Critique on upcoming XP system - Rust

100 hours of rust, have tested XP system on prerelease server and I am all hands AGAINST implementing this dumbing down, backwards in time mechanic for the following reasons. [B]1) This will split the community[/B] - some people are waiting for this some people like me are against it. You will have servers operating on BP system and servers on XP system. You do not want to split the community(look for fights below this post for proof) [B]2)Less player interaction[/B] - BP trading will be gone, trading items to BP them will be gone. I have helped and received help when starting out in form of giving out BP's you already learned and that just feels great. You do not want to remove ways of player interaction and turn this game more into a deathmatch arena. [B]3)Xp system is less fun[/B] - BP farming gives you alot of action, is harsh and rewarding as hell. Just remember that mini-orgasm from a C4 bp you got in a barrel. Research tables are also fun and add a depth to the game. There is a versatility with your progression and possibilities. More stuff for you to do and explore. % based research adds a gambling aspect to the game wich is also kinda fun or at least gives you emotion. In contrary to all that we have slow, repetetive progresasion from tree bashing... You do not want to remove depth, exploration and versatility from the game. [B]4)Increased playsessions[/B] - this game already requires long playsessions. To set up a safe place so you can logout takes 1 to 2 hours (1x2 stone walls, sheet metal doors with airlock). With XP system you need 4-5 hours to set yourself for logging off. This will be very discouraging to return after a wipe or start a game on new server. I know many people dont care about saving the stuff and play the game differently but alot of people like me have a need to build up and save loot before exiting. This lures into very long playsessions which i rather would not be sucked into. [B]5)Some XP mechanics makes no sense[/B] - i am not trying to chase realism in games but things have to make sense within their own games boundaries. There will always be struggle between balance, credibility and fun. This is how you get salvaged shelves on lv 15 and other inconsistencies. You dont want the game to be confusing and self contradicting. (Welcome to Rust where you have to survive by gathering resources for days to be able to craft a beanie hat).BP system is at least somewhat convenient in justifying progression. [B]6)Advantage to high level players and clans[/B] - self explanatory. You cant defend yourself when starting out or even when having somewhat of a base becase you cant even craft a bow or a pipe shotgun. Clans will have high lvl crafters or will be splitting research paths between members and will be getting even more advantage that they already have from the numbers. People who are starting out will be destroyed and will have a long time before they can get full experience. [B]7)Killing nakeds[/B] - many people dont read guides and update notes and same as me will automatically think killing people gives XP, because why shouldn't it if killing anything else does(see point 5). This will unintentionally give incentive to kill freshspawns and i know this was mentioned to be balanced out with some mechanics but will most players know about it? [B]TL;DR - Game has a lot of issues to be addressed. XP system will add even more and is in general NOT FUN if you compare it to BP system.[/B]

the community is always split. players rarely feel safe enough to trade bps, unless they are in a clan. this system would mean each player needed to gain enough xp; clans would lose the advantage of being able to stockpile bps to power up new players. in fact, i think your point about it giving an advantage to clans is backwards; every player needs to have sufficient xp from farming to actually craft items. they can't simply be fed bps when they start the game as they can now. xp system may not replace bps entirely, and you still find orgasm inducing gear in loot boxes that you can't yet craft. no idea which will be more fun until it's actually been in for a while. xp would be balanced to avoid breaking the early setup stages. for example, maybe they would make the hammer and plan default bps, so you can build a house. and maybe balance the amount of xp needed to gain the sleeping bag equal to the amount of gathering to make a 1x1, and getting enough cloth to build your first bag. as for killing nakeds, have you ever landed in a spawn with people harvesting torches? KOS, especially of nakeds is already rampant. i doubt killings will increase significantly, especially if they kill 10-20 nakeds and get no xp; they won't need to be told, they will learn it first hand.

in my opinion the ideal would be to raise the level to be able to use the blue print of the level required! keeping the farm blue print! Without the farm blue print, people will be only in their safe places, the way it is today, for those who have all the blue prints!

Another advantage of xp over bp trading: the thing you make and trade has a finite life span. Instead of trading the bp one time and never trading again, they'll have to keep trading if they lose or break that thing.

The one major point you stated is the BP system - Since rust is supposed to be about survival how can you instantly learn how to make something from a BP? Gaining experience (XP) means the more you play the more you will learn about the world around you. As great an addition as it is - The xp system will change rust for better and for worse Solo types or small clans will find it even harder to enjoy the game since they are the non 24/7 types and will gain levels slower meaning they will not be able to build a secure base fast 24/7 or large clans will find it harder to spam build massive bases but will have dedicated crafters that do nothing but level up So the end result will be even more powerful large clans making more solo/small clans moving server or moving game

[QUOTE=DRGoodfellow;50518824] ... Solo types or small clans will find it even harder to enjoy the game since they are the non 24/7 types and will gain levels slower meaning they will not be able to build a secure base fast [/QUOTE] Says who?

[QUOTE=zanis100;50515598]100 hours of rust, have tested XP system on prerelease server and I am all hands AGAINST implementing this dumbing down, backwards in time mechanic for the following reasons. [B]1) This will split the community[/B] - some people are waiting for this some people like me are against it. You will have servers operating on BP system and servers on XP system. You do not want to split the community(look for fights below this post for proof) [B]2)Less player interaction[/B] - BP trading will be gone, trading items to BP them will be gone. I have helped and received help when starting out in form of giving out BP's you already learned and that just feels great. You do not want to remove ways of player interaction and turn this game more into a deathmatch arena. [B]3)Xp system is less fun[/B] - BP farming gives you alot of action, is harsh and rewarding as hell. Just remember that mini-orgasm from a C4 bp you got in a barrel. Research tables are also fun and add a depth to the game. There is a versatility with your progression and possibilities. More stuff for you to do and explore. % based research adds a gambling aspect to the game wich is also kinda fun or at least gives you emotion. In contrary to all that we have slow, repetetive progresasion from tree bashing... You do not want to remove depth, exploration and versatility from the game. [B]4)Increased playsessions[/B] - this game already requires long playsessions. To set up a safe place so you can logout takes 1 to 2 hours (1x2 stone walls, sheet metal doors with airlock). With XP system you need 4-5 hours to set yourself for logging off. This will be very discouraging to return after a wipe or start a game on new server. I know many people dont care about saving the stuff and play the game differently but alot of people like me have a need to build up and save loot before exiting. This lures into very long playsessions which i rather would not be sucked into. [B]5)Some XP mechanics makes no sense[/B] - i am not trying to chase realism in games but things have to make sense within their own games boundaries. There will always be struggle between balance, credibility and fun. This is how you get salvaged shelves on lv 15 and other inconsistencies. You dont want the game to be confusing and self contradicting. (Welcome to Rust where you have to survive by gathering resources for days to be able to craft a beanie hat).BP system is at least somewhat convenient in justifying progression. [B]6)Advantage to high level players and clans[/B] - self explanatory. You cant defend yourself when starting out or even when having somewhat of a base becase you cant even craft a bow or a pipe shotgun. Clans will have high lvl crafters or will be splitting research paths between members and will be getting even more advantage that they already have from the numbers. People who are starting out will be destroyed and will have a long time before they can get full experience. [B]7)Killing nakeds[/B] - many people dont read guides and update notes and same as me will automatically think killing people gives XP, because why shouldn't it if killing anything else does(see point 5). This will unintentionally give incentive to kill freshspawns and i know this was mentioned to be balanced out with some mechanics but will most players know about it? [B]TL;DR - Game has a lot of issues to be addressed. XP system will add even more and is in general NOT FUN if you compare it to BP system.[/B][/QUOTE] 1) this Community was never one in nature ever. 2) People trading their tools to get EXP faster is an social interaction to me atleast. 3)[B]Xp System is less fun[/B]. I played on the test branch and i disagree it was very good in my oppinion. 4) Its still getting tweeked what do you expect if you play an test branch. 5) Both of these progression ways make no sense imagine throwing some scraps together and saying "duh no i know how an rocket launcher works!" 6) still the same if you join an server youre in an disatvantage 7) We killed nakeds in Legacy it will never change Nothing speaks against it wait for an full release and do another review

Ill wait to play it in its finished state before i make any comment on the XP system. I am looking forward to this new feature, whether i like it or not only time will tell.

[QUOTE=zanis100;50515598]100 hours of rust, have tested XP system on prerelease server and I am all hands AGAINST implementing this dumbing down, backwards in time mechanic for the following reasons. [B]1) This will split the community[/B] - some people are waiting for this some people like me are against it. You will have servers operating on BP system and servers on XP system. You do not want to split the community(look for fights below this post for proof) [B]2)Less player interaction[/B] - BP trading will be gone, trading items to BP them will be gone. I have helped and received help when starting out in form of giving out BP's you already learned and that just feels great. You do not want to remove ways of player interaction and turn this game more into a deathmatch arena. [B]3)Xp system is less fun[/B] - BP farming gives you alot of action, is harsh and rewarding as hell. Just remember that mini-orgasm from a C4 bp you got in a barrel. Research tables are also fun and add a depth to the game. There is a versatility with your progression and possibilities. More stuff for you to do and explore. % based research adds a gambling aspect to the game wich is also kinda fun or at least gives you emotion. In contrary to all that we have slow, repetetive progresasion from tree bashing... You do not want to remove depth, exploration and versatility from the game. [B]4)Increased playsessions[/B] - this game already requires long playsessions. To set up a safe place so you can logout takes 1 to 2 hours (1x2 stone walls, sheet metal doors with airlock). With XP system you need 4-5 hours to set yourself for logging off. This will be very discouraging to return after a wipe or start a game on new server. I know many people dont care about saving the stuff and play the game differently but alot of people like me have a need to build up and save loot before exiting. This lures into very long playsessions which i rather would not be sucked into. [B]5)Some XP mechanics makes no sense[/B] - i am not trying to chase realism in games but things have to make sense within their own games boundaries. There will always be struggle between balance, credibility and fun. This is how you get salvaged shelves on lv 15 and other inconsistencies. You dont want the game to be confusing and self contradicting. (Welcome to Rust where you have to survive by gathering resources for days to be able to craft a beanie hat).BP system is at least somewhat convenient in justifying progression. [B]6)Advantage to high level players and clans[/B] - self explanatory. You cant defend yourself when starting out or even when having somewhat of a base becase you cant even craft a bow or a pipe shotgun. Clans will have high lvl crafters or will be splitting research paths between members and will be getting even more advantage that they already have from the numbers. People who are starting out will be destroyed and will have a long time before they can get full experience. [B]7)Killing nakeds[/B] - many people dont read guides and update notes and same as me will automatically think killing people gives XP, because why shouldn't it if killing anything else does(see point 5). This will unintentionally give incentive to kill freshspawns and i know this was mentioned to be balanced out with some mechanics but will most players know about it? [B]TL;DR - Game has a lot of issues to be addressed. XP system will add even more and is in general NOT FUN if you compare it to BP system.[/B][/QUOTE] I also would like to give you my view to the XP system. Since I played the pre release branch (when the XP system got introduced) I am for sure never going to play with the BP system again. (unless the devs are removing the XP system) But I think it is very good and it opens a lot of doors to even better stuff! Now for your arguments: 1. As SulliG99 mentioned, the current community is already split. If the BP system disappears or it becomes some kind of a plug in for modded server almost everybody will forget it after 3/4 months. I don't like the fact that many people are complaining about the new updates on beforehand without trying the new stuff! I guess that many of them are still going to like the XP system while they are now tearing it apart. 2. I think there is even more player interaction. If you need a waterpipe shotgun you have to reach level 15, which is like 10 hours of gameplay (at least how I play it). You can rush to it within 3 hours and than starting to place yourself a home, but then you probably lost everything till your 15th level. So now you have the split, you can trade your waterpipe shotgun with someone who was gathering some resources and got a home. And this is just 1 example, I guess that if you want some high tier stuff which you can't make for the coming 10 levels, you will come back many times to get it from another person. Kill on sight might even be reduced as well since someone alive might be more useful than someone death! If he hasn't got anything in his inventory, but he can make you a nice pickaxe with your resources... Let's see. (I usually avoid player interaction, so this is not my experience, but this is what I guess that will happen) 3. XP is more fun! You still get the little orgasm when you find yourself an AK in a barrel. I can tell out of experience! (Now my AK is run out of ammo, so I have to go even more often to the rad town to get myself some ammo which I can't make) Also hitting barrels and opening crates is providing more XP than hitting trees! 4. This one I can't disagree. You really need to be there for 2-3 hours to set yourself a nice cozy home which is not harmed when you log back in. But I don't mind, I just plan to play Rust and tell my girlfriend to not bother me for the upcoming 3 hours. 5. The balance is even better in my opinion. Salvaged shelves on level 15 are okay for me. Now you have to deal even more difficulties like how to use your space even more useful. This is a nice way of working. Besides that, now you know how hard you need to work to get some of the stuff. Before you could have wasted 10 hours for finding that one and only BP while someone else got it in 10 minutes. 6. Clans don't have the advantage right now, since everybody has to play before they can make the high end stuff. Before you could log in after 5 days, get all the BP's from your clanmates and have the advantage over everybody else. 7. I guess this will be known very soon and will not be that much of a problem. And besides that, it doesn't matter that much when you got killed as a naked. Why? Because you still take something with you when you start all over: your XP. So if you have harvested 1000 wood and 1000 stone and some other stuff you are already level 5 or so, if you go all over again you are probably level 7 and you can make the bow and be more dangerous yourself. That is just my opinion. I really like the XP system and the sooner it gets to the main branch, the better it is! (in my opinion)

I just want to know why they spend all this time updating "Dungeons" (radtowns) and then they are just gonna take all the bps out of the game anyways? what? Just get it over with Gary, make a new map, nothing but flat ground and resource nodes. Because all they are doing is dumbing the game down is how I feel. And there will just be more and more modded servers and less and less vanilla servers in the future

Reviewing your arguments. I can see that you are trying to support devs but they are clearly on the wrong rail. So support them by stresstesting their ideas and not by finding excuses or poor arguments to defend them. I can see their position too. They need new investments and monies so they hope to attract new and returning players but their coming will be short. In return you will lose your constant playerbase. 1)[QUOTE=mrknifey;50516476]the community is always split.[/QUOTE] Reacurring thing you all say which is not even an argument. What do you mean by saying that? Is it that the community cant be more split than it is now? You'll see. 2)You counter that by saying people would still trade items. Yeah, but that we already have. Removing BP system is going to make less stuff to do, not more. 3)[QUOTE]You still get the little orgasm when you find yourself an AK in a barrel.[/QUOTE] Completely opposite. You will be enraged finding AK with 3 bullets and then realizing you cant craft ammo or even save it because you cant even build a proper base until you farmed xp for 10 hours(literary). [QUOTE]Xp System is less fun. I played on the test branch and i disagree it was very good in my oppinion.[/QUOTE] You just played rust with slower progression and with less features. It may be fun for you but it is a downgrade nevertheless. 4)[QUOTE]Its still getting tweeked[/QUOTE] And will keep getting tweaked after release since its coming very soon. The playsession length will increase and as a result and will be very discouraging. 5)[QUOTE]Both of these progression ways make no sense imagine throwing some scraps together and saying "duh no i know how an rocket launcher works!"[/QUOTE] Also reaccuring argument that bashes BP system. Its not perfect but it makes more sense than learning how to craft a rocket launcher by bashing rocks and killing bears. Also knowing how to program a codelock way before you can knit a beanie hat. 6)[QUOTE]still the same if you join an server youre in an disatvantage [/QUOTE] You can negate that within an hour by getting basic BP's. Even without it you can do wonders with a bow or a pipe. Now you have to grind XP for hours to get a chance to stand off against progressed players. And how? in very tidious way. Bashing trees and rocks. I was wrong on XP system giving advantage to the clans. They will have it regardless. 7)[QUOTE]KOS, especially of nakeds is already rampant[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]We killed nakeds in Legacy it will never change[/QUOTE] Yeah not an argument too. Xp system unintentionally will increase killings. [B]All you guys are saying that if things are bad then they cant get any worse. You are wrong. In general XP system is not an addition. Its is removing depth and uniqueness from the game. [/B]

[QUOTE=zanis100;50545888]Reviewing your arguments. I can see that you are trying to support devs but they are clearly on the wrong rail. So support them by stresstesting their ideas and not by finding excuses or poor arguments to defend them. I can see their position too. They need new investments and monies so they hope to attract new and returning players but their coming will be short. In return you will lose your constant playerbase. 1) Reacurring thing you all say which is not even an argument. What do you mean by saying that? Is it that the community cant be more split than it is now? You'll see. 2)You counter that by saying people would still trade items. Yeah, but that we already have. Removing BP system is going to make less stuff to do, not more. 3) Completely opposite. You will be enraged finding AK with 3 bullets and then realizing you cant craft ammo or even save it because you cant even build a proper base until you farmed xp for 10 hours(literary). You just played rust with slower progression and with less features. It may be fun for you but it is a downgrade nevertheless. 4) And will keep getting tweaked after release since its coming very soon. The playsession length will increase and as a result and will be very discouraging. 5) Also reaccuring argument that bashes BP system. Its not perfect but it makes more sense than learning how to craft a rocket launcher by bashing rocks and killing bears. Also knowing how to program a codelock way before you can knit a beanie hat. 6) You can negate that within an hour by getting basic BP's. Even without it you can do wonders with a bow or a pipe. Now you have to grind XP for hours to get a chance to stand off against progressed players. And how? in very tidious way. Bashing trees and rocks. I was wrong on XP system giving advantage to the clans. They will have it regardless. 7) Yeah not an argument too. Xp system unintentionally will increase killings. [B]All you guys are saying that if things are bad then they cant get any worse. You are wrong. In general XP system is not an addition. Its is removing depth and uniqueness from the game. [/B][/QUOTE] It's removing dumb luck from the game, and that's a good thing.

Hello everybody! I have a suggestion for the XP system. I propose to give server administrators can choose to include XP system on the server or not. And then, players who do not like XP system will play on these servers. I think it would be right. [I]Thx[/I]

i think it's a good thing. only time will tell.

[QUOTE=Zipper Bear;50546009]It's removing dumb luck from the game, and that's a good thing.[/QUOTE] dumb luck? Is there a smart luck? If removing it from the game is good then why was it bad? This is not a competitive game, its meant to be harsh and is about survival. Sorry to bring it to you but luck is crucial part of survival. You are bringing so stupid arguments I am starting to think dumbing this game down is a good idea because you know... game must get on its players level.

Xp system may actually kill the game because the bp system is as if u were to hit a barrel in real life and find a construction paper where is shows a recipe to a gun/tool/clothing, unlike the xp system u will have to farm and out of the blue know how to make a hatchet which makes no logical sense. The game was made for survival and I didn't buy it so that I would have to play a unrealistic game, I expected more than this new update. So I am not someone to look forward to this update and this will NOT make clans, it wall make solo people now cause bps were to farm in groups and share the bo frags, now it's all xp so that is just horrible.

I think there are some points that the OP hasn't taken into consideration. Player interaction will simply change from trading BPS to trading actual items - a naked could for instance trade 5k wood for a Thompson. For instance. Larger clans will find themselves doing hard graft instead of having slaves to do it for them. Else they simply won't level up, this brings clans down a level (though of course there will always be advantages in numbers). Killing nakeds under the assumption you will get XP will be brief as one can quickly see that it isn't counting toward your XP. Futher to that another way of looking at it is that simply there is less reason to kill a naked, as they won't have BPs and on top of that there is more benefit in mining 1k stone yourself (for the XP) than taking 1k stone from a naked and gaining nothing.

Play Rust like it's a new game after every update. Play it how it is, not how it was.

Says this... [QUOTE=zanis100;50548878]You are bringing so stupid arguments...[/QUOTE] Right after saying this... [QUOTE=zanis100;50548878]dumb luck? Is there a smart luck? If removing it from the game is good then why was it bad? This is not a competitive game, its meant to be harsh and is about survival. Sorry to bring it to you but luck is crucial part of survival. [/QUOTE] Dumb luck is when you count on luck as being a crucial part of survival. It's not, and anyone who survives despite not knowing what they are doing are extremely lucky, and exactly why it's called dumb luck. Knowledge, adaptability, perseverance...those are crucial to survival. Those traits allow someone who knows what they are doing to capitalize on good luck and overcome bad luck. Those that rely on dumb luck end up dying. Also, at it's core, Rust pits players against each other to survive. That is exactly what competitive is. Removing luck from the game isn't bad. Giving players a clear path of progression allows them to develop their own goals and work towards them despite any of the adversities they might encounter while....competing against other players.

And you still have luck when you find yourself a good place with a lot of trees and a lot of rock nodes, because those places are a constant factor of XP for you, which is still a part of dumb luck! And to the argument of finding an AK without ammo, well you could come back and find yourself more ammo. So Rad town are still useful. You could trade them, so trading will still be there. Or you could level up to level 18 and make them yourself. The AK is available at level 31 (I believe), so there are 13 levels where you can use it without actually the ability to make it!

I haven't played on the prereleased branch yet but how is the xp system currently working? I heard from someone that crafting an item yourself and using it gives you full XP but if someone else uses the item you crafted you still get half xp from it, is it true?

[QUOTE=DCWarHound;50554297]I haven't played on the prereleased branch yet but how is the xp system currently working? I heard from someone that crafting an item yourself and using it gives you full XP but if someone else uses the item you crafted you still get half xp from it, is it true?[/QUOTE] In my opinion it is very nice! There must be some little balance to tweak the drawbacks, but then it is a masterpiece! How does the XP system work in a short summary: Everything is the same, except for blueprints, they are now obtainable by level. So if you start you are level 1 and have 0 XP. When you start to gather stuff you will gain 2 types of XP, I call them XP (A) and XP (B). Both types of XP are gathered with a certain rate, you get it from killing animals, looting barrels/boxes, harvesting and gathering resources. If you gain enough XP (A) you'll automatically level up, so after cutting a whole tree you become level 2. The higher your level the more XP (A) it needs before you enter the next level. XP (B) are just numbers and are collected with the same rate at every level. E.g. so cutting 1 tree gives 1 XP (B) at level 1, but also at level 50. XP (B) can be spend to unlock certain items. So if you want to be able to craft a stone hatchet you need to be level 3 and spend 2 XP (B) to unlock that item. C4 for instance takes 31 XP (B) and you must be level 25 before you can unlock this item. The dev team currently made it such that you're able to unlock approx. 66% of the items right when you hit your new level (XP (A)). This causes you to decide if you want to spend your XP (B) directly when you've become a higher level or that you want to save it for the next level where maybe even better stuff comes available. That's just in a small overview how the current XP system works. And I really like it. Last update they included the lending factor. So if you have a stone hatchet and it is being used, the XP (A) and XP (B) will be divided by the following three people: the one who collected the resources for the item, the one who crafted the item and the one who is using it. So if you collected the resources, and crafted the item, got killed. You still get 66% of the XP when you're murderer is using your tools. This is truly a good thing (IMO). Since you can ask someone for a hatchet (available at level 9), getting 25 wood instead of 20, but getting 66% less XP as well. Now with these things you really have to choose for certain strategies that fits your type of gameplay; do you want to spend all your XP (B) right away, do you want to use a better item, but crafted by someone else, and so on...

[QUOTE=Icemen40;50554354]In my opinion it is very nice! There must be some little balance to tweak the drawbacks, but then it is a masterpiece! How does the XP system work in a short summary: Everything is the same, except for blueprints, they are now obtainable by level. So if you start you are level 1 and have 0 XP. When you start to gather stuff you will gain 2 types of XP, I call them XP (A) and XP (B). Both types of XP are gathered with a certain rate, you get it from killing animals, looting barrels/boxes, harvesting and gathering resources. If you gain enough XP (A) you'll automatically level up, so after cutting a whole tree you become level 2. The higher your level the more XP (A) it needs before you enter the next level. XP (B) are just numbers and are collected with the same rate at every level. E.g. so cutting 1 tree gives 1 XP (B) at level 1, but also at level 50. XP (B) can be spend to unlock certain items. So if you want to be able to craft a stone hatchet you need to be level 3 and spend 2 XP (B) to unlock that item. C4 for instance takes 31 XP (B) and you must be level 25 before you can unlock this item. The dev team currently made it such that you're able to unlock approx. 66% of the items right when you hit your new level (XP (A)). This causes you to decide if you want to spend your XP (B) directly when you've become a higher level or that you want to save it for the next level where maybe even better stuff comes available. That's just in a small overview how the current XP system works. And I really like it. Last update they included the lending factor. So if you have a stone hatchet and it is being used, the XP (A) and XP (B) will be divided by the following three people: the one who collected the resources for the item, the one who crafted the item and the one who is using it. So if you collected the resources, and crafted the item, got killed. You still get 66% of the XP when you're murderer is using your tools. This is truly a good thing (IMO). Since you can ask someone for a hatchet (available at level 9), getting 25 wood instead of 20, but getting 66% less XP as well. Now with these things you really have to choose for certain strategies that fits your type of gameplay; do you want to spend all your XP (B) right away, do you want to use a better item, but crafted by someone else, and so on...[/QUOTE] Thank you, what would stop me from putting random boxes around the map and putting in random items that nakeds might find useful to boost my XP gain? Do you still get XP when you are offline and someone uses your tools?

[QUOTE=DCWarHound;50554475]Thank you, what would stop me from putting random boxes around the map and putting in random items that nakeds might find useful to boost my XP gain? Do you still get XP when you are offline and someone uses your tools?[/QUOTE] I can't tell from experience, but as far as I understand the system: yes you still get the XP. And yes, you can spam all world with your tools. The only downside is that people might despawn your stuff and you end up losing a lot of resources for nothing!

[QUOTE=Icemen40;50554560]I can't tell from experience, but as far as I understand the system: yes you still get the XP. And yes, you can spam all world with your tools. The only downside is that people might despawn your stuff and you end up losing a lot of resources for nothing![/QUOTE] Small price to pay for free XP while offline. It's basically 10min of farming for 10x or so tools, and you can always hide the crates in where people don't look unless they are farming. I doubt a clan would make it their mission to look for every crate in the area. BTW do items list who crafted them? If not then it might be a good idea to leave items in raided bases so they can not only start up again so they won't leave the server but also give you some free XP.

I give up. You cant win emotional reasoning with arguments. And by that i mean sentence below that people will agree with just because its beautifully crafted. [QUOTE]Play Rust like it's a new game after every update. Play it how it is, not how it was.[/QUOTE] This was an OK discussion though. I went little silly when mentioned naked killing and clans getting advantage from XP system. That i agree was wrong. I guess we will see. Its going to be hard time for many though. Also consider this a doomsaying post. Xp system will be gone not so long after release but so will many players.

[QUOTE=zanis100;50557571]I give up. You cant win emotional reasoning with arguments. And by that i mean sentence below that people will agree with just because its beautifully crafted. This was an OK discussion though. I went little silly when mentioned naked killing and clans getting advantage from XP system. That i agree was wrong. I guess we will see. Its going to be hard time for many though. Also consider this a doomsaying post. Xp system will be gone not so long after release but so will many players.[/QUOTE] Nobody wins an argument in here. We're just discussing about how it is going to be. I like the XP system. I don't like the BP system and I mentioned the reasons for that. You won't like the XP system and you've stated your reasons as well. Some of the people will find more sense in your arguments and others in mine. In the end we all have to try it. Luckily for me it is something that I really like. Unlucky for you it is something you don't like that much. I truly never want anything such as cars, maybe you do. The fun part of Rust is that is changing every week! So we can say that every week a major part of the community will stop playing, but another part is coming again to play Rust again. As far as I am into the stats, the numbers of people playing Rust remains more or less equal or is slightly increasing after every update. So maybe if you really don't like the XP system and stop playing Rust next month, eventually you hear something about stuff you really like and you come back start playing again. That is how Rust currently works! And one big rule for Rust: Look carefully around you, because how you see the world today, will be the last time you've ever saw it.

people should wait with their critique till the actuall main release of it.

I would just like to ask how many would miss going out searching for blue prints as much as me ?

[QUOTE=Sneak2;50564627]I would just like to ask how many would miss going out searching for blue prints as much as me ?[/QUOTE] I hated having to find blue prints.