• Paul Ryan under fire after fact-checkers tear apart his convention speech
    132 replies, posted
[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-19427111[/url] [quote=BBC News][B]Republican vice-presidential nominee Paul Ryan has come under fire for alleged inaccuracies during his convention debut in Tampa, Florida.[/B] Mr Ryan attacked the president for making cuts to the Medicare healthcare programme, but did not say that his own budget plan includes the same savings. He complained that proposals by a budget commission were not adopted, but did not mention he opposed its report. Thursday sees Mitt Romney formally accept the Republican nomination. Mr Romney's speech to the convention is the challenger's biggest opportunity yet to make his case to the nation and is one of the set-piece events of the US election calendar. He and Mr Ryan will challenge President Barack Obama and his Vice-President Joe Biden on election day, 6 November. [B]Facts in dispute[/B] In a barnstorming speech to a rapt audience, Mr Ryan promised a "turnaround" for America and said Mr Obama's administration was tired and out of ideas. The Wisconsin congressman said he and Mitt Romney would not duck the tough issues. Mr Ryan, who serves as chairman of the House of Representatives Budget Committee, is known as a leading Washington policy "wonk", responsible for the budget plans backed by Mr Romney and Republicans in Congress. But fact-checkers listening to his speech on Wednesday night quickly alleged that he had been slack with his facts. On a key area of debate, the future of Medicare, the government-run health programme for over-65s, Mr Ryan accused the White House of slashing $716bn (£450bn) from the much-loved scheme. But [url=http://factcheck.org/2012/08/ryans-vp-spin/]FactCheck.org[/url], amongst others, said Mr Obama's 2010 healthcare reform law does not cut money from Medicare, but simply reduces the growth in spending on the scheme in an effort to keep it solvent. In addition, Mr Ryan - who described the Obama plan as "the biggest, coldest, power play of all" - failed to note that he proposed virtually the same cuts in his own budget plans. He accused the president of "political patronage" via his $800bn stimulus plan, passed in 2008. However, he neglected in his speech to mention that he sought to procure stimulus dollars for energy firms in his home state of Wisconsin, the Associated Press notes. The vice-presidential hopeful was also accused of misleading his audience over the timing of the closure of a GM plant in his home town of Janesville, Wisconsin. That statement earned Mr Ryan a "false" rating [url=http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/statements/2012/aug/29/paul-ryan/did-barack-obama-break-promise-keep-gm-plant-open/]from PolitiFact.com[/url], having failed to note that the plant closed under the previous administration of President George W Bush. The Obama campaign [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ukkJYkANZ98]released a web video[/url] on Thursday highlighting Mr Ryan's contentious statements, and dubbing him the "wrong choice for the middle class". [B]'We will lead'[/B] Despite the arguments over Mr Ryan's choice of facts, his speech won a rousing reception from the audience in Tampa. The 42-year-old Wisconsin congressman, already a seven-term Washington veteran, is a hugely popular figure for many conservatives in the Republican fold because of his determination to take a hard line on fiscal issues facing the US. Correspondents say the choice of Mr Ryan has made Mitt Romney's candidacy more palatable to conservatives who doubted his credentials during a long primary process. He tore into the president on Wednesday night, accusing him of running out of ideas and waging a negative campaign. "Fear and division are all they've got left," he said, adding: "Now all that's left is a presidency adrift, surviving on slogans that already seem tired, grasping at a moment that has already passed. "We will not duck the tough issues - we will lead," Mr Ryan said. "We will not spend four years blaming others - we will take responsibility. "The work ahead will be hard. These times demand the best of us - all of us - but we can do this." In one of the biggest applause lines of the night, Mr Ryan said: "College graduates should not have to live out their 20s in their childhood bedrooms, staring up at fading Obama posters and wondering when they can move out and get going with life." He pledged that a Romney-Ryan administration would create 12 million American jobs in its first term and cap federal spending at 20% of gross domestic product. Speaking earlier, Senator McCain lambasted the Obama foreign policy, saying the president was not true to American values, and that he had abandoned Syria's people to a "savage and unfair fight". "The demand for our leadership in the world has never been greater," the senator said. "People don't want less of America. They want more." Former Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice praised the Republican ticket in a speech that made no overt mention of President Obama. "Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan will rebuild us at home and inspire us to lead abroad," she said. "They will provide an answer to the question, 'where does America stand?"' President Obama's re-nomination will be confirmed next week at the Democratic National Convention in Charlotte, North Carolina.[/quote]
looool yet another case of republicans thinking they can "defy reality" they truly are... [B][I]wicked[/I][/B]
Hee hee, serves him well. Too bad many many people won't ever care about this.
[QUOTE=trotskygrad;37473121]looool yet another case of republicans thinking they can "defy reality" they truly are... [B][I]wicked[/I][/B][/QUOTE] I thought it was already established that many Republicans live in their own reality?
Because Republicans haven't done this before?
Wow, more lies. Why am I not surprised anymore
I always have to think of the politicians oin Atlas Shrugged when I read news like this. Same kind of self-delusion.
It's depressing how he still got such an applause he got for it. Voters are morons.
Well it IS difficult to check what he is saying on the spot.
I doubt anything will come from this. They lie and lie and lie constantly. What difference can this really have to their campaign
[img]http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/wikipedian_protester.png[/img]
[QUOTE=1239the;37473875][img]http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/wikipedian_protester.png[/img][/QUOTE] Oh god, if only... The only people that care he lied are Democrats. Republicans watch Fox, and Fox spends all day and all night telling people that every other source of information on the entire planet except for Fox is part of a liberal conspiracy. People that vote for Romney/Ryan will never see or hear anything to suggest that Ryan's speech contained anything but absolute truth. They live in a completely different reality independent from any meddling little "facts".
I know nothing of American Politics, but am I correct in posting this? [IMG]http://deadhomersociety.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/sideshowbobroberts7_thumb.png?w=512&h=384[/IMG]
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;37473904]Oh god, if only... The only people that care he lied are Democrats. Republicans watch Fox, and Fox spends all day and all night telling people that every other source of information on the entire planet except for Fox is part of a liberal conspiracy. People that vote for Romney/Ryan will never see or hear anything to suggest that Ryan's speech contained anything but absolute truth. They live in a completely different reality independent from any meddling little "facts".[/QUOTE] "hi I've never watched fox news I'm just going to assume that every little hyperbole facepunch tells me is true" yeah fox news isn't the most reliable source around (and that's coming from a very conservative person) but they aren't anywhere near that bad.
[QUOTE=Killuah;37473313]Well it IS difficult to check what he is saying on the spot.[/QUOTE] A bunch of rich white guys couldn't double check the shit on their iPhone/Droid/Blackberry? Does the RNC cut out internet and phone service? [QUOTE=ButtsexV3;37473938]"hi I've never watched fox news I'm just going to assume that every little hyperbole facepunch tells me is true" yeah fox news isn't the most reliable source around (and that's coming from a very conservative person) but they aren't anywhere near that bad.[/QUOTE] Where Glaber is the Republican ideologue, UCS is the Democrat ideologue. I thought everyone knew this already.
Damnit Ryan, people were supposed to trust you of people to not lie so much. It's sad to see him lie, considering he is capable of actually being a smart politician. He is no Sarah Palin
[QUOTE=person11;37474078]Damnit Ryan, people were supposed to trust you of people to not lie so much. It's sad to see him lie, considering he is capable of actually being a smart politician. He is no Sarah Palin[/QUOTE] no he's just a chuckling Randian fuckhead, AKA worse At least Sarah Palin was endearing in a retarded pet sort of way. This guy is just fucking annoying.
[QUOTE=Killuah;37473313]Well it IS difficult to check what he is saying on the spot.[/QUOTE] What if they're completely contradictory?
[quote] That statement earned Mr Ryan a "false" rating from PolitiFact.com, having failed to note that the plant closed under the previous administration of President George W Bush.[/quote] Now let's see what Fox says: [quote]His aides point out -- and GM confirms -- that the plant was not shut down per se but idled, meaning it could be reactivated at any time. However, nothing Ryan said in his speech about the plant was factually untrue. [/quote] Oh Fox news you so silly. Here's the whole article if you want to read their attempted defense: [url]http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/08/30/fact-check-paul-ryan-convention-address/[/url] Don't you just love American politics.
[QUOTE=Killuah;37473313]Well it IS difficult to check what he is saying on the spot.[/QUOTE] Yeah, this is why speeches are researched and written up first, you don't just get up on stage and start spouting bullshit and rhetoric, unless you planned to.
I'm not really surprised there were inaccuracies in his speech. Look at who the hell he's speaking to. The GOP convention. It's just a circlejerk of conservatives telling each other what they want to hear, do you really think they would be accurate with that?
[QUOTE=ButtsexV3;37473938]"hi I've never watched fox news I'm just going to assume that every little hyperbole facepunch tells me is true" yeah fox news isn't the most reliable source around (and that's coming from a very conservative person) but they aren't anywhere near that bad.[/QUOTE] "hi im facepunch's token weaboo/conservative gun nut and trust me fox isn't all that bad! i promise!" nah fox is legitimately that bad and they constantly, without exaggeration, hype up the "liberal media" and sell viewers the idea that everyone but Fox is out to get them
[QUOTE=ButtsexV3;37473938]"hi I've never watched fox news I'm just going to assume that every little hyperbole facepunch tells me is true" yeah fox news isn't the most reliable source around (and that's coming from a very conservative person) but they aren't anywhere near that bad.[/QUOTE] I have watched Fox News. It is unreliable. It is pretty damn bad. "Fox and Friends" is one of the worst shows on TV for the shit that comes out of it and honestly, Fox doesn't have things "better" than that. Only worse. Damn near everything they do is so biased it IS that bad. Other networks have noticeable bias. They are not however, full fucking tilt biased.
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;37473904]Oh god, if only... The only people that care he lied are Democrats. Republicans watch Fox, and Fox spends all day and all night telling people that every other source of information on the entire planet except for Fox is part of a liberal conspiracy. People that vote for Romney/Ryan will never see or hear anything to suggest that Ryan's speech contained anything but absolute truth. They live in a completely different reality independent from any meddling little "facts".[/QUOTE] Not sure about Fox News itself, but that describes Fox Nation to the tee.
[QUOTE=Kopimi;37474284]"hi im facepunch's token weaboo/conservative gun nut and trust me fox isn't all that bad! i promise!" nah fox is legitimately that bad and they constantly, without exaggeration, hype up the "liberal media" and sell viewers the idea that everyone but Fox is out to get them[/QUOTE] Can you source this please? I was under the impression that this was the radio wing of Conservative punditry, I.E. Rush Limbaugh and friends that always talked about liberal conspiracy and the "mainstream media". My dad watches a fair bit of Fox and I haven't seen a lot of it, although I think O'Reilly might have mentioned the "mainstream media" a couple times before. It seems like Fox is more professional about their propaganda and let the other guys talk about the conspiracies.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;37474378]I have watched Fox News. It is unreliable. It is pretty damn bad. "Fox and Friends" is one of the worst shows on TV for the shit that comes out of it and honestly, Fox doesn't have things "better" than that. Only worse. Damn near everything they do is so biased it IS that bad. Other networks have noticeable bias. They are not however, full fucking tilt biased.[/QUOTE] My mom watches Fox all the time. So I'm kinda forced to listen to it all the time, too. The only person on there that's decent is Shepherd Smith. He's not nearly as bad as the rest. Everyone on the channel is a known Conservative, the only two Liberals they have actively working for them that I know of are Bob Beckel and Alan Colmes. All the guests they have on the show are usually Conservative, with the occasional Democrat/Liberal so they can say that its "Fair". It's not so much that they lie about things, It's just everything they say is in defense of Conservative ideals, and their stance on everything is very Conservative too. So watch it if you want to see what the Republicans are thinking, don't watch it if you want FAIR AND BALANCED coverage.
[video=youtube;8HiHrBTAhWI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HiHrBTAhWI[/video]
[QUOTE=OvB;37474455]My mom watches Fox all the time. So I'm kinda forced to listen to it all the time, too. The only person on there that's decent is Shepherd Smith. He's not nearly as bad as the rest. Everyone on the channel is a known Conservative, the only two Liberals they have actively working for them that I know of are Bob Beckel and Alan Colmes. All the guests they have on the show are usually Conservative, with the occasional Democrat/Liberal so they can say that its "Fair". It's not so much that they lie about things, It's just everything they say is in defense of Conservative ideals, and their stance on everything is very Conservative too. So watch it if you want to see what the Republicans are thinking, don't watch it if you want FAIR AND BALANCED coverage.[/QUOTE] This made me respect Shepherd Smith, and he will always have a special place in my heart. Keep in mind this was said when the rest of Fox was defending BP. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Arne859LfAQ[/media]
[QUOTE=yawmwen;37474651]This made me respect Shepherd Smith, and he will always have a special place in my heart. Keep in mind this was said when the rest of Fox was defending BP. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Arne859LfAQ[/media][/QUOTE] [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IG2VF4a0LWs[/media] Speaks for itself.
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;37473904]Oh god, if only... The only people that care he lied are Democrats. Republicans watch Fox, and Fox spends all day and all night telling people that every other source of information on the entire planet except for Fox is part of a liberal conspiracy. People that vote for Romney/Ryan will never see or hear anything to suggest that Ryan's speech contained anything but absolute truth. They live in a completely different reality independent from any meddling little "facts".[/QUOTE] Actually, even Fox News was pointing out inaccuracies in his speech: [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukkJYkANZ98&t=1m30s[/url] Their coverage of the convention was pretty terrible, for the most part, but they did criticize some of his more blatant lies.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.