• Lara Croft to be Rape Victim in Upcoming 'Tomb Raider' Video Game
    506 replies, posted
[QUOTE=ADT;36337284]jesus christ it's a video game. I don't see anyone bitching about it when it's portrayed in other medias [b](unless it was badly written)[/b] How about growing up a bit?[/QUOTE] this is the problem, most videogames are about as well written as a twilight fanfiction i think before videogames should depict such heavy stuff, they should be given more time to evolve as a medium and prove that they can handle other issues without hamfisting it
[QUOTE=Loriborn;36337348]I don't see any game company, at all, not one, bragging about rape scenes. Hell, I haven't seen a game with a female that was raped. Why is it, like I said before, that rape is incredibly wrong as plot development, but murder is? Are you saying that war, murder and death are all hunkie-dorie, PG stuff, but rape is awful? Like I said before, if you step away from the games and look at death from the same standpoint you are with the rape, then you'll see that it's just as bad, if not worse.[/QUOTE] This whole politically correct thing is bullshit.
[QUOTE=Loriborn;36337309] He said that this crossed the lines. If we really want to argue semantics, lets say that he only likes a select few video games. I will bet money that any game he claims to enjoy involves him killing another player or person.[/QUOTE] he didn't say any of that, let me recreate this conversation arc for you since you obviously didn't read anything he wrote. [quote] Here's the thing. Everyone says rape is awful, but rape is no worse than murder, genocide, being forced into prostitution, or whatever.[/quote] false equivalency but okay [quote]Ok, I'm sorry but I'm going to have to point this one line out as it is just fucking stupid. Rape is physical and mental torture. So much so that many rape victims actually turn to suicide to end the suffering.[/quote] and here he points out that false equivalency by saying that the depiction of rape is very different than the depiction of murder in a videogame, to which you reply. [quote]Are you telling me survivors of the Syrian massacres, or veterans of The Vietnam War got off easy compared to Lara after she was slightly felt up in that video?[/quote] which is the craziest response ever!! there's a huge difference between a survivor of a real massacre and a videogame where you shoot completely unrealistic and non-existent people, and within that the depiction of rape and the emotion it's trying to convey is also completely different from either of those fucking things!! so WTF?
[QUOTE=Loriborn;36337348]I don't see any game company, at all, not one, bragging about rape scenes. Hell, I haven't seen a game with a female that was raped. Why is it, like I said before, that rape is incredibly wrong as plot development, but murder is? Are you saying that war, murder and death are all hunkie-dorie, PG stuff, but rape is awful? Like I said before, if you step away from the games and look at death from the same standpoint you are with the rape, then you'll see that it's just as bad, if not worse.[/QUOTE] no sir I'm saying that rape as a part of a woman protagonist's backstory is becoming incredibly cliche, which I do not approve of. It isn't something that people should become desensitized to. The fact that it's a video game has nothing to do with it.
[QUOTE=Revan564;36337283]I hope you're joking, unless you like watching simulated rape. Japan has quite a few games you might like though. :v:[/QUOTE] No, If they're going to pull a stunt like this they better back it up or frankly it would be insult to the legitimacy of the medium.
[QUOTE=Derpmonster;36337354]This whole politically correct thing is bullshit.[/QUOTE] The only reason they're not okay with rape in games, but they are okay with killing people is because we've been playing games ever since we first started that involved death or killing. Death isn't good, and murder outright is plain disgusting, I think moreso than rape if you look at it from the standpoint of "oh look, some random civilians in GTA, let me run them over." Of course, when we kill all those people, we don't think about it because we've done it all our lives. Now we are shown something different and people freak out. Yeah, rape is bad, but if you're saying it's bad because of the real life implications, then almost every game out there is just as bad because in real life, victims of these things like massacres and genocides are sometimes much worse off than rape victims.
[QUOTE=Popiillil;36337141]Most people won't feel comfortable with this.[/QUOTE] [citation needed] It feels good knowing people wont buy a game with a rape scene in it but will buy games where you murder tens of hundreds of humans.
[QUOTE=Loriborn;36337348]I don't see any game company, at all, not one, bragging about rape scenes. [/QUOTE] you're in a thread in which a developer is announcing a depiction of rape in their upcoming game. unless i'm mistaken and developers want to sabotage their own hype and sales, i'm pretty sure he's trying to convince you that the game is good and worth playing
[QUOTE=The Calzone;36337363]no sir I'm saying that rape as a part of a woman protagonist's backstory is becoming incredibly cliche, which I do not approve of. It isn't something that people should become desensitized to. The fact that it's a video game has nothing to do with it.[/QUOTE] Rape of a woman in backstory has only been talked about in TV shows. Not once has it been in a video game. In my opinion it is cliche if its backstory. Although, in the moment if it is happening in front of you on a show or game. It causes emotions to come out. That's probably what they are trying for.
[QUOTE=The Calzone;36337363]no sir I'm saying that rape as a part of a woman protagonist's backstory is becoming incredibly cliche, which I do not approve of. It isn't something that people should become desensitized to. The fact that it's a video game has nothing to do with it.[/QUOTE] attempted rape is a always a part of a girls rite of passage to womanhood
[QUOTE=The Calzone;36337363]no sir I'm saying that rape as a part of a woman protagonist's backstory is becoming incredibly cliche, which I do not approve of. It isn't something that people should become desensitized to. The fact that it's a video game has nothing to do with it.[/QUOTE] Why can't we be desensitized to rape but we can be desensitized to murder and death? I mean, look at any game. Do you think twice before beheading a guy in Skyrim? Do you think about the kids that are watching in the Jarls' palace? No, because it's a game and you're desensitized to it. Rape is not any worse than murdering a man in front of children.
[QUOTE=Loriborn;36337377]The only reason they're not okay with rape in games, but they are okay with killing people is because we've been playing games ever since we first started that involved death or killing. Death isn't good, and murder outright is plain disgusting, I think moreso than rape if you look at it from the standpoint of "oh look, some random civilians in GTA, let me run them over." Of course, when we kill all those people, we don't think about it because we've done it all our lives. Now we are shown something different and people freak out. Yeah, rape is bad, but if you're saying it's bad because of the real life implications, then almost every game out there is just as bad because in real life, victims of these things like massacres and genocides are sometimes much worse off than rape victims.[/QUOTE] This goes back to how people cannot accept change. Anything new to them humanity pushes aside or demonizes.
[QUOTE=thisispain;36337379]you're in a thread in which a developer is announcing a depiction of rape in their upcoming game. unless i'm mistaken and developers want to sabotage their own hype and sales, i'm pretty sure he's trying to convince you that the game is good and worth playing[/QUOTE] exactly. if the developers wanted to have it be shocking, they wouldn't be going around to news sites announcing it and citing it as a major part of the game.
[QUOTE=Hamsterjuice;36337349]this is the problem, most videogames are about as well written as a twilight fanfiction i think before videogames should depict such heavy stuff, they should be given more time to evolve as a medium and prove that they can handle other issues without hamfisting it[/QUOTE] That's where I do agree with you that rape scenes/topics shouldn't be taken lightly unless the writers know what they're talking about. I don't mind such topics being present, but only if they fit with the current setting of the game (and that just don't pop out of nowhere, with no sense)
[QUOTE=The Calzone;36337389]exactly. if the developers wanted to have it be shocking, they wouldn't be going around to news sites announcing it and citing it as a major part of the game.[/QUOTE] From what I gather, it's a big deal because this is supposed to be the first time she ever kills someone.
[QUOTE=thisispain;36337379]you're in a thread in which a developer is announcing a depiction of rape in their upcoming game. unless i'm mistaken and developers want to sabotage their own hype and sales, i'm pretty sure he's trying to convince you that the game is good and worth playing[/QUOTE] Do you even know what you're arguing?
[QUOTE=Loriborn;36337385] Rape is not any worse than murdering a man in front of children.[/QUOTE] again there's a difference between rape in a videogame and an extremely unrealistic representation of murder. [QUOTE=Derpmonster;36337386]This goes back to how people cannot accept change. Anything new to them humanity pushes aside or demonizes.[/QUOTE] uh
[QUOTE=thisispain;36337403]uh[/QUOTE] Did you even read what I had responded to?
[QUOTE=ADT;36337395]That's where I do agree with you that rape scenes/topics shouldn't be taken lightly unless the writers know what they're talking about.[/QUOTE] That should be the case with any scene that involves anything that is adult material. If you are taking caution when writing a rape scene as to not make a rape victim commit suicide, why don't you take caution when writing a war scene as to not make PTSD victims commit suicide? You can't have one without the other. You treat all victims of all tragedies the same, regardless of if it's rape or war, and that's not happening.
[QUOTE=thisispain;36337403]again there's a difference between rape in a videogame and an extremely unrealistic representation of murder.[/QUOTE] Good thing none of that has nothing to do with anything we're talking about.
*sigh* I really hate how every single person posting in this thread is a male who has never experienced anything close to rape, or even whats depicted in the game. Seriously, you guys have no clue what you're talking about and any "facts" you have are bullshit studies that vary as much as what gives you cancer. So honestly, whether this sort of thing should be in a video game or not should be left to the artists and writers, it's their work and creation and if they feel like including this then so be it. And too the people saying "oh it's not as bad as murder or genocide! stop complaining!" let me just say this: a) rape IS genocide, want to wipe out a population? better yet, replace it with your own. b) from what I've felt, and know other women in my life have felt, murder would be a mercy in comparison. So seriously, if you don't have personal first hand knowledge, please stop bitching about this stuff, it's not your place or right.
[QUOTE=thisispain;36337403]again there's a difference between rape in a videogame and an extremely unrealistic representation of murder.[/QUOTE] Because every video game with shooting and killing shows an unrealistic representation of murder... [video=youtube;zv3oiTSi-xo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zv3oiTSi-xo[/video]
[QUOTE=Ataxia;36337423] And too the people saying "oh it's not as bad as murder or genocide! stop complaining!" let me just say this: a) rape IS genocide[/QUOTE] what
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;36337401]Do you even know what you're arguing?[/QUOTE] it should be pretty easy to see what i'm arguing, which is that this rape shtick is a pretty silly at making a shocking news story and generating marketing hype. i don't agree that it's the next step in writing good plots or characters, and i really doubt the game will treat it as anything more than just a QTE. i could be wrong, but i've played a lot of tomb raider games, and the plot was definitely not the reason why anybody played them. i'm also the fan of the series so it irks me when they make a big deal about this.
[QUOTE=Loriborn;36337385]Why can't we be desensitized to rape but we can be desensitized to murder and death? I mean, look at any game. Do you think twice before beheading a guy in Skyrim? Do you think about the kids that are watching in the Jarls' palace? No, because it's a game and you're desensitized to it. Rape is not any worse than murdering a man in front of children.[/QUOTE] Again you're bringing up the unnecessary parallel. I'm not talking about the act itself, I'm talking about the presentation. The Devs of this game are dick-waving their rape scene and that isn't the proper way to handle things. This has nothing to do with the fact that it's a video game, it's about the way that the devs are parading around the deepness of their game instead of letting players feel it for themselves. What they're doing right now is fucking stupid and does not bode well for their game. [QUOTE=Ataxia;36337423]*sigh* I really hate how every single person posting in this thread is a male who has never experienced anything close to rape, or even whats depicted in the game. Seriously, you guys have no clue what you're talking about and any "facts" you have are bullshit studies that vary as much as what gives you cancer. So honestly, whether this sort of thing should be in a video game or not should be left to the artists and writers, it's their work and creation and if they feel like including this then so be it. And too the people saying "oh it's not as bad as murder or genocide! stop complaining!" let me just say this: a) rape IS genocide, want to wipe out a population? better yet, replace it with your own. b) from what I've felt, and know other women in my life have felt, murder would be a mercy in comparison. So seriously, if you don't have personal first hand knowledge, please stop bitching about this stuff, it's not your place or right.[/QUOTE] right, because as a 2brutish manpig I have absolutely no right to sympathize with women, nor do I have the right to disapprove of the depiction of rape as a marketing ploy
[QUOTE=Ataxia;36337423]*sigh* I really hate how every single person posting in this thread is a male who has never experienced anything close to rape, or even whats depicted in the game. Seriously, you guys have no clue what you're talking about and any "facts" you have are bullshit studies that vary as much as what gives you cancer.[/QUOTE] This is generalised ignorance that has absolutely no baring on what anyone in this thread has said.
[QUOTE=Ataxia;36337423]*sigh* I really hate how every single person posting in this thread is a male who has never experienced anything close to rape, or even whats depicted in the game. Seriously, you guys have no clue what you're talking about and any "facts" you have are bullshit studies that vary as much as what gives you cancer. So honestly, whether this sort of thing should be in a video game or not should be left to the artists and writers, it's their work and creation and if they feel like including this then so be it. And too the people saying "oh it's not as bad as murder or genocide! stop complaining!" let me just say this: a) rape IS genocide, want to wipe out a population? better yet, replace it with your own. b) from what I've felt, and know other women in my life have felt, murder would be a mercy in comparison. So seriously, if you don't have personal first hand knowledge, please stop bitching about this stuff, it's not your place or right.[/QUOTE] I agree with this. Although she gets touched for [B]TWO[/B] seconds in the video then proceeds to kick his ass. I do not call that rape. Sure, he might have been trying to but, it did [I]not[/I] happen. Rape is a horrible thing, so is murder/torture. We shouldn't blow this out of proportion though.
[QUOTE=Ataxia;36337423]*sigh* I really hate how every single person posting in this thread is a male who has never experienced anything close to rape, or even whats depicted in the game. Seriously, you guys have no clue what you're talking about and any "facts" you have are bullshit studies that vary as much as what gives you cancer. So honestly, whether this sort of thing should be in a video game or not should be left to the artists and writers, it's their work and creation and if they feel like including this then so be it. And too the people saying "oh it's not as bad as murder or genocide! stop complaining!" let me just say this: a) rape IS genocide, want to wipe out a population? better yet, replace it with your own. b) from what I've felt, and know other women in my life have felt, murder would be a mercy in comparison. So seriously, if you don't have personal first hand knowledge, please stop bitching about this stuff, it's not your place or right.[/QUOTE] Rape is not gender specific. Men can be raped too. Don't pull that card and say that you know more about the effects or rape when male rape victims exist as well. I'm also not saying that rape isn't bad, I'm saying that watching someone die or having to kill a man is just as bad. I know you know women who say that murder would be mercy, but they've never been raped. I have a friend who struggled with PTSD after he returned from his tours and he nearly killed himself. He tried hanging himself but the rope snapped. I know firsthand the damage that occurs to victims of war, and while I'm not saying rape is a lesser pain, I'm saying that you shouldn't make rape seem worse than everything else in the world because, yes it's god awful, but so is having to kill people, watching your friends die, and the lot.
[QUOTE=thisispain;36337439]it should be pretty easy to see what i'm arguing, which is that this rape shtick is a pretty silly at making a shocking news story and generating marketing hype. i don't agree that it's the next step in writing good plots or characters, and i really doubt the game will treat it as anything more than just a QTE. i could be wrong, but i've played a lot of tomb raider games, and the plot was definitely not the reason why anybody played them. i'm also the fan of the series so it irks me when they make a big deal about this.[/QUOTE] So in your opinion they're doing this just for hype? That's a pretty stupid basis for an argument, unless you have some sort of proof then it's unwarranted. [editline]15th June 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=The Calzone;36337440]The Devs of this game are dick-waving their rape scene and that isn't the proper way to handle things. [/quote] Except they're uh you know not
[QUOTE=Revan564;36337429]Because every video game with shooting and killing shows an unrealistic representation of murder...[/QUOTE] there's a difference between graphic and realistic. a murder isn't a horrible thing because blood or guts come out of someone. it's horrible because (well this is based on your personal morality) a conscious being with a strong effect on someone else is removed from the planet and causes great strife to the people that cared about them. that doesn't happen in videogames on any huge basis and it would be silly to say that a scene where someone is graphically killed would illicit the same emotional response as an actual murder. [editline]15th June 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Governor Goblin;36337452] That's a pretty stupid basis for an argument[/QUOTE] if it's such a stupid basis for an argument then you shouldn't have any trouble arguing against it.
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