• Japan reveals long-secretive execution process
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[quote=teeheev2;24427300]this is true, but how can you force them to take the pills after leaving prison or hospital. And no added chemicals can really change a persons inner values, just how they act. The people who don't take them and refuse to help others help them, and kill or rape for fun need to be destroyed.[/quote] Hey; [highlight]CRIMINALS ARE NOT EVIL![/highlight] Are you 4 years old or something? Because you get the ability to see things from others point of view around 5-6 ish. Try and use that ability for just one second will you?
[QUOTE=froztshock;24427282]The difference between pedophiles and gays is that with gays it's between two consenting adults, and with pedophiles it's between an adult and a child, who is likely not sexually mature and definitely not mentally prepared for sexual activity. I don't know if he should be killed, but he's clearly shown that rehabilitation hasn't worked for him, and that he would just commit the same offense again were he allowed to roam freely. Yes rehabilitation is the preferable alternative, but we simply don't know enough about the human mind altogether to rehabilitate every single person.[/QUOTE] Pretty much this. BmB is most likely trolling, he just talks crap. Ignore him until he gets of his throne. He should get a job while he still knows it all. [editline]04:06PM[/editline] [QUOTE=BmB;24427328]Hey; [highlight]CRIMINALS ARE NOT EVIL![/highlight][/QUOTE] I lied, I will reply to you. Evil is subjective. I'm not saying they are evil. I'm saying they are inhumane, incurable, and a burden to society.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;24427315]Oh I'm not arguing that we should do this, just that it's a fact of life that it's how we function. [editline]11:04PM[/editline] Just because you can't change them doesn't make it free will.[/QUOTE] My point stands, we both agree that it is by chemical means. What I am arguing is that you cannot, under any level change someone's ideals or sick minds when they are hardwired that way without infringing their rights and forcing them to under go a chemical change. If we do this, the argument still fails because there is no way to make someone not only agree, but there is no way to make someone do anything they don't want to do without taking rights away.
[QUOTE=teeheeV2;24427330]I lied, I will reply to you. Evil is subjective. I'm not saying they are evil. I'm saying they are inhumane, incurable, and a burden to society.[/QUOTE] That's exactly the same as saying they are irreparably evil.
Nice edit attacking me instead of returning a proper argument. I can see from yours and abyss' points of view and where you are coming from. But attacking me and saying CRIMS AREN'T EVIL over and over makes you look like a tool.
I'm not asking you to see things from my point of view numbskull.
[QUOTE=Ghostz;24427363]My point stands, we both agree that it is by chemical means. What I am arguing is that you cannot, under any level change someone's ideals or sick minds when they are hardwired that way without infringing their rights and forcing them to under go a chemical change. If we do this, the argument still fails because there is no way to make someone not only agree, but there is no way to make someone do anything they don't want to do without taking rights away.[/QUOTE] I'm not talking about rights here. I'm saying flat out, you do not have free will at a chemical level, you do not have choices, and any choice is simply an illusion. You have no choice to choose what you choose. That's all I'm saying. I'm not talking at legal levels here or anything. Simply that free will does not exist.
I'm not calling them evil. I'm saying that they are no longer functioning members of society. They are insane, which doesn't mean evil.
[QUOTE=BmB;24427407]I'm not asking you to see things from my point of view numbskull.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=BmB;24427328]Hey; [highlight]CRIMINALS ARE NOT EVIL![/highlight] Are you 4 years old or something? Because you get the ability to see things from others point of view around 5-6 ish. Try and use that ability for just one second will you?[/QUOTE] :downs: EDIT: [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;24427409]I'm not talking about rights here. I'm saying flat out, you do not have free will at a chemical level, you do not have choices, and any choice is simply an illusion. You have no choice to choose what you choose. That's all I'm saying. I'm not talking at legal levels here or anything. Simply that free will does not exist.[/QUOTE] This is an off topic arguement, if you'd like we can discuss this another time, I have no problem with that. The point I was trying to make, free will or not, we cannot force change on another human being.
How can you defend killing the insane?
[QUOTE=BmB;24427328][highlight]CRIMINALS ARE NOT EVIL![/highlight][/QUOTE] Would you say the same if you mom, sister, friend was raped? What if you were raped?
[QUOTE=lulzbocks;24427449]Would you say the same if you mom, sister, friend was raped? What if you were raped?[/QUOTE] I say the same and my friend was raped. So yes. Hell, my friend doesn't even think they're evil, and she was fucking raped.
Anger is an unreasonable emotion, of course I wouldn't. That wouldn't make them evil though. Which is [i]why vigilance is illegal![/i]
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;24427454]I say the same and my friend was raped. So yes. Hell, my friend doesn't even think they're evil, and she was fucking raped.[/QUOTE] She's obviously mentally distressed
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;24427409]I'm not talking about rights here. I'm saying flat out, you do not have free will at a chemical level, you do not have choices, and any choice is simply an illusion. You have no choice to choose what you choose. That's all I'm saying. I'm not talking at legal levels here or anything. Simply that free will does not exist.[/QUOTE] In that sense it doesn't, but my brain made the chemicals which told my body to make this post. Our brains chemicals give us will
[QUOTE=Tetracycline;24427487]She's obviously mentally distressed[/QUOTE] She was distressed, she was scared, she was in a lot of pain for a long time. Does that mean she thinks they're fucking evil? No. that's a distinction people think you have to make. You don't, and a lot of people don't. A lot of people don't think the people that hurt them are fucking evil. Some do, some don't. It's not a given thing, stop acting like it is.
[QUOTE=BmB;24427407]I'm not asking you to see things from my point of view numbskull.[/QUOTE] Yes you did. You said at the age of 5 o 6 I gained a skill of looking from another point of view and to use that skill. Your digging your own grave, quit while your ahead
[QUOTE=teeheeV2;24427503]In that sense it doesn't, but my brain made the chemicals which told my body to make this post. Our brains chemicals give us will[/QUOTE] Not exactly. You got those chemicals through feeding yourself which is a cyclical until you get back to the first time you ate, when you clearly didn't have free will, as a baby. Free will is really an illusion if you look at things from a physics/chemistry based view.
[QUOTE=BmB;24427461]Anger is an unreasonable emotion, of course I wouldn't. That wouldn't make them evil though. Which is [i]why vigilance is illegal![/i][/QUOTE] No one is saying anyone is evil on my side of the argument, you're putting words in our mouths.
Well I disagree.
[QUOTE=teeheeV2;24427518]Yes you did. You said at the age of 5 o 6 I gained a skill of looking from another point of view and to use that skill. Your digging your own grave, quit while your ahead[/QUOTE] I said that. So if I wasn't asking you to see things from my point of view, whose point of view do you think I was talking about?! Chew on that, it is apparent you'll need to.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;24427536]Not exactly. You got those chemicals through feeding yourself which is a cyclical until you get back to the first time you ate, when you clearly didn't have free will, as a baby. Free will is really an illusion if you look at things from a physics/chemistry based view.[/QUOTE] Thats a different discussion. As a 15 year old, I can choose what to do, whether or not I am being fed chemicals to do that is beside the point, as I am not insane with a brain similar to the people we are discussing.
[QUOTE=lulzbocks;24427544]Well I disagree.[/QUOTE] You think they're evil? There is no such thing as evil. I've been criminally assaulted before, do i think that the guy that did it was evil? NO. AND NOT EVERYONE DOES IT IS A BASELESS AND WRONG ASSUMPTION.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;24427575]You think they're evil? There is no such thing as evil. I've been criminally assaulted before, do i think that the guy that did it was evil? NO. AND NOT EVERYONE DOES IT IS A BASELESS AND WRONG ASSUMPTION.[/QUOTE] Well I disagree.
[QUOTE=teeheeV2;24427574]Thats a different discussion. As a 15 year old, I can choose what to do, whether or not I am being fed chemicals to do that is beside the point, as I am not insane with a brain similar to the people we are discussing.[/QUOTE] Not having free will doesn't mean you don't have the illusion of choice.
While you figure out my (apparently) mysterious riddle I'll be going away for a while to eat something. Toodeloo.
[QUOTE=BmB;24427560]I said that. So if I wasn't asking you to see things from my point of view, whose point of view do you think I was talking about?! Chew on that, it is apparent you'll need to.[/QUOTE] You are still attacking me instead of putting a well reasoned argument forward. Of course I can see things from another persons point of view, why did you bring that up in the first place. I'm suspecting you have no argument and are trying to pull me down with you.
[QUOTE=lulzbocks;24427582]Well I disagree.[/QUOTE] Then go ahead and see things from only one blind point of view. I certainly don't see people who wrong me as evil, nor do I want to kill them. I'm not blood thirsty like you apparently. My friend who was raped, she would actually defend the rapist if you called him evil because you have no idea how fucking stupid it is to say someone is evil because of their actions. everyone is driven to certain things by their lives, I guess you just don't give a fuck people don't have the easy life you do and sometimes do the wrong thing.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;24422808]Life in prison doesn't need to exist if people can be rehabilitated. It costs a ridiculous amount to keep them in there. [b]How about fix them so they don't need to be in there and don't commit crimes[/b]?[/QUOTE] I find this an interesting opinion, kind of cute in simplicity. How exactly do you "fix" people with possibly severe mental disorders that cause them to commit these acts? I can understand rehabilitating some random drunken stabber or any other criminal who did what he did and possibly felt sorry for it the second he did it, for these people some jail time will probably sort things out, no need to get your life taken away because of a single mistake. However, I think there is a point, that certain point where a person probably receives sick pleasure from murder and dissolves bodies in a cellar bathtub. I honestly would not, and could not trust these people to return to society, ever. Mental disorders and broken morals cannot be fixed. It doesn't even always have to be a mental disorder, some people just are what they are and will commit crimes once they get out, you can't brainwash a human being into a completely different person, even over long time. In some cases I could even find death sentence acceptable, for the kind of folk that just can't be safely released back into society and the previously mentioned high cost of keeping them locked up 'till they die.
[QUOTE=Zestence;24427613]I find this an interesting opinion, kind of cute in simplicity. How exactly do you "fix" people with possibly severe mental disorders that cause them to commit these acts? I can understand rehabilitating some random drunken stabber or any other criminal who did what he did and possibly felt sorry for it the second he did it, for these people some jail time will probably sort things out, no need to get your life taken away because of a single mistake. However, I think there is a point, that certain point where a person probably receives sick pleasure from murder and dissolves bodies in a cellar bathtub. I honestly would not, and could not trust these people to return to society, ever. Mental disorders and broken morals cannot be fixed. It doesn't even always have to be a mental disorder, some people just are what they are and will commit crimes once they get out, you can't brainwash a human being into a completely different person, even over long time. In some cases I could even find death sentence acceptable, for the kind of folk that just can't be safely released back into society and the previously mentioned high cost of keeping them locked up 'till they die.[/QUOTE] Read the thread. While most criminal offenders can be helped, some can not. Those that can not be helped should simply be locked up and not killed. Why the fuck do you have to kill them? Why is facepunch filled with angsty teens who think blood lust is a good thing?
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