UE4 Development v2 - Developers

The fact that Epic themselves release a mess like that is kind of infuriating: [img]http://i.imgur.com/FOaCJEA.jpg[/img] Also I wish they used more unified node sizes. Like giving each possible input pin, output pin, headline, etc. a fixed size, make that smallest grid unit, and have larger horizontal step sizes for nodes. It would cause the nodes to be bigger but I want my lines to be straight and on a grid or else I can't sleep at night! It's most notably when the input or output pins of array nodes are off the grid.

[QUOTE=DasMatze;52156558]The fact that Epic themselves release a mess like that is kind of infuriating: [img]http://i.imgur.com/FOaCJEA.jpg[/img] Also I wish they used more unified node sizes. Like giving each possible input pin, output pin, headline, etc. a fixed size, make that smallest grid unit, and have larger horizontal step sizes for nodes. It would cause the nodes to be bigger but I want my lines to be straight and on a grid or else I can't sleep at night! It's most notably when the input or output pins of array nodes are off the grid.[/QUOTE] Woah wait what that's from Epic? [HIGHLIGHT][B]Disgusting.[/B][/HIGHLIGHT]

Don't get how anyone would want that mess over nice clean C++

[QUOTE=layla;52157101]Don't get how anyone would want that mess over nice clean C++[/QUOTE] People who don't know how to write C++ (like myself)

[QUOTE=hippowombat;52156954]Woah wait what that's from Epic? [HIGHLIGHT][B]Disgusting.[/B][/HIGHLIGHT][/QUOTE] Need I remind you of the fucking mess that was the post proccess settings node? [editline]27th April 2017[/editline] [img]https://u.cubeupload.com/simkas/fuckinglookatit.jpg[/img] [editline]27th April 2017[/editline] And as far as I remember, there was a time where if you wanted to keep a setting unchanged, you couldn't just collapse the node, you had to re-plug that into the make post proccess node for every fucking output.

what thats a joke right

No it's not. And I had to make subtle incremental changes to a post process actor in my weather system while allowing other settings to be edited without being overwritten, while also setting up profile saving behavior for 6 template and 6 custom profiles, which means that I had to do pass-through behavior for every single one of those motherfucking pins [B]12 times[/B]. [editline]27th April 2017[/editline] I should probably just sit down and push myself through learning C++, but I'd feel like I'm starting over and I hate that feeling.

[QUOTE=hippowombat;52157163]People who don't know how to write C++ (like myself)[/QUOTE] It's harder to maintain blueprints than it is to learn C++

[QUOTE=layla;52157101]Don't get how anyone would want that mess over nice clean C++[/QUOTE] It doesn't have to be like that. If you cleaned it up, it'd be much easier to follow: [img]http://i.imgur.com/SMB3SNn.jpg[/img] (this is a custom ForEachLoopWithDelay I made based on the base ForEachLoop) Saying "Why not use C++" is like asking "Why do you build a town with Lego bricks when you could build a model railroad with wood, paper, plaster, paint, cloth, styrene, ...?!" It might give you more freedom but it's much harder. You may had no problem learning it but I tried getting into coding like I learned 3D modeling, image editing, video editing and audio editing but I just didn't make any progress at all unlike Blueprints where I quickly learned not only how tu use the system itself but also how game logic works and what is required to reach your goal. In fact I wish for a software using visual programming like with UE4's blueprint system to either create desktop apps or use building blocks to generate code for real programming languages and I wonder why such software still doesn't exist. [QUOTE=hippowombat;52157514]which means that I had to do pass-through behavior for every single one of those motherfucking pins [B]12 times[/B].[/QUOTE] Not sure how long it's been around but there is the "Set members in [structure name]"-node which lets you input the whole structure as a single pin, edit pins that you exposed in the nodes properties and outputs the changed structure as a single pin.

[QUOTE=layla;52157676]It's harder to maintain blueprints than it is to learn C++[/QUOTE] You overestimate me.

Any argument you have for blueprints is going to fail because with C++ you can do more, faster, cleaner and easier. [QUOTE=DasMatze;52157688][img]http://i.imgur.com/SMB3SNn.jpg[/img] (this is a custom ForEachLoopWithDelay" I made based on the base ForEachLoop) [/QUOTE] So you spent your time making a pretty graph that can't really be debugged in any useful way when you could have just done it in a few lines of code?

[QUOTE=layla;52157716]Any argument you have for blueprints is going to fail because with C++ you can do more, faster, cleaner and easier.[/QUOTE] I'm not arguing that Blueprints are better than C++, I'm arguing that I'm fucking stupid and lazy. [I]Checkmate.[/I]

[QUOTE=hippowombat;52157722]I'm not arguing that Blueprints are better than C++, I'm arguing that I'm fucking stupid and lazy. [I]Checkmate.[/I][/QUOTE] Being stupid and lazy is exactly why you should want to use C++, I'm lazy as fuck and don't wanna spend all day connecting up visual nodes that you can barely maintain or debug.

[QUOTE=layla;52157716]So you spent your time making a pretty graph that can't really be debugged in any useful way when you could have just done it in a few lines of code?[/QUOTE] Why can't it be debugged? You can add breakpoints at every node which stops the game and you can read the variables and follow the graph step by step with just a few clicks. Putting "print string"-nodes in there also doesn't require any noticable effort. Having to organize code requires a similar amount of work I'd say. Like adding comments, making sure you used tabs instead of spaces, lining up columns of data, ... it's a personal preference. Code can be a confusing mess as well. As I edited into my previous post, I never got into coding but I worked with text files containing data for games like Train Fever or Factorio often enough that I can say that.

[QUOTE=layla;52157101]Don't get how anyone would want that mess over nice clean C++[/QUOTE] Since you prefer C++ over blueprints like me, have you came across any good tutorials/blogs/tips&tricks etc of C++ for UE4? I was going to start using UE4 but I didn't have enough time lately because of all the assignment I have to hand it for uni.

[QUOTE=DasMatze;52157783]Why can't it be debugged? You can add breakpoints at every node which stops the game and you can read the variables and follow the graph step by step with just a few clicks. Putting "print string"-nodes in there also doesn't require any noticable effort. Having to organize code requires a similar amount of work I'd say. Like adding comments, making sure you used tabs instead of spaces, lining up columns of data, ... it's a personal preference. Code can be a confusing mess as well. As I edited into my previous post, I never got into coding but I worked with text files containing data for games like Train Fever or Factorio often enough that I can say that.[/QUOTE] So 14 nodes taking up half your screen with a mess of wires is the same amount of effort as writing probably no more than 3 lines of C++? Not even close. It's preference yeah, using something shit or something better which is going to save you time and effort in every way. It's just preference [img]http://files.facepunch.com/Layla/2017/April/27/32423423sd3.png[/img] [editline]27th April 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=BoowmanTech;52157814]Since you prefer C++ over blueprints like me, have you came across any good tutorials/blogs/tips&tricks etc of C++ for UE4? I was going to start using UE4 but I didn't have enough time lately because of all the assignment I have to hand it for uni.[/QUOTE] Not really, I've learned a lot of tricks that I should write about. Just look through the engine source and see how epic do things.

[QUOTE=layla;52157676]It's harder to maintain blueprints than it is to learn C++[/QUOTE] For people who have no background in programming and almost no experience in math, both are difficult to their own extent. Sure C++ might be easy enough to pick up and make more sense that blueprint, but there's a much steeper learning curve. Blueprints are much easier to understand due to the visual nature of them, you can see what's doing what even if you don't fully understand what it is. I look at C++ and I just see jibberish, I can't make sense of it.

As someone who's built a ton of stuff in blueprints, my biggest concern with moving to C++ is unfamiliarity; I have an idea for something, I know relatively how to do it, so I sit down in Blueprints and bang it out. Switching to C++, when I have no idea how to format code, what symbols to use, command vocabulary, structuring, when to tab and when not to, I'd have to go back to the very basics of rudimentary learning in order to do anything. It's like I can run pretty fast now, and I could run faster, but first I have to break my legs and let them heal.

Blueprints are great for a person like me, I'm literally a generalist, only learning what I need to know to complete what I need to do in the moment.

Dismissing blueprints entirely is counter-productive I think. If you're developing solo and you'd rather just go full C++ that's obviously fine, but the performance argument is totally null if you do what Epic do in development and make core functionality in C++ and let designers and artists extend it using blueprints. The performance difference from blueprints to C++ is from the overhead of calling the node rather than the code within the node itself, so anything that designers/artists are going to make the performance difference literally unnoticeable. Assuming they don't do anything stupid like massive loops. Also they're just really nice and easy for people who are starting, or for prototyping stuff if that's your preference.

Personally I went to college for CS and know C++ well enough to do whatever I want with it. But I've always had a lot of trouble parsing text and that makes conventional coding exhausting. I also love that blueprints allow for 2-dimensional coding, it makes memorizing the structure of my code easier. I'm 3 or 4 times more productive in BP than in C++ because of how much easier blueprints are for me to read and remember. And when I say "more productive" I mean it's a regular occurrence to have people ask me how I got things done so fast. My friend and I work together on a lot of projects. He's a 3D artist and a tech artist. I helped him get into blueprints by doing pair programming on a project and now he's proficient enough to implement a lot of his own assets. Knowing him, I can guarantee you he wouldn't be able to do that with text-based code. The example I put up was from someone who's never coded before January of 2017. I made fun of his code to blow off steam but frankly it's pretty amazing that he managed to get to the point he did, aka writing bug-free, functional code and contributing to a larger codebase, in 3 months, despite not having a technical background. C++ has its advantages, absolutely, but I'm sticking to my usual strategy of 90% blueprints, 10% C++ because my games get done faster that way.

[QUOTE=Baboo00;52158527]C++ has its advantages, absolutely, but I'm sticking to my usual strategy of 90% blueprints, 10% C++ because my games get done faster that way.[/QUOTE] Getting the game done quickly is really important to avoid burnout. I've already had one project die because of it.

[QUOTE=zombojoe;52158685]Getting the game done quickly is really important to avoid burnout. I've already had one project die because of it.[/QUOTE] That, plus the financial pressures of doing creative work for a living. Time is money and all that.

Can anyone here shed some light on how I can record a video directly in UE4? I cant find anything useful for literally recording a single scene with no camera movement or anything in UE4. Finally figured it out, and finally finished my forest. Hopefully it will be on the marketplace soon! [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fVnMKDV9rY[/media]

[QUOTE=Shirky;52162096]Can anyone here shed some light on how I can record a video directly in UE4? I cant find anything useful for literally recording a single scene with no camera movement or anything in UE4. Finally figured it out, and finally finished my forest. Hopefully it will be on the marketplace soon! [/QUOTE] Did you find any documentation into it? Being able to record at an arbitrary framerate with all your settings maxed out straight to avi was really useful in Source and a few other engines.

[QUOTE=zombojoe;52162652]Did you find any documentation into it? Being able to record at an arbitrary framerate with all your settings maxed out straight to avi was really useful in Source and a few other engines.[/QUOTE] I didnt really figure it out, I ran into a ton of issues with sequencer with lighting popping in and out, certain things just not rendering, etc.

[QUOTE=layla;52157826]So 14 nodes taking up half your screen with a mess of wires is the same amount of effort as writing probably no more than 3 lines of C++?[/QUOTE] Yes, if you don't know C++. Anyone can very quickly get into and figure out how to use blueprints. Not anyone can quickly get into coding stuff in C++

[QUOTE=simkas;52164287]Yes, if you don't know C++. Anyone can very quickly get into and figure out how to use blueprints. Not anyone can quickly get into coding stuff in C++[/QUOTE] I dunno that [I]nobody[/I] can quickly get into C++, I think it just boils down to how people learn; an artist doing texture and material work can pick up node based scripting for basic shit like door or elevator behavior pretty quick because the layout makes sense to them. (Speaking kinda anecdotally as an artist-turned would-be programmer.) Before recent updates there was the addition of blueprints being significantly slower than straight up code, but a lot of strides have been made and the efficiency of both for most situations is pretty damn close, so it more or less comes down to preference imo. I'm not gonna hate on anyone for doing either one, as long as you're making cool shit.

[QUOTE=hippowombat;52164956] I'm not gonna hate on anyone for doing either one, as long as you're making cool shit.[/QUOTE] but then how am I gonna feel superior when my unfinished game is in C++ instead of filthy blueprints???? This argument really is pointless.

[QUOTE=hippowombat;52164956]I dunno that [I]nobody[/I] can quickly get into C++, I think it just boils down to how people learn; an artist doing texture and material work can pick up node based scripting for basic shit like door or elevator behavior pretty quick because the layout makes sense to them. (Speaking kinda anecdotally as an artist-turned would-be programmer.) Before recent updates there was the addition of blueprints being significantly slower than straight up code, but a lot of strides have been made and the efficiency of both for most situations is pretty damn close, so it more or less comes down to preference imo. I'm not gonna hate on anyone for doing either one, as long as you're making cool shit.[/QUOTE] It's not hate, it's telling people that it's worth the time to learn, for your own sake and for anyone else working on your project. You're literally making spaghetti code using blueprints. If I can shame at least one person into learning something new that is going to benefit and save them time in the long run then I don't care about any hurt feelings just because they can't be arsed to learn something. It would be a different story if I told an artist that I'd rather use hammer to make 3D models, yeah it's easier to get into but why wouldn't you want me to use a superior tool that is going to make my life easier in the long run? [QUOTE=simkas;52164287]Yes, if you don't know C++. Anyone can very quickly get into and figure out how to use blueprints. Not anyone can quickly get into coding stuff in C++[/QUOTE] Difference is that you can get better at C++, you don't get better at plugging wires into nodes.