• Why the tech of the Halo Universe is a step backward.
    1,885 replies, posted
[QUOTE=BmB;27394883]Yes, the cliffhanger has nothing to do with it. Halo is obviously a very monetary franchise but money isn't everything here.[/QUOTE] Actually it is. No matter how "different" a company is, it's still working for money and nothing else. Notice Valve suddenly added nanotrasactions to TF2 even though they said before that they don't like that type of thing. Money is money, and that's the only motivation they need.
[QUOTE=CakeMaster7;27397893]Actually it is. No matter how "different" a company is, it's still working for money and nothing else. Notice Valve suddenly added nanotrasactions to TF2 even though they said before that they don't like that type of thing. Money is money, and that's the only motivation they need.[/QUOTE] People seem to fall for it, and buy pixels for 15$ a piece, so why would they not?
[QUOTE=mobrockers;27397924]People seem to fall for it, and buy pixels for 15$ a piece, so why would they not?[/QUOTE] Exactly. A game company will pump out as many games as possible if they know a bunch of people will buy it no matter what. Quality? Who gives a shit about it when a series is popular? It being popular means there's no need for quality.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27390043]If I remember, Halo 3 ended with Chief's ship drifting towards an unknown planet, so if you ask me, the story is far from complete.[/QUOTE] Legendary endings tend to be mysterious, Halo 1's legendary ending had Johnson and a elite hug each other before blowing up on the Ring.
[QUOTE=CakeMaster7;27397893]Actually it is. No matter how "different" a company is, it's still working for money and nothing else. Notice Valve suddenly added nanotrasactions to TF2 even though they said before that they don't like that type of thing. Money is money, and that's the only motivation they need.[/QUOTE] In the case of Valve, it's pretty funny. Valve pumps out free updates, amazing deals, and cheap content for so long, and as soon as they add a feature to get them a little bit of extra money (they are a company after all), everyone gets all butthurt, and starts hating on Valve. Just shows how spoiled people are.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27398198]In the case of Valve, it's pretty funny. Valve pumps out free updates, amazing deals, and cheap content for so long, and as soon as they add a feature to get them a little bit of extra money (they are a company after all), everyone gets all butthurt, and starts hating on Valve. Just shows how spoiled people are.[/QUOTE] It's just that it looks like they couldn't think of any new content anymore, so they make a few hats now and then where you have to grind for even harder, and then suddenly start selling them. It's not like I don't understand, and wouldn't do the same. It just looks so "fuck this lets make something shitty 10 year olds will pay for because I have no idea what else to do anymore".
[QUOTE=Arachnidus;27394959]Yes, but when you read it from the eyes of a Forerunner... [sp]Basically, the main character is brought to the Forerunner capital as part of a trial to take down the old government, which jeopardized the Mantle by constructing the Halo array. Then, all of a sudden, five of the Halos go rogue, the main character's suit gets taken over by MB and shit's hitting the fan. The monitors(like 343GS) go offline, as do the Sentinels, and the Halos begin launching small fighters and support craft to take out the Forerunner fleet. Seven of the Halos escape to the Ark where they are locked down, the other five go off.[/sp][/QUOTE] I would get this book but Ive got too many on my pile to read.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27376718]How about this: 3 Striders vs. One Scarab[/QUOTE] To put it simply - the strider is a horrible horrible and once more horrible design that while looking dangerous is a spindly ball of doom that would die all too quickly to anything with a brain. [QUOTE=P1X3L N1NJA;27390068]Your not getting me here. Your complaining about expanded universe, but making a sequel to a trilogy would be expanded universe because your expanding on something that initially finished. Halo: Reach, ODST and Halo wars are examples of expanded universe. [editline]13th January 2011[/editline] Sorry you dont decide whats canon or not and refusing to accept something is called denial.[/QUOTE] I'd argue that Reach, ODST and Wars are main cannon and in no form a part of the expanded universe. As all games from the official publisher would most likely count as cannon, with supporting content (books, toys, television, whatever else) counting as the expanded universe unless greenlighted by IP owner as main level cannon.
[QUOTE=wraithcat;27400290]To put it simply - the strider is a horrible horrible and once more horrible design that while looking dangerous is a spindly ball of doom that would die all too quickly to anything with a brain.[/QUOTE] But the Strider looks epic! [editline]13th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27398198]In the case of Valve, it's pretty funny. Valve pumps out free updates, amazing deals, and cheap content for so long, and as soon as they add a feature to get them a little bit of extra money (they are a company after all), everyone gets all butthurt, and starts hating on Valve. Just shows how spoiled people are.[/QUOTE] Yeah, but this actually effects gameplay. It takes me a month or two to get all the new items that some other player BOUGHT and received in a few seconds. TALK ABOUT UNFAIR!
[QUOTE=wraithcat;27400290]To put it simply - the strider is a horrible horrible and once more horrible design that while looking dangerous is a spindly ball of doom that would die all too quickly to anything with a brain.[/QUOTE] But the Scarab is even more of a horrible design. It moves VERY slowly, and is relatively easy to get in to and fuck up, considering its easy to enter bridge, and the bridge being incredibly easy to control or destroy (along with it being relatively unguarded inside and covered, beyond a couple Elites and a few Grunts). All it takes is a Strider to blow out the "knees" while dodging the single, slow-firing weapon and obliterating the cadre of soldiers on top of it.
[QUOTE=eatdembeanz;27403568]But the Scarab is even more of a horrible design. It moves VERY slowly, and is relatively easy to get in to and fuck up, considering its easy to enter bridge, and the bridge being incredibly easy to control or destroy (along with it being relatively unguarded inside and covered, beyond a couple Elites and a few Grunts). All it takes is a Strider to blow out the "knees" while dodging the single, slow-firing weapon and obliterating the cadre of soldiers on top of it.[/QUOTE] Keep in mind the way plasma works IRL(more in universe, non-game). If a Scarab marched in the middle of a city, it could easily destroy, if not utterly vaporize, major emplacements, and possibly even ground units. The reason they're not good for combat in any other sense, except for as mechanized siege engines or support, is because they were originally mining craft converted to exosuits by the Hunters.
I just have to say that I love this thread. Discussions about fictional technology and history fascinates me for some reason (must be why I love sci-fi and fantasy books), and the amount of stupid in this thread has been minimal. The amount of fanboy-ism has also been minimal, which is rare on the internet. I am a fan of the Halo games, but I lament the fact that they are so devoid of good story. The overarching story is there of course, but they could have done so much more. What they did in Reach was perfect, yet not enough. Loved the ending though, which is how I wish Halo 3 had ended. I am also one of those who love the books. They paint the Spartans in a somewhat more realistic light. John is also fleshed out more, making him more into a person than just a faceless grunt. I am sure people will argue with that, but he is more fleshed out. You sometimes have to read between the lines to see it, but it is there, and it all makes sense when you think about the whole "being trained to be a killing machine after being kidnapped at an age of 8" Keep on the good discussion guys! And yes, the Combine would most likely obliterate the Covenant in an all out war. But would they stand against them in space? What are the Combines resources there? As I said, I love learning about stuff like this.
What I'd like to see is a comic/book/game that focuses on the normal grassmowers, the UNSC Army and Marines. I can only imagine the UNSC vs Covenant ground engagement in open field, where UNSC brings everything they fucking got on the covies.
[QUOTE=CakeMaster7;27397893]Actually it is. No matter how "different" a company is, it's still working for money and nothing else. Notice Valve suddenly added nanotrasactions to TF2 even though they said before that they don't like that type of thing. Money is money, and that's the only motivation they need.[/QUOTE] I can't believe there are people this dumb. Money is indeed money. But art is also art. [editline]14th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Durandir;27405960]I just have to say that I love this thread. Discussions about fictional technology and history fascinates me for some reason (must be why I love sci-fi and fantasy books), and the amount of stupid in this thread has been minimal. The amount of fanboy-ism has also been minimal, which is rare on the internet. I am a fan of the Halo games, but I lament the fact that they are so devoid of good story. The overarching story is there of course, but they could have done so much more. What they did in Reach was perfect, yet not enough. Loved the ending though, which is how I wish Halo 3 had ended. I am also one of those who love the books. They paint the Spartans in a somewhat more realistic light. John is also fleshed out more, making him more into a person than just a faceless grunt. I am sure people will argue with that, but he is more fleshed out. You sometimes have to read between the lines to see it, but it is there, and it all makes sense when you think about the whole "being trained to be a killing machine after being kidnapped at an age of 8" Keep on the good discussion guys! And yes, the Combine would most likely obliterate the Covenant in an all out war. But would they stand against them in space? What are the Combines resources there? As I said, I love learning about stuff like this.[/QUOTE] Considering the Combine don't even appear to have space travel I'm beginning to think the whole multidimensional thing means one planet per universe. [editline]14th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Arachnidus;27403834]Keep in mind the way plasma works IRL(more in universe, non-game). If a Scarab marched in the middle of a city, it could easily destroy, if not utterly vaporize, major emplacements, and possibly even ground units. The reason they're not good for combat in any other sense, except for as mechanized siege engines or support, is because they were originally mining craft converted to exosuits by the Hunters.[/QUOTE] I don't know, they're big, armored, very inaccessible unless they are conveniently standing below a bridge and there is a Spartan/action hero up top... incredibly maneuverable. If they used actual tactics instead of prancing around that thing would probably decimate just about anything on the ground. But I can see why they'd prance around, because as is lamented when you first meet it in Halo 2, the thing is practically invulnerable.
[QUOTE=BmB;27406343] Considering the Combine don't even appear to have space travel I'm beginning to think the whole multidimensional thing means one planet per universe. [/QUOTE] You do realize that Half-life is set in world that is sometimes dictated by real-life theoretical physics. and in Real-life theoretical physics without the use of a wormhole or an intermediary dimension multi-million light year travel would take eons upon eons, The combine are a multidimensional empire that spans galaxies. Earth is just a new acquisition and in the eyes of the combine not that great of a priority. It's like when the British empire descended on small islands with tribal natives. More dubious Halo tech: -Dat energy sword man. Generating a constant stream of high-density, high-energy plasma [B]and[/B] keeping it formed in shape would take massive amounts of energy, not to mention to keep plasma formed you need massively strong magnetic fields. [B]BUT[/B] let's assume the little bar has what it takes to keep it powered and formed in the familiar sword shape, Whoever wields it is now the easiest target to hit, ever. Every single ferromagnetic object (that includes bullets) will be aattracted to you.
Considering that when you go to the future, things have been improved upon, I wouldn't consider Halo a step backwards, I would consider it wrong and I would consider it a game and fictional product. There is no argument over something that does not exist, or that we have not seen in our lifetimes, because we cannot actively study the variables.
[QUOTE=PunchedInFac;27406820]You do realize that Half-life is set in world that is sometimes dictated by real-life theoretical physics. and in Real-life theoretical physics without the use of a wormhole or an intermediary dimension multi-million light year travel would take eons upon eons, The combine are a multidimensional empire that spans galaxies. Earth is just a new acquisition and in the eyes of the combine not that great of a priority. It's like when the British empire descended on small islands with tribal natives. More dubious Halo tech: -Dat energy sword man. Generating a constant stream of high-density, high-energy plasma [B]and[/B] keeping it formed in shape would take massive amounts of energy, not to mention to keep plasma formed you need massively strong magnetic fields. [B]BUT[/B] let's assume the little bar has what it takes to keep it powered and formed in the familiar sword shape, Whoever wields it is now the easiest target to hit, ever. Every single ferromagnetic object (that includes bullets) will be aattracted to you.[/QUOTE] The "plasma" isn't actually plasma. It's Forerunner magic. The Forerunners were so advanced their tech is incomprehensible and essentially, impossible. Any sufficiently advanced etc. And Half-Life what try and get that dick out of your ear. The Combine don't seem to have space travel. They come from another universe entirely. I'm beginning to think they have conquered like one planet per universe they travelled to. It's only Black Mesa that developed the in-universe teleportation with the Xen relay.
[QUOTE=BmB;27406906]The "plasma" isn't actually plasma. It's Forerunner magic. The Forerunners were so advanced their tech is incomprehensible and essentially, impossible. Any sufficiently advanced etc. And Half-Life what try and get that dick out of your ear. The Combine don't seem to have space travel. They come from another universe entirely. I'm beginning to think they have conquered like one planet per universe they travelled to. It's only Black Mesa that developed the in-universe teleportation with the Xen relay.[/QUOTE] They [I]do[/I] have teleportation technology, only it is very inefficient, requires alot of energy (even by their standards), and is also highly unstable. Also the energy sword was created by the sangheili. not the forrunners.
It's still based on Forerunner tech. Also listen to mossman next time. Their teleport is big and clumsy, and [i]only works between universes.[/i]
Yeah, from what I remember about the Combine now it seems they only travel between dimensions. Which means they might be from an alternate Earth? Probably not. Hope all of that becomes more clear as the series goes on... in five to ten years. Also, we need a Halo/Half-Life cross-over. Imagine, Flood infected Striders. I am sure there is enough bio-material for the Flood to take it over. Or Flood infected Headcrab zombies :v:
They probably only use the big, clunky inter-dimensional teleporter for scouting parties and such, and have a fleet with light-speed travel for invasions for conquering planets more traditionally. I'm sure one of the hundred or so global populations they assimilated or eradicated had some sort of light-speed space travel which they could use in their ship design.
[QUOTE=BmB;27406343]I can't believe there are people this dumb. Money is indeed money. But art is also art. [/QUOTE] Are you implying that Halo is art? If you were talking about something like Half-Life, Mass Effect, or Bioshock, then yes, they are art. But Halo? [QUOTE] Considering the Combine don't even appear to have space travel I'm beginning to think the whole multidimensional thing means one planet per universe.[/QUOTE] Now that is just a wild assumption. Let's look at the story. According to Marc Laidlaw, the Combine kicked the Nihilanth and the Vorts out of their home dimension; no, they couldn't hide anywhere else in their galaxy, but they were actually kicked out of their DIMENSION, and forced to Xen. This would suggest that the Combine are pretty powerful, and far-reaching. Of course, we don't know for sure, but Earth is widely implied to be a tiny, unimportant planet in comparison to the Combine. This, again, would suggest that they are very large and powerful. Maybe some dimensions are small, with only one planet, but maybe others are as large as the one we are in. [QUOTE] I don't know, they're big, armored, very inaccessible unless they are conveniently standing below a bridge and there is a Spartan/action hero up top... incredibly maneuverable. If they used actual tactics instead of prancing around that thing would probably decimate just about anything on the ground. But I can see why they'd prance around, because as is lamented when you first meet it in Halo 2, the thing is practically invulnerable.[/QUOTE] Except... it would be toast to an airstrike, or a few missiles. Also, how hard would it be to land several choppers on the Scarab, and deploy troops to take out the generator?
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27408254]Are you implying that Halo is art? If you were talking about something like Half-Life, Mass Effect, or Bioshock, then yes, they are art. But Halo? [/QUOTE] Ok now you're just blind hating.
[QUOTE=P1X3L N1NJA;27408333]Ok now you're just blind hating.[/QUOTE] There's a difference between liking games such as Halo and Call of Duty and heralding them as steps forward in the genre. They are good insofar as what they do. But what they do is very little. I do not appreciate those who fail to differentiate between liking a game and believing they are significant steps forward when most of them are not. It sets terribly mundane standards in the industry and it forces true innovation - that which exists beyond the readily identifiable - to stagnate.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27408344]There's a difference between liking games such as Halo and Call of Duty and heralding them as steps forward in the genre. They are good insofar as what they do. But what they do is very little. I do not appreciate those who fail to differentiate between liking a game and believing they are significant steps forward when most of them are not. It sets terribly mundane standards in the industry and it forces true innovation - that which exists beyond the readily identifiable - to stagnate.[/QUOTE] Lets go back to 2001 shall we, how many other FPS's were as good as Halo and how many had just as many features that worked as well as Halo. It set the standard of what an FPS needs to excel to gain popularity. Halo and the Xbox made console FPS's worth playing.
[QUOTE=P1X3L N1NJA;27408425]Lets go back to 2001 shall we, how many other FPS's were as good as Halo and how many had just as many features that worked as well as Halo. It set the standard of what an FPS needs to excel to gain popularity. Halo and the Xbox made console FPS's worth playing.[/QUOTE] Like I said earlier, the first Halo may have set the standard ON CONSOLES, but above that, they didn't do much. The story wasn't particularly deep, or though provoking. It may have been good for it's time, but not so much anymore. The combat is also pretty shallow. The Halo series has reached the point where there is nothing more to add, therefore the developers pump out the same monotonous crap, with better graphics. Look at Halo 3, and ODST.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27408512]Like I said earlier, the first Halo may have set the standard ON CONSOLES, but above that, they didn't do much. The story wasn't particularly deep, or though provoking. It may have been good for it's time, but not so much anymore. The combat is also pretty shallow. The Halo series has reached the point where there is nothing more to add, therefore the developers pump out the same monotonous crap, with better graphics. Look at Halo 3, and ODST.[/QUOTE] Well I play Halo for the story so what you just said there is completely redundent to me.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27408254]Are you implying that Halo is art? If you were talking about something like Half-Life, Mass Effect, or Bioshock, then yes, they are art. But Halo? Now that is just a wild assumption. Let's look at the story. According to Marc Laidlaw, the Combine kicked the Nihilanth and the Vorts out of their home dimension; no, they couldn't hide anywhere else in their galaxy, but they were actually kicked out of their DIMENSION, and forced to Xen. This would suggest that the Combine are pretty powerful, and far-reaching. Of course, we don't know for sure, but Earth is widely implied to be a tiny, unimportant planet in comparison to the Combine. This, again, would suggest that they are very large and powerful. Maybe some dimensions are small, with only one planet, but maybe others are as large as the one we are in. Except... it would be toast to an airstrike, or a few missiles. Also, how hard would it be to land several choppers on the Scarab, and deploy troops to take out the generator?[/QUOTE] A few of what kind of missiles exactly, ICBMS? You'd need a tank battalion to take one down with direct fire. If not more. The thing is it's nigh invulnerable. [editline]14th January 2011[/editline] And honestly. Halo set standards for all FPS's. Remember Halo 2 and recharging health? Yeah never seen that since. [editline]14th January 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27408254]Now that is just a wild assumption. Let's look at the story. According to Marc Laidlaw, the Combine kicked the Nihilanth and the Vorts out of their home dimension; no, they couldn't hide anywhere else in their galaxy, but they were actually kicked out of their DIMENSION, and forced to Xen. This would suggest that the Combine are pretty powerful, and far-reaching. Of course, we don't know for sure, but Earth is widely implied to be a tiny, unimportant planet in comparison to the Combine. This, again, would suggest that they are very large and powerful. Maybe some dimensions are small, with only one planet, but maybe others are as large as the one we are in.[/QUOTE] What kind of assumption? There's nothing to indicate they have any kind of space travel at all. The Vorts could have been kicked out of a 5 sqkm island in the middle of an endless sea and still have been kicked out of the whole universe. Overwatch, the combined forces of earth are completely incapable of shooting down a rocket without a ground attack. Why would they be able to even travel inside a planetary system.
[QUOTE=BmB;27409675]A few of what kind of missiles exactly, ICBMS? You'd need a tank battalion to take one down with direct fire. If not more. The thing is it's nigh invulnerable. [/QUOTE] Unless they send soldiers to infiltrate it. Which really wouldn't be that hard. I'm no military expert, but I'm pretty sure they could take it down with, say, a predator missile. [QUOTE] And honestly. Halo set standards for all FPS's. Remember Halo 2 and recharging health? Yeah never seen that since. [/QUOTE] Regenerating health. What an amazing innovation :rolleyes: What else is there? Can you honestly deny that Halo has shallow, repetitive combat and level design? Halo is a fun multiplayer game, and it's campaign is nice for people who want to mindlessly shoot aliens. But it doesn't go much farther than that. The story is better than most, but still not very deep, or thought-provoking, especially compared to the likes of Half-Life. [QUOTE] What kind of assumption? There's nothing to indicate they have any kind of space travel at all. The Vorts could have been kicked out of a 5 sqkm island in the middle of an endless sea and still have been kicked out of the whole universe. Overwatch, the combined forces of earth are completely incapable of shooting down a rocket without a ground attack. Why would they be able to even travel inside a planetary system.[/QUOTE] I'd think, if an empire is capable of inter-dimensional travel, AND is capable of teleporting several hundred (at least) citadels in a short amount of time, they would have at least mastered basic space combat.
[QUOTE=ChosenOne54;27410398]Unless they send soldiers to infiltrate it. Which really wouldn't be that hard. I'm no military expert, but I'm pretty sure they could take it down with, say, a predator missile. [/QUOTE] Nope, predator missles aren't destructive as everyone seems to make out. Maybe a bunker buster but not a predator. Also a helicopter on the top is not an option as they have an anti aircraft gun on the top, you would have to take out that and the 2 side gunners if you want any chance of boarding otherwise it would be a blood bath. As stupid as it sounds a safer way would be to go under it and use a grappling hook and climb through the back.
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