose. I just completed something I'm quite a bit more proud of - Also spent more time on the mastering than I usually do. I'll post it later.[/QUOTE] I thought it was pretty good actually. Don't feel down about posting songs to this thread, as it is a great way to get feedback and see what you can improve. Also, just as general census data that may come into play later in a tutorial-like post, how long do each of you generally work on a track (that is, hours spent actively working, not like how many days go by between start and finish.) Breaking down between general songwriting, mixing, and mastering would be interesting, but don't worry about the categories too much.

I don't actually finish any tracks :v:

Thanks for the kind words Splenda, you're the real mvp

Check this out, I made this track at 120BPM and slowed it down to 80%. It actually got a bit more interesting when I did that, so I just kept it at 80% and uploaded it. [media]https://soundcloud.com/thedanielholt/someone-else[/media] (I'll give feedback on the next person who posts a track, I promise)

[QUOTE=Warship;51212826]Listening to the mixtape right now, digging it so far! I'll be back with more feedback when I've heard it all. Is there a way we could get a download of it? Edit: Sick use of sampling, sounds like you know what you're doing. There's a gritty, dark tone to most of the tracks and it feels authentic (If that makes any sense). Princess Diane can only be described as creepy and interesting. Also digging the trap elements in Fugazi, what kind of bass is that even? Nice use of the brass. Sweet drums and guitar sample in Seafoam (Assuming it's sampling). Desperado's probably my favorite track. I'll say that a couple of the tracks are a bit boring to me, but I'm also a pretty light hiphop listener so it could just be me. Also lol at the outro in Kaiju. But keep it up dude! I was at some underground nightclub yesterday night to 6 in the morning, so I was exposed to house music for a long time. Today I woke up and made one of the housiest tracks I've ever done, probably. Made it pretty quickly, and the mastering could be better, but I'm trying to not be a perfectionist. [media]https://soundcloud.com/thedanielholt/wasting-my-time[/media][/QUOTE] Thanks for the feedback man. DL link is here for anyone who's interested [url]http://www.mediafire.com/file/42yob3e2a44v2a0/GAENG_-_Dark_Title.zip[/url]

[QUOTE=Warship;51232401]Check this out, I made this track at 120BPM and slowed it down to 80%. It actually got a bit more interesting when I did that, so I just kept it at 80% and uploaded it. [media]https://soundcloud.com/thedanielholt/someone-else[/media] (I'll give feedback on the next person who posts a track, I promise)[/QUOTE] Oh wow that kick. The chords sound a little random at first, but it's got a good sense of movement. The highpass of the chord thing seems a little out of place, and it almost gets a little too busy when the delay beeps come in. The bell things are really cool with the stereo effect. I think you should make the delay beeps less active and try to hold back on the beat more, make it a little sparser. It's too busy to be chill, but not loud enough to be... not chill. [vido]https://soundcloud.com/0tt/feedback1[/video] Hey look an original composition. Some happy hardcore/UK hardcore thing based on my phone feedbacking a chord planner app plus a looper app. I need to make it sound more open, but I'm not sure how. Would field recordings fit in or would they sound too out of place? [editline]a[/editline] New version, now with ska guitar and melodica! [video]https://soundcloud.com/0tt/feedback2[/video]

Hi, everyone. I have a huge problem - when i think of a sound and i want to describe it to someone (like the musician who is suppose to play it) i don't know technical terms, so i find myself struggling to put it in words. I end up having to compare it to another existing sound (if i find a music with that instrument being played in the same way) or having to mimic it with my mouth. Is there any place where i can find a glossary of sounds that can describe how they, well, sound? (Timbre, etc.)

There's no point to try to describe soind with adjectives. Learn the technical terms or explain by playing the actual sound.

[QUOTE=YuriNikolai;51247281]Hi, everyone. I have a huge problem - when i think of a sound and i want to describe it to someone (like the musician who is suppose to play it) i don't know technical terms, so i find myself struggling to put it in words. I end up having to compare it to another existing sound (if i find a music with that instrument being played in the same way) or having to mimic it with my mouth. Is there any place where i can find a glossary of sounds that can describe how they, well, sound? (Timbre, etc.)[/QUOTE] Here is the key problem with music: there are no technical terms for describing timbre. The only way we can describe sound, other than by similar sounds, is to compare it to the rest of our sensory experiences. Common words like "rough, wet, harsh, soft, etc" are not objective terms for sound, since it is impossible for sound to be wet, but rather generalizations of what said sound reminds us of. Even if you skip over this like Ott suggests, you still will not be able to objectively convey a sound in your head to another person. Technical terms can only get you so far, for example, you can tell a guitarist to play a note "hard" but you cannot really tell them the exact value of force in neurons, and making the sound with your mouth will be clouded by our bodies' incapability to mimic non-humanoid sounds to any real precision. My advice is to give a general idea of what you are going for, but let the musician throw their own flair into the song as well. Like just say "can you improvise a dreamy guitar lead over the breakdown" rather than trying to control their tone and feel too much. In my opinion, the most creatively expressive, yet still restricted into some sort of boundaries mean of musical instruction is either through putting the musician in a mood (much like how actors are given motivations for scenes) or just embrace the uncertainty of sonic description. [editline]23rd October 2016[/editline] As for the glossary, it's already in your head. Use your own life's experiences as a translator to and from the sounds you hear. Whatever adjective, or other descriptive phrase, a sound makes you think of is the correct term.

[QUOTE=Ott;51246211]Oh wow that kick. The chords sound a little random at first, but it's got a good sense of movement. The highpass of the chord thing seems a little out of place, and it almost gets a little too busy when the delay beeps come in. The bell things are really cool with the stereo effect. I think you should make the delay beeps less active and try to hold back on the beat more, make it a little sparser. It's too busy to be chill, but not loud enough to be... not chill. [video]https://soundcloud.com/0tt/feedback1[/video] Hey look an original composition. Some happy hardcore/UK hardcore thing based on my phone feedbacking a chord planner app plus a looper app. I need to make it sound more open, but I'm not sure how. Would field recordings fit in or would they sound too out of place?[/QUOTE] Thanks, I appreciate the feedback! I think your mixing could be better, some things are too loud and it becomes pretty messy. Especially the bass at first. And I'm not sure how well I like the feedback instrument :v: I guess reverb is what you'd need to make it more "open", but reverb should always be used in moderation. Nice touch with the decreasing tempo at the end (I forgot the technical term for it). The composition was good, so was the melody, but the individual instruments could use some tweaking.

[QUOTE=Warship;51232401]Check this out, I made this track at 120BPM and slowed it down to 80%. It actually got a bit more interesting when I did that, so I just kept it at 80% and uploaded it. [media]https://soundcloud.com/thedanielholt/someone-else[/media] (I'll give feedback on the next person who posts a track, I promise)[/QUOTE] I really like the atmosphere, very chill. It almost sounds like it could have a piano part in it somewhere for melody, maybe in the middle, to tie it together. [media]https://soundcloud.com/genets/electricmountainswip[/media] [editline]25th October 2016[/editline] A little something I did first inspired by Interstellar, then by Tron legacy kind of... CC?

[QUOTE=SIRIUS;51259991] [media]https://soundcloud.com/genets/electricmountainswip[/media] [editline]25th October 2016[/editline] A little something I did first inspired by Interstellar, then by Tron legacy kind of... CC?[/QUOTE] Definitely something I could listen to while playing Stellaris! I dig it. It's very ambient, if that's what you were going for. If I personally were to add anything, maybe some higher pitch single tones, something light and expansive. I've lurked here for a while and I posted years back but I cobbled together two Porter Robinson songs into a piano arrangement. It's off an iPhone 7 recording so fair warning, but I just wanted to show off this idea; maybe someone better than I could do something more aha. [media]https://soundcloud.com/vizard38/a-sad-sheltered-machine[/media]

[QUOTE=SIRIUS;51259991]I really like the atmosphere, very chill. It almost sounds like it could have a piano part in it somewhere for melody, maybe in the middle, to tie it together. [media]https://soundcloud.com/genets/electricmountainswip[/media] [editline]25th October 2016[/editline] A little something I did first inspired by Interstellar, then by Tron legacy kind of... CC?[/QUOTE] Your snare+ kick sound like they are part of a totally different song when compared to the synth lines. Concatenate your reverbs and delays so stuff sounds like it's all recorded in the same space. Just because it's electronic music doesn't really excuse this, and sense you are making semi atmospheric music it really should be something pivotal to your music. Think of it this way: if you are recording a band, you wouldn't make the drummer play in a church while the guitarists play in a cave while the singer sings in a classroom. You want your song to feel natural. Like even doing something as matching room characteristics will help tremendously if you want different decay times per instrument. Right now your synths have a very dark, moody reverb while the reverb you put on your percussion is very bright and present. [editline]25th October 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=vizard38;51261128]Definitely something I could listen to while playing Stellaris! I dig it. It's very ambient, if that's what you were going for. If I personally were to add anything, maybe some higher pitch single tones, something light and expansive. I've lurked here for a while and I posted years back but I cobbled together two Porter Robinson songs into a piano arrangement. It's off an iPhone 7 recording so fair warning, but I just wanted to show off this idea; maybe someone better than I could do something more aha. [media]https://soundcloud.com/vizard38/a-sad-sheltered-machine[/media][/QUOTE] Since this is just piano works, not even your own songs :v:, not really much to criticize. Guess my only complaint is your timing is very loose, but like in the way where it sounds like you are hunting for notes instead of a feel thing if you get what I mean. It's not that big of a deal, but just seems weird for, what I presume, are riffs taken from Edm songs. Maybe with a bit more practice on the songs you can do a very soft cover of them, would be nice with some airy vocals or something if the songs have lyrics! You have much more patenice than I do in front of a piano though. If I was recording this with a phone I would just through the phone on the strings ala prepared piano style and just see what the resulting file sounded like. :v:

Does anyone know a good site that explains mixing? Regarding Splendas post above, I wouldn't even know how to fix those issues. I know a faair bit about music theory and what not due to having a history playing guitar and piano but when it comes to tidying up a mix I am just..lost

Youtube has some good tutorials I find

[QUOTE=Maveraux;51261444]Does anyone know a good site that explains mixing? Regarding Splendas post above, I wouldn't even know how to fix those issues. I know a faair bit about music theory and what not due to having a history playing guitar and piano but when it comes to tidying up a mix I am just..lost[/QUOTE] Music theory and production techniques are totally different subjects, so don't feel bad that you don't understand some stuff. Like the two complement each other, but knowing how to play a 5/6 isorhythm isn't going to help when you need to EQ a snare drum for example. iZotope has some good resources on the subject. Their [url=http://downloads.izotope.com/guides/iZotope-Mixing-Guide-Principles-Tips-Techniques.pdf]Mixing guide PDF[/url] seems fairly comprehensive, and they also [url=https://pae.izotope.com/]"game-ified"[/url] the subject if you are more into that (not as comprehensive though.) The stuff I generally talk about isn't really found in mixing guides though, and is more based on just general knowledge of how songs should be made. What everyone should do before calling a song "finished" is battle your song head-to-head with a song you quite like that you think has been made really well. If your song is not at the level of the other one, you should look into why, not just settle that you "are not as good as the pros," since today, your favorite musicians are probably using the same tools you have at your disposal. Guess another quick bit of advice is to never use presets for mixing/mastering stuff, so compressors, EQs, limiters, etc. Like it's not even a purist thing; people making the presets do not know your song, so you shouldn't use stuff they made for their song. Maybe in their world their snare needed some extra bottom to fill out the spectrum, while in your world you have a low tom fulfilling that requirement. Learning how to use these tools inside and out will probably be the most drastic improvement to your music, more so than any fancy new analog synth or bank of 20,000 massive presets or whatever people buy these days.

[QUOTE=vizard38;51261128]Definitely something I could listen to while playing Stellaris! I dig it. It's very ambient, if that's what you were going for. If I personally were to add anything, maybe some higher pitch single tones, something light and expansive. I've lurked here for a while and I posted years back but I cobbled together two Porter Robinson songs into a piano arrangement. It's off an iPhone 7 recording so fair warning, but I just wanted to show off this idea; maybe someone better than I could do something more aha. [media]https://soundcloud.com/vizard38/a-sad-sheltered-machine[/media][/QUOTE] I really like this arrangement and I think the variety in tempo really adds to it. However it sounds like you're using the sustain pedal the whole time (you're probably not, and it's probably just the recording), but all that reverb really muddies up some parts. But the structure is really great, I love how it always finds that melody, no matter how far away from it it gets. Really nice to listen to, we don't have enough modern piano pieces like this (I know it's a compilation of songs but yeah). --- So a band my friends and I are in recently recorded a 5 track demo. The leader kept trying to find producers, and he sent me the stuff they had made, and it was fairly shit (one of the samples I was sent had the vocals with a 1.5 second reverb. what the fuck are you doing). So I tried to take a crack at it; I'm going to mix the whole thing, but here's what I have for the first song on the demo. [media]https://soundcloud.com/tetramputechture/can-you-hear-me-demo[/media] This is my first time producing anything that was recorded in an actual studio. However the recording studio was pretty cheap, and I didn't have the best stuff to work with. But I still think it came out decent, what do you guys think? I'm really looking for some input as with production, the more ears and speaker setups, the better. Thanks (: [editline]26th October 2016[/editline] (i'm also on the drums)

[QUOTE=NixNax123;51264254]I really like this arrangement and I think the variety in tempo really adds to it. However it sounds like you're using the sustain pedal the whole time (you're probably not, and it's probably just the recording), but all that reverb really muddies up some parts. But the structure is really great, I love how it always finds that melody, no matter how far away from it it gets. Really nice to listen to, we don't have enough modern piano pieces like this (I know it's a compilation of songs but yeah). --- So a band my friends and I are in recently recorded a 5 track demo. The leader kept trying to find producers, and he sent me the stuff they had made, and it was fairly shit (one of the samples I was sent had the vocals with a 1.5 second reverb. what the fuck are you doing). So I tried to take a crack at it; I'm going to mix the whole thing, but here's what I have for the first song on the demo. [media]https://soundcloud.com/tetramputechture/can-you-hear-me-demo[/media] This is my first time producing anything that was recorded in an actual studio. However the recording studio was pretty cheap, and I didn't have the best stuff to work with. But I still think it came out decent, what do you guys think? I'm really looking for some input as with production, the more ears and speaker setups, the better. Thanks (: [editline]26th October 2016[/editline] (i'm also on the drums)[/QUOTE] Some background, used to record live bands and I do live sound for a few off and on "venues" that cater towards punk/pop stuff. (Also I'm way into the DIY scene.) Could tell you are the drummer before you even said you were on drums! :v: The drums are a tad bit too forward for my tastes, while the distorted guitar is kind of far back (don't know if you are trying to hide how messy it is but it kind of adds to the DIY aesthetic ya feel?) Also the two guitars kind of mudd up each other (again DIY but idk how DIY you want this to sound.) The background vocals at the end are almost non-existent, either make them known or get rid of them, right now you sound too shy in your mixing if that analogy makes sense. Also if you want to send me the stems I can take a crack at it if you want. Depending on the DAW you use, I can send the project files to you so you can see what I did in terms of production techniques (if I don't own the same DAW as you I can at least make a little pdf of stuff I did to the mix.) Have always thought about trying to do a facepunch mix-off type of thing, so maybe this can be a proof-of-concept to that idea. :smile:

[QUOTE=splenda;51264540]Some background, used to record live bands and I do live sound for a few off and on "venues" that cater towards punk/pop stuff. (Also I'm way into the DIY scene.) Could tell you are the drummer before you even said you were on drums! :v: The drums are a tad bit too forward for my tastes, while the distorted guitar is kind of far back (don't know if you are trying to hide how messy it is but it kind of adds to the DIY aesthetic ya feel?) Also the two guitars kind of mudd up each other (again DIY but idk how DIY you want this to sound.) The background vocals at the end are almost non-existent, either make them known or get rid of them, right now you sound too shy in your mixing if that analogy makes sense. Also if you want to send me the stems I can take a crack at it if you want. Depending on the DAW you use, I can send the project files to you so you can see what I did in terms of production techniques (if I don't own the same DAW as you I can at least make a little pdf of stuff I did to the mix.) Have always thought about trying to do a facepunch mix-off type of thing, so maybe this can be a proof-of-concept to that idea. :smile:[/QUOTE] Thanks so much! Yeah I realized that was inevitable with my unconscious bias :v: I tried to balance out the guitars with panning, it's hard not to make it sound muddy with distortion like that (but I did EQ the guitars separately some more on this new mix I'm sending you and it sounds a ton clearer, but still muddy. Maybe you know what to do?). I'll send you a new mix via a PM + the stems, I would LOVE if you could show me the ropes a little bit! Thanks a ton! [editline]26th October 2016[/editline] new mix using some of his advice for anyone who wants to hear it: [URL]https://clyp.it/yeik3yfu[/URL] (still not final!)

Hey guys check out my sausage [img]http://i.imgur.com/X7NKv0z.png[/img]

[QUOTE=vizard38;51261128] [media]https://soundcloud.com/vizard38/a-sad-sheltered-machine[/media][/QUOTE] This is pretty cool I personality would press a little less hard on the sustain pedal. you play sooo good [editline]27th October 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=SIRIUS;51259991] [media]https://soundcloud.com/genets/electricmountainswip[/media] [editline]25th October 2016[/editline] A little something I did first inspired by Interstellar, then by Tron legacy kind of... CC?[/QUOTE] This is really cool Although the panning makes me a bit dizzy. I love the kick samples and the riff itself so maybe just toning down the panning. id love to see what u cook up [media]https://soundcloud.com/corn-mouth/i-eat-pixels-1[/media] This is my fastest and most meticulous drum programming ive ever done before. I'd love to have any sort of feedback at all. hell just telling me you listened means a lot to me.

The notes are not good. The percussion is very good. You should collab with someone who makes chiptune to create the greatest chipbreak album there ever was.

[QUOTE=Ott;51272289]The notes are not good. The percussion is very good. You should collab with someone who makes chiptune to create the greatest chipbreak album there ever was.[/QUOTE] What about the notes need work

[QUOTE=Ms. Gyroscope;51271945]This is pretty cool I personality would press a little less hard on the sustain pedal. you play sooo good [editline]27th October 2016[/editline] This is really cool Although the panning makes me a bit dizzy. I love the kick samples and the riff itself so maybe just toning down the panning. id love to see what u cook up [media]https://soundcloud.com/corn-mouth/i-eat-pixels-1[/media] This is my fastest and most meticulous drum programming ive ever done before. I'd love to have any sort of feedback at all. hell just telling me you listened means a lot to me.[/QUOTE] I absolutely love the breakdown parts, my drum programming is something I'm trying to work on and those are a great example. I feel the same as Ott though. The notes and synth you've chosen just don't "fit" the quality of the percussion. The part at 5:00 reminds me of Crystal Castles a lot though. A bit of work and you've have a really solid sound here. - This is a track I've been working on when I have time for about a week. It's moving towards completion in terms of writing, but I'm aware the current mixing is awful. It's definitely top of my do list. I'm posting both copies as one is earlier when the song was less busy and one is more complete. I'm just not sure I like the more worked on version anymore. Maybe I've listened to it too many times. Earlier Version: [media]https://soundcloud.com/theomari/stg-3[/media] More Worked Version: [media]https://soundcloud.com/theomari/stg-mix-1[/media] Appreciate any and all feedback. Also I don't know why it won't play in the player. Maybe because it's a private track?

Gyroscope: They just don't harmonize too well. They sound like random midi that was maybe filtered to fit the scale.Try picking a chord progression and building the melody out of notes from thise chords as they come and go. Use some seventh chords to keep it interesting. Also the second synth that comes in sounds like a soundblaster instrument (not very pleasant to listen to).

[QUOTE=Ott;51277016]Gyroscope: They just don't harmonize too well. They sound like random midi that was maybe filtered to fit the scale.Try picking a chord progression and building the melody out of notes from thise chords as they come and go. Use some seventh chords to keep it interesting. Also the second synth that comes in sounds like a soundblaster instrument (not very pleasant to listen to).[/QUOTE] Thanks. What kinda sound do you think would fit better?

Something with less of an aggressive high end. You can just low-pass pluck what you've got I guess. I just don't like that FM-ish tone (if that's what it is).

[QUOTE=Ms. Gyroscope;51271945]This is pretty cool I personality would press a little less hard on the sustain pedal. you play sooo good [editline]27th October 2016[/editline] This is really cool Although the panning makes me a bit dizzy. I love the kick samples and the riff itself so maybe just toning down the panning. id love to see what u cook up [media]https://soundcloud.com/corn-mouth/i-eat-pixels-1[/media] This is my fastest and most meticulous drum programming ive ever done before. I'd love to have any sort of feedback at all. hell just telling me you listened means a lot to me.[/QUOTE] Actually I think the notes are fine, but I feel like the bass part should be a softer wider sound, it's almost like there's too much saw [editline]30th October 2016[/editline] Second version of the song I posted before: [media]https://soundcloud.com/genets/underworldwip1[/media]

Any more cc?

It sounds like the Interstellar docking music mixed with Tron Legacy :v: The beginning arp almost sounds like a MIDI guitar at first, you can make the pluck slightly longer if you don't like this The clap thing is too quiet. I think the kick fits well. Second and third arps that fade in are good, although the third one could use some more variety. When the main song kicks in and the percussion stops, it sounds a little cheesy with the higher end of the hammered chords. The lead is nice though. The high mellow square thing sounds a little dissonant at 2:42. You could make the sweeps a tad louder. [editline]a[/editline] New track incoming, standby [editline]31st October 2016[/editline] Okay, I tried to master this one. Made the percussion louder and compressed around it, made the quiet parts a bit louder, then rendered at -6db. Then I amplified the peaks to +2 db in audacity (after pitching it down a semitone), compressed it back down at 10:1, and de-amplified the peaks. [video]https://soundcloud.com/0tt/feedback3[/video]