[QUOTE=Proclivitas;52367277]Imagine if I started a boy-only coding camp. You can't have this notion that boys and girls can't work together. They have coding camps for girls and co-ed camps, but not boys only camps. It's sexist and not the right approach. They also have camps for kids of color only, imagine if I started a camp white children in poverty. It's racist/sexist to segregate people based on biological factors.[/QUOTE]
The thing is, there isn't a thing you can do to help the situation that can't be interpreted as sexist. Sure, you're cutting boys off from this learning resource but they obviously seem to be doing just fine without it. Besides, you could always just CALL it "girls coding camp" and allow anyone to apply. The effect would be the same.
there are very few girls in CS because most girls don't want to sit in-front of a computer for 10 hours a day.
[QUOTE=awcmon;52355869]why do people care about diversity again
code is just code man it doesnt matter a shit who slammed on the keyboard
what really matters is if they used tabs or spaces[/QUOTE]
Is diversity a [I]bad[/I] thing? I think diversity is good in all things.
[editline]17th June 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Radical_ed;52370817]there are very few girls in CS because most girls don't want to sit in-front of a computer for 10 hours a day.[/QUOTE]
Why are you working for 10 hours a day? Also, about half my day is spent coding, the other half is in meetings.
[QUOTE=proboardslol;52372079]Is diversity a [I]bad[/I] thing? I think diversity is good in all things.
[editline]17th June 2017[/editline]
Why are you working for 10 hours a day? Also, about half my day is spent coding, the other half is in meetings.[/QUOTE]
I work 6 days a week avg 12hrs a day, but that's because I choose to and I'm hourly. I definitely don't spend more than 4hrs a week in any meetings.
[QUOTE=proboardslol;52372079]Is diversity a [I]bad[/I] thing? I think diversity is good in all things.
[/QUOTE]
i don't think diversity is a bad thing i just don't see how it's supposed to be good either. like what the fuck is it even supposed to accomplish in the end. code is code doesn't matter if it was a fucking woman or some black person or some shit who wrote it, its fucking code man.
it does get actively become bad when shit like affirmative action comes in though. hiring discrimination is never right, but that goes both ways and people fucking love to forget that
people do what people wanna do. if somebody doesn't wanna do CS i don't see the problem with that
i'm not going to tell people how to live their fucking life or try to tell them what they should be interested in or try to subconsciously change what some arbitrary group is interested in or some shit over some identity politics or whatever crap.
maybe there's a reason why certain groups are interested in certain things and not others, but that's not my business. i'm not a fucking busybody. i'm not going to insult somebody's intelligence by assuming they can't fucking think for themselves because they aren't interested in some fucking subject.
[QUOTE=awcmon;52373143]i don't think diversity is a bad thing i just don't see how it's supposed to be good either. like what the fuck is it even supposed to accomplish in the end. code is code doesn't matter if it was a fucking woman or some black person or some shit who wrote it, its fucking code man.
it does get actively become bad when shit like affirmative action comes in though. hiring discrimination is never right, but that goes both ways and people fucking love to forget that
people do what people wanna do. if somebody doesn't wanna do CS i don't see the problem with that
i'm not going to tell people how to live their fucking life or try to tell them what they should be interested in or try to subconsciously change what some arbitrary group is interested in or some shit over some identity politics or whatever crap.
maybe there's a reason why certain groups are interested in certain things and not others, but that's not my business. i'm not a fucking busybody. i'm not going to insult somebody's intelligence by assuming they can't fucking think for themselves because they aren't interested in some fucking subject.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I've never heard an argument that explains why having combination across the rainbow is a good idea.
[QUOTE=awcmon;52373143]try to subconsciously change what some arbitrary group is interested in or some shit over some identity politics or whatever crap. [/QUOTE]
too busy writing code to worry about that kind of bullshit
[QUOTE=Dr Magnusson;52358762]
The actual women I've met who work in IT either don't give a shit, or actively hate this bullshit because it [B]diminishes their real achievements[/B] by planting a seed of doubt in everyone they encounter about whether or not they actually got to where they were through real quality work, or to fill some arbitrary quota.[/QUOTE]
Dude, this is so true. Sure it's anecdotal, but my experiences has been the same with the women I've talked to in CS/IT. And it does make sense in a way doesn't it?
[QUOTE=awcmon;52373143]i don't think diversity is a bad thing i just don't see how it's supposed to be good either. like what the fuck is it even supposed to accomplish in the end.[/quote]
Makes for a better/more socially diverse work environment; maybe less hostile if there's a better mix of genders.
[quote]it does get actively become bad when shit like affirmative action comes in though. hiring discrimination is never right, but that goes both ways and people fucking love to forget that[/quote]
I'm not talking about affirmative action I'm talking about two things: calling out and fighting workplace discrimination when you see it, and getting girls interested in technical things at a young age.
[quote]people do what people wanna do. if somebody doesn't wanna do CS i don't see the problem with that[/quote]
But the problem is that there are a lot of horror stories from companies in tech that can dissuade women from wanting to study CS.
[QUOTE=proboardslol;52374168]Makes for a better/more socially diverse work environment; maybe less hostile if there's a better mix of genders.
I'm not talking about affirmative action I'm talking about two things: calling out and fighting workplace discrimination when you see it, and getting girls interested in technical things at a young age.
But the problem is that there are a lot of horror stories from companies in tech that can dissuade women from wanting to study CS.[/QUOTE]
aight that's fair enough i guess. i'm not a social butterfly so i still don't really see it but i can kinda understand
we should fight discrimination yeah. sorry for kneejerking about it, it's just where i am (silicon valley/bay area whatever the fuck you want to call it) affirmative action is a big topic in general. i honestly don't understand why discrimination still exists just because i don't really understand why people care about the gender or skin color or some shit of their workers when it should be the output that matters, but i guess that's just me not being a very social person.
about getting girls interested in technical things at a young age, eh. i do think that if one wanted more women in CS, that would be the way to go about it. however, it's just not something i really care about. it's not a bad thing or anything, it's just that it's not my business what people are interested in.
and as for the horror stories, idk man, it's their choice. like, what would one even do? convince women to not be dissuaded? convince the people behind whatever horror stories to stop what they are doing? i'm not big on trying to change people so they better fit my idea of whats right and wrong.
[QUOTE=awcmon;52374266]aight that's fair enough i guess. i'm not a social butterfly so i still don't really see it but i can kinda understand
we should fight discrimination yeah. sorry for kneejerking about it, it's just where i am (silicon valley/bay area whatever the fuck you want to call it) affirmative action is a big topic in general. i honestly don't understand why discrimination still exists just because i don't really understand why people care about the gender or skin color or some shit of their workers when it should be the output that matters, but i guess that's just me not being a very social person.
about getting girls interested in technical things at a young age, eh. i do think that if one wanted more women in CS, that would be the way to go about it. however, it's just not something i really care about. it's not a bad thing or anything, it's just that it's not my business what people are interested in.
and as for the horror stories, idk man, it's their choice. like, what would one even do? convince women to not be dissuaded? convince the people behind whatever horror stories to stop what they are doing? i'm not big on trying to change people so they better fit my idea of whats right and wrong.[/QUOTE]
I think that there's a baseline level of workplace conduct that needs to be maintained. In the documentary I mentioned in OP, some guys at her workplace were watching porn at work, some guys were hanging out in the basement watching a few girls hoola-hooping, and then there's the [url=https://medium.com/@amyvertino/my-name-is-not-amy-i-am-an-uber-survivor-c6d6541e632f#.ump1tdrry]dumpster fire that is Uber[/url].
There needs to be a more active HR department which actually does something about workplace harassment at these companies. I'm sure the vast majority of the industry is professional at work and this isn't a problem there, but if you ever see it at your workplace, we should call it out and try to keep your workplace professional
Seems like the real problem is shitty HR departments that can't handle their own employees.
[QUOTE=Proclivitas;52375059]Seems like the real problem is shitty HR departments that can't handle their own employees.[/QUOTE]
yeah definitely not the employees in question huh
[QUOTE=The Salmon;52377023]yeah definitely not the employees in question huh[/QUOTE]
If you refer back to I think my first post in this thread, I point out there is a shitty people problem. If you have environments in companies where toxicity is permitted, HR should be removing the toxic people and therefor companies such as Uber wouldn't have this reputation. If everyone had good HR departments that removed toxicity, you would have articles saying "X employees removed from Y company for sexual harassment", etc.
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