• Pack Of Cigarettes 'May Rise To $100' In NZ
    281 replies, posted
an so begins world prohibition part 3
[QUOTE=yawmwen;35691535]Well then the price of McDonalds, Alcohol, Bread, and Automobiles should be raised as well, because all of those things contribute to health problems and cost the government money. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] You know...I never seen Hoodoo post yet he/she rates absolutely everything. I'm thinking Hoodoo is a fictional user.[/QUOTE] All of those things have the potential to be incorporated into a healthy lifestyle and have various benefits, smoking has no benefits whatsoever to human beings, zero. It's not exactly a grey area
[QUOTE=reedbo;35699425]Your so called 'right to breath clean air' also happens to interfere with that man's 'right to smoke in public'. Get over yourself and ask him politely to leave or leave yourself.[/QUOTE] Except that I don't bother anyone when I stand there breathing clean air, unlike the smoker. And if we're both waiting for the same bus on the same bus stop, neither of us is going to leave. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] There are many things that are illegal to do in public, that are not illegal to do at home. I don't understand why smoking shouldn't be one of them. At least it's already illegal to smoke in bars and restaurants. Thank god for that.
[QUOTE=RO;35699754]All of those things have the potential to be incorporated into a healthy lifestyle and have various benefits, smoking has no benefits whatsoever to human beings, zero. It's not exactly a grey area[/QUOTE] Actually smoking over short periods of time with a great deal of self control can help with weight loss. Provided you have the willpower to curb the addictive effects, it speeds up your metabolism and shrinks appetite. If you can manage to quit following weight-loss, maintain the exercise regimen and avoid returning to old dietary habits, you can keep that weight off. The risk-factors (particularly cancer) of smoking are mitigated fairly quickly if you quit quickly and don't start again. Granted it's a difficult thing to do, but so is incorporating McDonalds and Alcohol into a healthy lifestyle. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Jack Trades;35699834]Except that I don't bother anyone when I stand there breathing clean air, unlike the smoker. And if we're both waiting for the same bus on the same bus stop, neither of us is going to leave. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] There are many things that are illegal to do in public, that are not illegal to do at home. I don't understand why smoking shouldn't be one of them. At least it's already illegal to smoke in bars and restaurants. Thank god for that.[/QUOTE] Sorry I didn't realize we legislated based upon what bothers you.
[QUOTE=Lankist;35699873]Actually smoking over short periods of time with a great deal of self control can help with weight loss. Provided you have the willpower to curb the addictive effects, it speeds up your metabolism and shrinks appetite. If you can manage to quit following weight-loss, maintain the exercise regimen and avoid returning to old dietary habits, you can keep that weight off. The risk-factors (particularly cancer) of smoking are mitigated fairly quickly if you quit quickly and don't start again. Granted it's a difficult thing to do, but so is incorporating McDonalds and Alcohol into a healthy lifestyle. [/QUOTE] Mcdonalds yes, but alcohol is quite easy to do, drinking a glass a day can help prevent heart problems.
[QUOTE=carcarcargo;35700037]Mcdonalds yes, but alcohol is quite easy to do, drinking a glass a day can help prevent heart problems.[/QUOTE] That's old research. Glass of wine a day veers on the unhealthy. It's closer to once a week, if I recall. And if it's enough to get recognizably buzzed, it's too much.
[QUOTE=Lankist;35700050]That's old research. Glass of wine a day veers on the unhealthy. It's closer to once a week, if I recall. And if it's enough to get recognizably buzzed, it's too much.[/QUOTE] Old? I saw one from march this year making a similar claim about alcohol being good for people who've suffered heart attacks. In what way is it seen as unhealthy?
[QUOTE=Lankist;35699873] Sorry I didn't realize we legislated based upon what bothers you.[/QUOTE] Because the majority smokes and/or likes the smell of smoke, amrite?
[QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700184]Because the majority smokes and/or likes the smell of smoke, amrite?[/QUOTE] yeah fuck the minority!!!!!!!!
[QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700184]Because the majority smokes and/or likes the smell of smoke, amrite?[/QUOTE] yeah fuck those goddamn minorities man We should also declare national religions because man fuck those bothersome minorities
[QUOTE=Trogdon;35700199]yeah fuck the minority!!!!!!!![/QUOTE] You're right, we should legalize masturbation and sex in public. People should have rights to do whatever they want to. Who cares if this bothers anyone. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] We should also legalize racial hate speeches in public. Because who cares if it bothers anyone, amrite?
[QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700322]You're right, we should legalize masturbation and sex in public. People should have rights to do whatever they want to. Who cares if this bothers anyone.[/QUOTE] oh i forgot masturbation and sex in public is equal to smoking i also forgot it's currently legal and large industry that generates a lot of income for industries boy am i forgetful
[QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700322]You're right, we should legalize masturbation and sex in public. People should have rights to do whatever they want to. Who cares if this bothers anyone. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] We should also legalize racial hate speeches in public. Because who cares if it bothers anyone, amrite?[/QUOTE] Racial hate speeches ARE legal, at very least they are in America. Speech is a victimless crime. And why NOT legalize public nudity? Who is the victim there? Who do you think you are to act like the victim because you saw shit that you know exists, have seen before, but for pseudo-religious reasons find uncomfortable to witness? Who are you to impose your shame upon the world?
[QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700322]You're right, we should legalize masturbation and sex in public. People should have rights to do whatever they want to. Who cares if this bothers anyone. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] We should also legalize racial hate speeches in public. Because who cares if it bothers anyone, amrite?[/QUOTE] this is one of the worst arguments ive ever seen on fp. be ashamed of yourself mr 'jack trades'
[QUOTE=Tacosheller;35690841]I uh Don't care if people fuck up their lungs, that's their choice??[/QUOTE] I care if they fuck up my lungs though, second hand smoke is far worse
[QUOTE=viperfan7;35700403]I care if they fuck up my lungs though, second hand smoke is far worse[/QUOTE] Then feel free to take them to court when you develop a condition with direct association to your breathing some smoke thirty years prior. It's not as though air pollutants already permeate metropolitan areas. Western society does not punish people for what MIGHT happen. Western justice is not preventative justice, it is reconciliatory justice. We try people after something bad happens, not before. Simply put, you aren't worried about your health in the future. You're worried about your comfort in the present. And the law does not provide for your comfort.
[QUOTE=Trogdon;35700345]oh i forgot masturbation and sex in public is equal to smoking[/QUOTE] It's something that some people do for kicks but the majority finds disgusting. How is that not similar?
[QUOTE=viperfan7;35700403]I care if they fuck up my lungs though, second hand smoke is far worse[/QUOTE] second hand smoke in equal amounts is worse as if somehow you inhale all of the smoke the did when they smoke. it's not in an amount enough to do anything to you, and like lankist said we have far worse problems in our air.
[QUOTE=Bobie;35700383]this is one of the worst arguments ive ever seen on fp. be ashamed of yourself mr 'jack trades'[/QUOTE] No need to counter the argument.
[QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700434]It's something that some people do for kicks but the majority finds disgusting. How is that not similar?[/QUOTE] if i have to explain how they are different it's not worth discussing
[QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700434]It's something that some people do for kicks but the majority finds disgusting. How is that not similar?[/QUOTE] The majority of people find gay pride parades to be disgusting. The majority can go eat a dick. Majority does not rule in a republican system of governance.
[QUOTE=Trogdon;35700345]oh i forgot masturbation and sex in public is equal to smoking i also forgot it's currently legal and large industry that generates a lot of income for industries boy am i forgetful[/QUOTE] Masturbation and sex in public are probably less harmful to people in public places, but since smoking outside poses very little risk I don't see the point in complaining about it.
[QUOTE=Lankist;35700463]The majority of people find gay pride parades to be disgusting.[/QUOTE] Ughh, in America, maybe. In Sweden I have never met a single homophobe yet.
[QUOTE=carcarcargo;35700467]Masturbation and sex in public are probably less harmful to people in public places, but since smoking outside poses very little risk I don't see the point in complaining about it.[/QUOTE] But you can't really use that in support of banning smoking indoors. That's a choice that the establishment in question makes. There are plenty of restaurants, bars, apartment complexes, etc. that disallow smoking. MOST of those places DO disallow smoking. You cannot turn around and tell the few places that don't to go fuck themselves because they don't know what's good for them. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700481]Ughh, in America, maybe. In Sweden I have never met a single homophobe yet.[/QUOTE] Replace "gays" with "gypsies" or "muslims" and you've got your European equivalent. Semantics. There are people your people hate, and by your logic they should be disenfranchised.
[QUOTE=carcarcargo;35700467]Masturbation and sex in public are probably less harmful to people in public places, but since smoking outside poses very little risk I don't see the point in complaining about it.[/QUOTE] well socially masturbation and sex in public would be more offensive to people, but i don't really care about that. my point is that smoking is not offensive, it's not harmful to others in an open air space, it's already legal, it's good capitalist business (America's #2 export!, not supporting the industry just the economy gained from it), and policing the decisions of other people is harmful. there is no reason for smoking to become illegal just because it's harmful, and putting a huge price on cigarettes is going to be awful to smokers because they will still pay that premium, thus perpetuating economical inequality.
[QUOTE=Lankist;35700495] Replace "gays" with "gypsies" or "muslims" and you've got your European equivalent. Semantics. There are people your people hate, and by your logic they should be disenfranchised.[/QUOTE] Either way, gay parades do not do any physical harm to other human beings.
[QUOTE=Lankist;35700495]But you can't really use that in support of banning smoking indoors. That's a choice that the establishment in question makes. There are plenty of restaurants, bars, apartment complexes, etc. that disallow smoking. MOST of those places DO disallow smoking. You cannot turn around and tell the few places that don't to go fuck themselves because they don't know what's good for them.[/QUOTE] What about staff who work their but have no choice on the rule? Especially in the current economic climate where people have little choice over which job they have, I think it's unfair that they should be forced to be exposed to unhealthy fumes in an enclosed environment.
Cigarettes and smokers should be ostracised further, recent studies show (I think it was actually a thread in this section) that people are far more likely to give up smoking because of the social stigma rather than price increase or health warnings. Raise the price? Sure, great idea, get some more revenue in and create an entry barrier for new people trying to smoke, but dedicated smokers will just bust all their cash on it and nothing will have changed.
[QUOTE=Trogdon;35700534]well socially masturbation and sex in public would be more offensive to people, but i don't really care about that. my point is that smoking is not offensive, it's not harmful to others in an open air space, it's already legal, it's good capitalist business (America's #2 export!, not supporting the industry just the economy gained from it), and policing the decisions of other people is harmful. there is no reason for smoking to become illegal just because it's harmful, and putting a huge price on cigarettes is going to be awful to smokers because they will still pay that premium, thus perpetuating economical inequality.[/QUOTE] "Smoking is a good business." is a retarded argument. Prostitution and drug dealing is a god business as well.
[QUOTE=Ylsid;35700554]Cigarettes and smokers should be ostracised further, recent studies show (I think it was actually a thread in this section) that people are far more likely to give up smoking because of the social stigma rather than price increase or health warnings. Raise the price? Sure, great idea, get some more revenue in and create an entry barrier for new people trying to smoke, but dedicated smokers will just bust all their cash on it and nothing will have changed.[/QUOTE] yes lets take all of the money from the lower class. [editline]24th April 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Jack Trades;35700562]"Smoking is a good business." is a retarded argument. Prostitution and drug dealing is a god business as well.[/QUOTE] Why shouldn't those be legal? Prostitution IS legal in Reno, Nevada, and it's worked out extremely fucking well. The brothels are operated by the prostitutes themselves. There are no pimps. Security is extremely tight, STD screenings are weekly for the prostitutes and spot-checked on clients. Contraception is required. The women can go to the police if someone tries something. The women don't get beaten and abused, and a good chunk of revenue goes toward the county. Illegal prostitution works upon extortion and pseudo-slave-labor. Legalized prostitution is extremely safe for all parties involved, and the prostitutes can refuse service for any reason they want if they feel threatened or uncomfortable. They can quit whenever they want, and there's opportunities for advancement toward a managerial position in the brothel.
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