• Why the tech of the Halo Universe is a step backward.
    1,885 replies, posted
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27270310]A Combine vs. Covenant debate would be much more interesting.[/QUOTE] Combine probably have been trained by a few drunken idiots, because the rebels (despite being rebels) are much better shots for some reason. The only reason they still stand is because of their things like Hunters and Striders
[QUOTE=Samiam22;27271642]Combine probably have been trained by a few drunken idiots, because the rebels (despite being rebels) are much better shots for some reason. The only reason they still stand is because of their things like Hunters and Striders[/QUOTE] The Half-Life 2 Combine are basically a semi-trained, understocked militia. There's a reason everyone is frantically rushing to shut any and all Combine-related portals, you know.
[QUOTE=Samiam22;27271642]Combine probably have been trained by a few drunken idiots, because the rebels (despite being rebels) are much better shots for some reason. The only reason they still stand is because of their things like Hunters and Striders[/QUOTE] And, you know, the fact that they are an immense, multi-dimensional empire. If this is a debate about AI, then I will definitely support the Combine soldier's AI, as it is much better than most make make it out to be. [QUOTE=eatdembeanz;27271658]The Half-Life 2 Combine are basically a semi-trained, understocked militia. There's a reason everyone is frantically rushing to shut any and all Combine-related portals, you know.[/QUOTE] Wrong. They are genetically modified super-soldiers, implanted with Combine technology, and having undergone invasive surgery to strengthen their fighting capabilities. They are then incased in a very thick, full body, airtight protective suit of armour. They are also equipped with highly deadly AR2s.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27271765] Wrong. They are genetically modified super-soldiers, implanted with Combine technology, and having undergone invasive surgery to strengthen their fighting capabilities. They are then incased in a very thick, full body, airtight protective suit of armour. They are also equipped with highly deadly AR2s.[/QUOTE] I meant in comparison to the Combine invasion forces, you silly skink.
[QUOTE=MasterG;27160719]Halo is like Star Wars - Mostly tries to stay in the realms of science fantasy - i.e. Blatent impossibilities, but generally done for the sake of fun. Mass Effect is like Star Trek - Mostly tries to stay in the realms of science fiction - i.e. [b]actually based on real theoretical science.[/b][/QUOTE] So these "mass effect" relays make more sense then Halo's "slipspace drives"? And giant robot ships that exterminate life every few thousand years makes more sense scientifically then Halo's story? Do you even know what your talking about? (Halo makes just as much sense as Mass Effect, which is none at all). [editline]7th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=shadow_of_intent;27161476]yes, but think of the size of those plasma shots. Even the smallest one is the size of your fist, so getting hit by one would easily leave a fist size hole right through your chest. Bullets wounds can be treated and survivable if treated quickly. A fist sized hole in your chest would drain alot of blood extremely quickly. Not to mention the intense pain you would suffer from basically having super heated lava in your chest.[/QUOTE] Wouldn't plasma cauterize the wound it makes?
Yeah. It'd probably also make your blood and inner organs boil or something. Both Mass Effect and Halo draw on the harder side of science fiction for certain elements. Mass Effect is more obvious though as it simply rips off anything remotely popular and throws it in the boiling pot. Halo has some more original ideas. And frankly, far more interesting ideas too than "lol save universe nao k"
Just skimming through some of my halo books, still really like the training aspects the spartans had as a kid, i mean completely ignoring the ethics of it and such, but they are really an elite fighting force, and even without the suits would be a very suitable fighting force.
[QUOTE=BmB;27272004]Yeah. It'd probably also make your blood and inner organs boil or something. Both Mass Effect and Halo draw on the harder side of science fiction for certain elements. Mass Effect is more obvious though as it simply rips off anything remotely popular and throws it in the boiling pot. Halo has some more original ideas. And frankly, far more interesting ideas too than "lol save universe nao k"[/QUOTE] Halo has more original ideas? When I first watched the movie Aliens I realized just how much it borrowed, then I read Starship Troopers and it happened again. The only thing in Halo I can see might be original is the Covenant and they aren't particularly imaginative. "Ok so there's these aliens right? They get shields, and laser guns, and some of them get cloaking things."
[QUOTE=Dirty_Ape;27274658]Halo has more original ideas? When I first watched the movie Aliens I realized just how much it borrowed, then I read Starship Troopers and it happened again. The only thing in Halo I can see might be original is the Covenant and they aren't particularly imaginative. "Ok so there's these aliens right? They get shields, and laser guns, and some of them get cloaking things."[/QUOTE] Megastuctures that are part of a galactic sterilisation weapon aren't something I've seen very often in science fiction to be fair.
[QUOTE=Dirty_Ape;27274658]"Ok so there's these aliens...and some of them get cloaking things."[/QUOTE]You simply [i]cannot[/i] make a list of borrowed concepts without pointing out [url=http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/4036/predcloak.jpg]the noble warrior alien with personal light refracting technology[/url]. And on the subject of scifi weaponry vs non-scifi weaponry, I always wondered why no one in fiction ever seem to exploit the fact that the former sometimes [i]only[/i] protects against the former. Like how Jedi can deflect energy blasts because their "swords" are also energy based. I wanna see a Jedi try that trick on someone with a low-tech-bullet-shooting gun, and get a glob of molten metal in the face for his troubles.
light sabre crowbar > anything in existance. /thread.
[QUOTE=Dirty_Ape;27274658]Halo has more original ideas? When I first watched the movie Aliens I realized just how much it borrowed, then I read Starship Troopers and it happened again. The only thing in Halo I can see might be original is the Covenant and they aren't particularly imaginative. "Ok so there's these aliens right? They get shields, and laser guns, and some of them get cloaking things."[/QUOTE] Well some of the Alien things are more of references than borrowed ideas. But starship troopers I can see that Halo borrowed a lot from. I think the covenant are unique in the fact they have actual goals, most games or films its just "INVADE EARTH AND KILL THEM FOR SOME REASON" while the covenant have the goal of wanting to find the halos activate them then ascend to godhood. Killing humans is a secondary goal for them and only exists out of the prophets jelousy of the humans when they found out their "gods" choose humans to be their inheritors.
[QUOTE=P1X3L N1NJA;27279654]Well some of the Alien things are more of references than borrowed ideas. But starship troopers I can see that Halo borrowed a lot from. I think the covenant are unique in the fact they have actual goals, most games or films its just "INVADE EARTH AND KILL THEM FOR SOME REASON" while the covenant have the goal of wanting to find the halos activate them then ascend to godhood. Killing humans is a secondary goal for them and only exists out of the prophets jelousy of the humans when they found out their "gods" choose humans to be their inheritors.[/QUOTE] Plenty of plots involve the antagonists wanting to use a mystical artifact to their own goals, but then realizing that only the [insert favorable trait or species here] are meant to use it, and are usually killed off after trying to kill said [people with favorable trait or species]. And it just so happens that the protagonists are the [people with favorable trait or species]!
[QUOTE=Fire Kracker;27268167]in real life banshees and stuff would probably be like in this trailer [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rxUOdpAliE&has_verified=1[/media] infact everything would look more like in the trailer[/QUOTE] The whole landing is braindead. You essentially need three things to make every single drop successful which were not used. A) You try to not land droppods into the middle of a wide plain where your soldiers can be killed one by one without any form of cover. B) You add some countermeasures to the pods - good example would be 40k which also uses droppods but each of those pods has an onion structure, each layer filled with various countermeasures it sheds as it goes down making it near impossible to shoot them down. C) Goddamnit - you have the tech to make precise droppods which can deliver individual soldiers down to the ground, but you send them into completely dangerous territory where the enemy is waiting for them. Why not send a bunch of smart bombs first to clear the landing area in a square kilometer or more. You do that and your soldiers can easily establish a presence uncontested. Watching the trailer I get Starship Troopers Movie one willies. And it seems they use the same mistakes as permeated the movie. Also both Halo and Mass Effect are basically on one of the most Soft sides of Sci fi Imagineable. They really are far from anything hard.
[QUOTE=wraithcat;27284677]The whole landing is braindead. You essentially need three things to make every single drop successful which were not used. A) You try to not land droppods into the middle of a wide plain where your soldiers can be killed one by one without any form of cover. B) You add some countermeasures to the pods - good example would be 40k which also uses droppods but each of those pods has an onion structure, each layer filled with various countermeasures it sheds as it goes down making it near impossible to shoot them down. C) Goddamnit - you have the tech to make precise droppods which can deliver individual soldiers down to the ground, but you send them into completely dangerous territory where the enemy is waiting for them. Why not send a bunch of smart bombs first to clear the landing area in a square kilometer or more. You do that and your soldiers can easily establish a presence uncontested. Watching the trailer I get Starship Troopers Movie one willies. And it seems they use the same mistakes as permeated the movie. Also both Halo and Mass Effect are basically on one of the most Soft sides of Sci fi Imagineable. They really are far from anything hard.[/QUOTE] Who knows, maybe they AREN'T trying a full scale assault, but just dropping in some ODSTs to bolster a already fucked up situation. Wouldnt that be easier than sending in a pelican/dropship?
I love how almost 90% of the return arguments basically boil down to: "Well fuck you and your logic, they'd just blast us all from orbit lol."
[QUOTE=zpiscool;27285203]I love how almost 90% of the return arguments basically boil down to: "Well fuck you and your logic, they'd just blast us all from orbit lol."[/QUOTE] How is that not logical? If I had the capability too and my troops sucked dick Id do it.
A good example of this entire argument is X-com. Sure, we squishy inferior humans would obliterate the massive alien alliance (a few times over, really), but suffer insurmountable losses and probably ruin the ecosystem to the point of some places being completely unusable. [editline]8th January 2011[/editline] I'm thinking of signing up to Bungie.net just to prove those worthless sods wrong.
[QUOTE=eatdembeanz;27285794] I'm thinking of signing up to Bungie.net just to prove those worthless sods wrong.[/QUOTE] Haha good luck with that, theyre 10 year old morons who bitch with nostalgia goggles on then bitch that the game is broke then they bitch more when something is fixed. Even on Bungies messages on Halo: Reach says come to bungie.net for stats, file share and our "ultra mature" message boards.
[QUOTE=P1X3L N1NJA;27286077]Haha good luck with that, there 10 year old morons who bitch with nostalgia goggles on then bitch that the game is broke then they bitch more when something is fixed. Even on Bungies messages on Halo: Reach says come to bungie.net for stats, file share and our "ultra mature" message boards.[/QUOTE] Pretty much this.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27271514]Tell me what normal human can do this: [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1mPEo47hNk&playnext=1&list=PL245AED06B89B0418&index=17[/url][/QUOTE] Yep, Gordan Freeman is unstoppable. [editline]8th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27271765]And, you know, the fact that they are an immense, multi-dimensional empire. If this is a debate about AI, then I will definitely support the Combine soldier's AI, as it is much better than most make make it out to be. Wrong. They are genetically modified super-soldiers, implanted with Combine technology, and having undergone invasive surgery to strengthen their fighting capabilities. They are then incased in a very thick, full body, airtight protective suit of armour. They are also equipped with highly deadly AR2s.[/QUOTE] Yeah, the only reason the Rebels stood a chance is that they're extremely well motivated and a well motivated army can be much more dangerous than a larger, stronger, and better equipped army. (Example: The American Revolution, where the Americans had very simple training, and horribly equipped armies.)
[QUOTE=wraithcat;27284677]The whole landing is braindead. You essentially need three things to make every single drop successful which were not used. A) You try to not land droppods into the middle of a wide plain where your soldiers can be killed one by one without any form of cover. B) You add some countermeasures to the pods - good example would be 40k which also uses droppods but each of those pods has an onion structure, each layer filled with various countermeasures it sheds as it goes down making it near impossible to shoot them down. C) Goddamnit - you have the tech to make precise droppods which can deliver individual soldiers down to the ground, but you send them into completely dangerous territory where the enemy is waiting for them. Why not send a bunch of smart bombs first to clear the landing area in a square kilometer or more. You do that and your soldiers can easily establish a presence uncontested. Watching the trailer I get Starship Troopers Movie one willies. And it seems they use the same mistakes as permeated the movie. Also both Halo and Mass Effect are basically on one of the most Soft sides of Sci fi Imagineable. They really are far from anything hard.[/QUOTE] no i mean the speed of movement that the things are going at the drop pod things is just to make it look more badass
[QUOTE=eatdembeanz;27271871]I meant in comparison to the Combine invasion forces, you silly skink.[/QUOTE] Once the Combine took over they just reused what was available for their soldiers. Why divert their more powerful forces to deal with a planet they only want for it's resources?
I don't know about you guys but those weapons in ODST sure hurt a fuck of a lot when you're not some super human genetically altered weapon.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27270826]No, we should build a functional sniper crowbar.[/QUOTE] Yes, that's an incredibly dangerous weapon. [editline]8th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Jurikuer;27290266]I don't know about you guys but those weapons in ODST sure hurt a fuck of a lot when you're not some super human genetically altered weapon.[/QUOTE] Or Gordon Freeman. Notice Gordon Freeman is not only powerful but he's so tough that he NEVER cries out in pain. (PAGE 28 IS A LIE) [editline]8th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27270310]A Combine vs. Covenant debate would be much more interesting.[/QUOTE] Yep.
[QUOTE=Maximo13;27196764]I am probably late, but don't Lasguns fire damn fast? Maybe it's the weakest weapon, but it sure fires fast. Add around 100 more soldiers firing those and you got a fast firing laser shotgun.[/QUOTE] A laser that is properly focused at a large wavelength in the infra-red spectrum at let's say 100 watts or so, can create mini plasma explosions as the air at the focus point is ionized. imagine a megawatt laser in the form of a pistol. now imagine those 100 soldiers with these megawatt laser pistols, yeah, bits of singed meat everywhere.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27270310]A Combine vs. Covenant debate would be much more interesting.[/QUOTE] Combine vs. Strogg would be even better
[QUOTE=zombini;27290620]A laser that is properly focused at a large wavelength in the infra-red spectrum at let's say 100 watts or so, can create mini plasma explosions as the air at the focus point is ionized. imagine a megawatt laser in the form of a pistol. now imagine those 100 soldiers with these megawatt laser pistols, yeah, bits of singed meat everywhere.[/QUOTE] Singed meat? I'd say more like exploding meat as the fluids in your tissues turn the vapour and explosively expand. As to combine against strogg. I'd say the combine win due to their far greater manufacturing base. If I recall correctly the strogg more or less have one massive military industrial complex on one planet and just one single planet that probably has a similar output as an imperial world somewhere in the beginnings of hive world status. Not even close to forgeworld. The combine on the other hand can send massive armies trough portals from probably a hew hundred planets across multiple dimensions. The combine against an imperial forgeworld - now that would be far more interesting. We have no idea about combine space fleets but assuming they would have established multiple largescale portals to a forgeworld and were sending large amounts of troops trough them. With the foregeworld sending skiitari, titan and auxilia legions, not to mention the good old traditional armour, artillery etc to go against the combine forces. So all in all, I'dsay a few thousand titans, a couple million skiitari. I'd say the showdown would be interesting.
You people do realize it is a step forward, right? Yes, plasma travels slow, it is ineffective, useless, etc. But do we have the tech to shoot plasma bolts today? No. So therefore the tech is a step forward, although the effectiveness of the weapon may be lost.
[QUOTE=CakeMaster7;27290252]Once the Combine took over they just reused what was available for their soldiers. Why divert their more powerful forces to deal with a planet they only want for it's resources?[/QUOTE] I was explaining to Samiam that the Combine we see in the games is a small, understocked militia force in comparison to the real Combine empire. READING HELPS, KIDDIE KIDDOS.
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