Analyst slashes AMD, Nvidia price targets on new cryptocurrency ..
AMD and Nvidia will suffer as specialized digital currency mining chips hit the market this year, according to a Wall Street firm. Susquehanna reduced its rating to negative from neutral and lowered its price target for AMD shares, citing impending competition from cryptocurrency mining company Bitmain.
"During our travels through Asia last week, we confirmed that Bitmain has already developed an ASIC [application-specific integrated circuit] for mining Ethereum, and is readying the supply chain for shipments in 2Q18," analyst Christopher Rolland wrote in a note to clients Monday. "While Bitmain is likely to be the largest ASIC vendor (currently 70-80% of Bitcoin mining ASICs) and the first to market with this product, we have learned of at least three other companies working on Ethereum ASICs, all at various stages of development."
Cryptocurrency miners use graphics cards based on AMD's and Nvidia's chips to "mine" new coins, which can then be sold or held for future appreciation. Digital currency ethereum is up more than 800 percent over the past 12 months, according to Coinbase data. Bitmain dominates the "bitcoin" industry with its specialized ASIC chips that are more efficient at mining than graphic chips from AMD and Nvidia. Bernstein has said Bitmain likely made as much as Nvidia did last year. Analysts estimate that most of Bitmain's revenue is generated by selling mining rigs powered by the company's chips. Rolland believes Bitmain's specialized chip offering for ethereum will hurt demand for PC graphics cards. He estimated ethereum mining-related sales accounted for about 20 percent of AMD's sales and 10 percent of Nvidia's revenue.
An end to the great GPU price hike of '17 may be soon.
let GPU's stay in the hands of actual consumers
This is talking about share price, not card price. The price gouging of both RAM and GPUs is not due to mainly cryptocurrencies, but a combination of increased demand from miners (but not enough that would upset the industry this badly on its own) and an incredible shortage of both flash and non-volatile memory due to flooding in southeast Asia and a massive increase in memory consumption from basically all sectors of tech. This shortage of cards and massive price gouging won't truly end until new memory fabs are able to open.
While I'm by no means an analyst like the article OP, I doubt that 100%, or even 50% of people mining ETH on GPUs will move to an ASIC. They are incredibly expensive and very risky to buy in to.
With hope of ram prices dropping aswell, maybe we will be able to afford pc rigs by 2019
The problem isn't miners who buy one or two cards for mining. The problem is these people:
card scalpers are the fucking worst
Seeing that picture makes my eyes twitch.
Sure they are valid consumers, but they aren't the target audience who the product was made for.
I don't like miners either but the most interesting part of this post to me is you wanting to upgrade a 980Ti.
Isn't it like the top-of-the-line previous-gen GPU? What exactly are you trying to run?
Well shit, looks like ETH prices are due to take a tumble soon. So much for 10k by 2019.
Good news for the eco peeps, as I assume asics are a dickload more power effecient than a giant gpu farm.
Any power efficiency disparity is pretty much not going to have an effect on the power draw. If the cards get more efficient and use less power that just means you can (and will) run more of them at once without getting your electric turned off or blowing something, unless you run out of space in your industrial unit. Since ASICs are usually packaged in a "denser" form factor than you can pack a working GPU rig into, space isn't a concern.
I was looking to upgrade but refused to pay scalpers since everything was out of stock, so I just said fuck it and bought a switch instead. Cost me much less than a 1070 too.
I don't know how they would fix the problem of altcoin miner farms and hoarders like these keeping people from getting new hardware, but if they don't do something soon, the entire PC gaming industry will suffer, because if people aren't buying new PC's or upgrading then they have no need to buy more accessories and peripherals. I suppose V-RAM prices have something to do with it as well but not even close to the extent of these people.
I'll never give up having a gaming PC, but I'll be waiting a few more years between upgrades than usual, and I'm sure it's the same for many others as well.
In the area of 10x, for Bitcoin. We'll have to see how this turns out.
I'm not against crypto since it made me a lot of money but PC gaming is my main hobby and I hate that it is making it extremely expensive for people to buy parts.
I hope this chip takes off because last I checked, people mine ethereum to trade for bitcoin so this might make things go back to normal
Nor do they produce jobs or anything productive.
People who've invested generally either try to sell their cards (nothing wrong with the silicon most of the time tbh, but the fans are shithouse after being run that long and hard), or move on to the next big GPU minable altcoin.
ASICs didn't solve this when Bitcoin miners moved to them, they wont solve it when Eth miners move either.
Bitcoin and Altcoins from the start are meant to be mined and as they're mined they will continue to inflate the workloads to incredibly ridiculous levels because of inflation of sources.
They're all terrible, and they're central trading point is Bitcoin which, to be best used, still needs to be mined.
The entire ecosystem is a walking timebomb of wasted energy, materials, toxic metals and more.
If that shit were up to me, I'd enforce investigations targeted at households and companies that draw a suspiciously high amount of power, and any that can't provide a decent justification that doesn't consist in mining crypto would get cut off from the grid or throttled.
We have an energy and environmental crisis. It's tough enough finding ways to reduce our carbon footprint without those cumts shitting all over our efforts for the sake of garnishing their funbux wallet. They can get fucked.
We may not be able to enforce bans on cryptocurrencies themselves, but we're most certainly able to find out miners via their power drawing footprint and shut their shit off.
They can change the algo when the functionality of the ASICs is known.
Might not be relevant for too long anyways because of POS coming. But there's a step in the migration where only a small amount of blocks are done via POS and most are still mined with POW.
Ignoring the fact that "wanting to upgrade my GTX 980 Ti to run VR" is a bit different than wanting to upgrade your 5 year old mid-range card just to play anything, the comparison between crypto and gaming is just silly. Gaming has entertainment value - people want to be entertained, thus there is a natural demand for entertainment that gaming fulfills. Cryptocurrencies are currently good for nothing but pure speculation - nothing of value is created from crypto (currently), any earnings made from it is simply a redistribution of funds. No one is getting crypto because they want the end product, it's just a massive game of hot potato.
At the very least, gaming is a much, much more worthwhile endeavour than crypto currently is. Opening new plants for flash memory doesn't happen overnight (it takes years to get up to capacity), and in the end that product capacity is gonna be wasted on producing something with no real use to anyone. A total waste. I for one hope crypto just dies out, or at least reincarnates in a form that isn't A) a huge waste of electricity and b) actually useful as a currency.
And as I showed in a post yesterday, crypto is definitely hitting prices hard. Fuck miners.
There's a difference between gamers who just want one GPU for their own entertainment (Which is a totally valid thing to want, even if it's "useless") and crypto miners who hoard them to get a razor thin margin and suck electricity from local communities on what is basically a volatile stock market except completely unregulated.
Eh, fans aren't shit. Pop 'em out and give 'em a shot of Zoom oil and they're fight as rain again.
It's be strange to see power companies enforcing the same devices I've seen a time or two in my HVAC days, but with miners.
See, a lot of the more well-off customers had a lot of these strange, plastic gray boxes attached to their ACs outside. These were remote shut-off devices so that the local energy company can shut your AC off if they feel the grid is too heavily loaded.
Once people find out what these "discount-granting" devices actually do, 95% of them specifically request that we not re-attach them.
I've been cloned!
The problem with cryptocurrencies is unless the standard changes there will always be new coins to speculate on which will use GPU based mining algorithms. It seems unlikely there will be a end to the demand anytime soon as more and more elaborate cryptocurrencies will arrive with better feature set which will still use GPUs for mining until the ASICs comes in a year or two later to make it unreliable.
Of course, it'd be better if it was processor based as it would only affect the high-end market in terms of prices. The problem is that with GPUs the high-end is also what most people want which makes for a shitty overall situation.
You can get by two-three generation old processors, not the same with GPUs. I'm afraid. (In terms of performance gains/losses.)
As some have said in this thread, while I'm sure this will help to potentially alleviate GPU stock in the future, the question is, how long will that even last?
Cryptominers are always going to be seeking the coin that is rising massively in value and can be obtained currently for the least amount of relative effort. Once Ethereum gets dominated by ASICs, another altcoin will take its place. Same after that altcoin.
It'll be a never ending cycle because people will just continue to fork or make new, and those who mine with GPUs will just continue to flop coins.
I wonder if they mine Ethereum Classic (ETC) as that is staying PoW as far as I know.
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