• Why about all current online fps have nothing to do with skill.
    77 replies, posted
Op makes no sense... [editline]01:42PM[/editline] [QUOTE=ghosevil;24497317]I agree. Anyone can hold down the fire button - the skill lies in one's ability to manipulate and predict the recoil to land shots on a target.[/QUOTE] you also need to know where your target is, is going to be where you are where your team is where your next target is are you in adequate cover? have you camped too long? sniped...
[QUOTE=CyberWatt;24497344]Op makes no sense... [editline]01:42PM[/editline] you also need to know where your target is, is going to be where you are where your team is where your next target is are you in adequate cover? have you camped too long? sniped...[/QUOTE] commendations to the sniper for saving his squad mate. durr. [editline]04:44PM[/editline] most people can do all that in less than a second, what are you whining about?
[QUOTE=Pj The Dj;24494590]You could consider compensating for your guns unpredictability to be skill too.[/QUOTE] You should know your effective range. Then you can own all those bitches too. If anything lowering that range introduces more "skill" than "lol i headshot u nob."
I don't understand bullet spread. Bullets fly straight with the barrel (with a really, really minimal cone), and always do. I understand recoil throwing your aim off, but in most games you seem to hold you gun perfectly straight, but the bullets are curving around. It's like firing a paintball gun. [img]http://a.imageshack.us/img831/5770/thefuckd.png[/img] (assuming there is no recoil, at all)
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24497609]I don't understand bullet spread. Bullets fly straight with the barrel (with a really, really minimal cone), and always do. I understand recoil throwing your aim off, but in most games you seem to hold you gun perfectly straight, but the bullets are curving around. It's like firing a paintball gun. [img_thumb]http://a.imageshack.us/img831/5770/thefuckd.png[/img_thumb] (assuming there is no recoil, at all)[/QUOTE] shh you will upset the cod kids.
[QUOTE=Morphus;24491793]Most developers make a balanced game so it'll sell effectively and they get good reviews from critics, but there's always a skilled player in a game. I understand where you're coming from, I've had the same shit in Bad Company 2 where you get some twat who will blast you with a GOL constantly, but the helicopter in BC2 for example requires [B][U]skill[/U][/B] to fly. Exactly.[/QUOTE] What do you mean BC2? BC2 is everything you ever wanted. You can snipe people with [i]every weapon[/i]. Including the fucking machineguns.
The OP really needs to play TF2 sometime and then get back to us.
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24497609]I don't understand bullet spread. Bullets fly straight with the barrel (with a really, really minimal cone), and always do. I understand recoil throwing your aim off, but in most games you seem to hold you gun perfectly straight, but the bullets are curving around. It's like firing a paintball gun. (assuming there is no recoil, at all)[/QUOTE] Having random numbers dictate the spread is probably much easier to make than the gun model actually swaying around and not pointing at the middle of the screen, and gives you the same kind of thing.
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24497609]I don't understand bullet spread. Bullets fly straight with the barrel (with a really, really minimal cone), and always do. I understand recoil throwing your aim off, but in most games you seem to hold you gun perfectly straight, but the bullets are curving around. It's like firing a paintball gun. [img]http://a.imageshack.us/img831/5770/thefuckd.png[/img] (assuming there is no recoil, at all)[/QUOTE] Don't get me started... [img]http://imageshack.dk/imagesfree/pPC88431.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=Doomish;24497723]The OP really needs to play TF2 sometime and then get back to us.[/QUOTE] -snip- Sorry that was bad reading on my part. The guns in tf2 have very little spread, only the shotguns, miniguns etc., even then aim is one of the more important things in TF2 along with Teamwork, coordination, etc.
[QUOTE=MegaJohnny;24497911]Having random numbers dictate the spread is probably much easier to make than the gun model actually swaying around and not pointing at the middle of the screen, and gives you the same kind of thing.[/QUOTE] Do you even know what you're talking about? Please read what you just said for me and realize it's wrong. [img]http://a.imageshack.us/img85/6349/thefuckyoutalkingabout.png[/img] (If fig.1 is a gun shaking during fire)
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24497609]I don't understand bullet spread. Bullets fly straight with the barrel (with a really, really minimal cone), and always do. I understand recoil throwing your aim off, but in most games you seem to hold you gun perfectly straight, but the bullets are curving around. It's like firing a paintball gun. [img]http://a.imageshack.us/img831/5770/thefuckd.png[/img] (assuming there is no recoil, at all)[/QUOTE] In Counter Strike, its like having a barrel pointing in a 45º angle
I like how Arma not only has the gun actually pointing where you aim, but also simulates inaccuracy with a swaying gun. Plus if you have the crosshair enabled you can see where you're aiming at as well as exactly where the gun is actually pointing.
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24498315]Do you even know what you're talking about? Please read what you just said for me and realize it's wrong.[/QUOTE] I don't see the problem. You say guns in real life shoot bullets straight from the barrel. And that guns in the game have bullets going everywhere, despite that this isn't represented in the model of the gun. What I'm saying is I don't think a small detail like that matters.
I think it matters a lot. The gun model isn't just there to tell you what weapon you are using. It's there to immerse you into the role of the gunman, if you can't look at it and see where you're aiming, it might as well not be there. Is it there to be pretty? Why not just have a pretty icon then, at least that would confuse nobody. You should be able to tell by how steady the gun is how accurate you will be. Intuitive, natural stuff.
[QUOTE=MegaJohnny;24498540]I don't see the problem. You say guns in real life shoot bullets straight from the barrel. And that guns in the game have bullets going everywhere, despite that this isn't represented in the model of the gun. What I'm saying is I don't think a small detail like that matters.[/QUOTE] It's not a small detail. If guns actually had their shots go where they were suppose to, sure, shooters would be a lot slower, but it'd have more strategy then camping a corner or ramboing the site. It's not a small detail, it's something developers have been ignoring for years, with the exclusion of games like ARMA II
[QUOTE=BmB;24498727]I think it matters a lot. The gun model isn't just there to tell you what weapon you are using. It's there to immerse you into the role of the gunman, if you can't look at it and see where you're aiming, it might as well not be there. Is it there to be pretty? Why not just have a pretty icon then, at least that would confuse nobody. You should be able to tell by how steady the gun is how accurate you will be. Intuitive, natural stuff.[/QUOTE] Yes, it'd be silly if you couldn't see the gun you were holding. But I don't look at the gun model much, I want to look at the middle of the screen where the bad guys are. You can use how big the crosshair is to tell how much spread you have. Isn't that intuitive? It's small at first, bigger when you're running and suddenly gets bigger when you shoot. That shouldn't take too long to figure out that you have lots of spread when the crosshair is big and accurate shooting when the crosshair is small.
Zesty, do not forgot Insurgency. If you aimed without the sight you would have shot in the direction the gun was pointing, at least from what i've played
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24498736]It's not a small detail. If guns actually had their shots go where they were suppose to, sure, shooters would be a lot slower, but it'd have more strategy then camping a corner or ramboing the site. It's not a small detail, it's something developers have been ignoring for years, with the exclusion of games like ARMA II[/QUOTE] Maybe people like their shooters fast. Something like Cod is nice and easy to pick up and play, full of explodey action.
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24498736]It's not a small detail. If guns actually had their shots go where they were suppose to, sure, shooters would be a lot slower, but it'd have more strategy then camping a corner or ramboing the site. It's not a small detail, it's something developers have been ignoring for years, with the exclusion of games like ARMA II[/QUOTE] It's not about camping or ramboing its about knowing when to camp and when to rambo. Most games handle ballistics well enough and you can't say it makes the game too easy or w/e the op is saying about skill. I don't know what this argument is about really I can kill snipers from across the map in MW2 with an M16
[QUOTE=CyberWatt;24499347]It's not about camping or ramboing its about knowing when to camp and when to rambo. Most games handle ballistics well enough and you can't say it makes the game too easy or w/e the op is saying about skill. I don't know what this argument is about really I can kill snipers from across the map in MW2 with an M16[/QUOTE] Most games don't have ballistics, it's just a instant kill/hurt lazer where ever the bullet goes from gun to point for .1 of a second. [editline]03:01PM[/editline] [QUOTE=MegaJohnny;24499024]Maybe people like their shooters fast. Something like Cod is nice and easy to pick up and play, full of explodey action.[/QUOTE] But there's enough of those games. We could have stopped with CoD2/4 and BF2.
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24499554]Most games don't have ballistics, it's just a instant kill/hurt lazer where ever the bullet goes from gun to point for .1 of a second. [editline]03:01PM[/editline] But there's enough of those games. We could have stopped with CoD2/4 and BF2.[/QUOTE] Also known as 'hitscan'. Strictly speaking, bullets aren't physical at all (and the tracers are actually just a particle effect for looking fancy). You shoot, they hit. Some games have delayed hitscan based upon distance which may make the bullets seem physical but they really aren't. And of course all the fancy coding for surface penetration and all that. I'm not sure which games have actual physical bullets anymore, though. Needless to say, very few have guns as accurate as they are in real-life, for the sake of balance (funnier still when the game claims to be realistic).
That's the one thing I'm not excited about in reach, they're moving away from Halo 3's excellent ballistics and going to hitscan. Bah.
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24497609] [img]http://a.imageshack.us/img831/5770/thefuckd.png[/img] (assuming there is no recoil, at all)[/QUOTE] that isn't true at all. transitional ballistics are way more complicated than that, gas flies into every direction and it depends on barrel size, caliber, muzzle velocity. rifles are the ones that are designed for accuracy and even then it's not a 100%
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24497609]I don't understand bullet spread. Bullets fly straight with the barrel (with a really, really minimal cone), and always do. I understand recoil throwing your aim off, but in most games you seem to hold you gun perfectly straight, but the bullets are curving around. It's like firing a paintball gun. [img_THUMB]http://a.imageshack.us/img831/5770/thefuckd.png[/img_THUMB] (assuming there is no recoil, at all)[/QUOTE] [img]http://localhostr.com/files/94e2bc/STALKERSPREAD.png[/img]
[QUOTE=ZestyLemons;24499554]But there's enough of those games. We could have stopped with CoD2/4 and BF2.[/QUOTE] More vehicular slow paced shooters would be nice. But as long as there's a demand for these fast paced explodey games, people are going to make them. Is it me or is the discussion starting to derail?
In the Medal of Honour beta all weapons had pinpoint accuracy and little recoil. The developers stated they would increase recoil for the PC version but I don't imagine it getting too high. Grenades and noobtubes had small blast radii and there were few vehicles. I enjoyed the emphasis on skill rather than spam. Perhaps you guys wanting a more skill-based shooter should look into it.
[QUOTE=BmB;24499717]That's the one thing I'm not excited about in reach, they're moving away from Halo 3's excellent ballistics and going to hitscan. Bah.[/QUOTE] Perhaps it will actually be good for once.
[QUOTE=roflcakes;24499884][img]http://localhostr.com/files/94e2bc/STALKERSPREAD.png[/img][/QUOTE] Oh god I hope thats not true... I just bought the damn game and I hate games like that :ohdear:
[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v601/Avary/Less%20Public/Facepunch%20stuff/STALKERSPREAD.png[/IMG]
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.