Foundations and Pillars need more durability - Rust

Foundations and pillars needs to have atleast double the durability as the normal building block (Walls, Ceilings, Stairs, etc). For instance: Wood Structures: Normal Building Blocks - 250; Foundations/Pillars - 500; Stone Structures: Normal Building Blocks - 500; Foundations/Pillars - 1000; Armored Structures: Normal Building Blocks - 1000; Foundations/Pillars - 2000; etc. My reason for this is, some people while raiding, like to troll people and just destroy the foundations to see the whole house crumble. Even I have done this before, some guy on a server I used to play on, had a 3x2 house. But it was huge; probably like 8-10 stories tall, and it was fully upgraded to armored. But all it took was 8-10 at his foundations to make his whole house crumble. I know in previous builds of the new rust, foundations used to have A LOT more durability than other structures. Anyway, support structures (for stability) should have a lot more durability. Edit: Twig structures can all have the same durability (doesn't really matter).

Building that high off a 2x3 is not the best approach. He should have increased the footprint to make it harder. You can't stop it happening with enough C4 but 3x2 makes it far too easy.

The problem with small tower builds is simply people do that to prevent the "twig tower" raid. The bigger the base its footprint the more resources you need as you go higher. I also do not understand why a stone wall is so "thin". People build castles and they look like castles but the walls are only twice as protective as wood. From a historical perspective its kind of "strange" as most castles had 1m to 5m+ thick walls! Even if you build in layers, the moment people breach the first thin layer, it opens up a lot of your structure's stability. Wish there was "normal" stone wall and "full" block stone walls. But then the raiders will complain again how unfair it is for them, as it will take longer to get in. Frankly ... some experiments show: * It takes me maybe 5 to 8 hours to build a big base ( half unfinished on the inside ) and it got raided in 20min with C4 + hacking time by 3 people ( and it had a massive amount of locked doors / complex layout etc ). Assuming nobody is online to defend it. * Another base got breached even faster with C4. Even with the reduced C4 clans seem to only need a few days to stockpile so much C4 / AK47's etc that other people can hardly compete in there base defending. The only real "safe" bases are rock bases with no entrances on the ground or pure water bases ( because you can not climb in water onto foundations that are slightly higher then the water when swimming ). Those are also semi cheats in the defense point of view. My ground level bases always get hit hard and while i can frustrate them, the damage they do takes hours to repair ( not counting the resources stolen ). I see a lot of raiders complaining how unfair it is for them and how some clans can make there bases impenetrable ( mostly because of defenders ) but most other players do not get the same luxury of having people 24/7 awake / defending the base. Even most youtube video's show this discrepancy between the time needed to raid and actually build / resource gather. Hunters / raiders in general after a few minor raids have so much processed goods that C4 becomes so common for them. And then things happen like neel11 points out. None-stop C4, destroying bases. And base builders need to make stupid structures to delay those attackers, despite they are not realistic structures ( overly complex or also semi-cheat like rock bases or build up's ) just to deal with C4 in the game. Even with the weaker C4 its still so easy to get raided hard by very few people.

[QUOTE=benjiro;47427573]I see a lot of raiders complaining how unfair it is for them ...[/QUOTE] I know, you spend up to 8 hours building a base, and then raiders will bitch and moan that it takes them more than 20 mins to raid it ... FFS!

[QUOTE=neil.hillman;47428414]I know, you spend up to 8 hours building a base, and then raiders will bitch and moan that it takes them more than 20 mins to raid it ... FFS![/QUOTE] Your forgetting the 8hrs it took them to craft the C4 that they blew up in 20 minutes. It takes 40 minutes to craft the 1250 gunpowder you need to make 1xC4 and you have to mine & smelt the sulphur first.

[QUOTE=IanH;47428520]Your forgetting the 8hrs it took them to craft the C4 that they blew up in 20 minutes. It takes 40 minutes to craft the 1250 gunpowder you need to make 1xC4 and you have to mine & smelt the sulphur first.[/QUOTE] You mine the sulfur while you build your base to begin with. Anyone who puts an iota of effort into their base should have plenty of sulfur by the time they're ready for crafting C4 to raid other people.

[QUOTE=deputydawg;47428564]You mine the sulfur while you build your base to begin with. Anyone who puts an iota of effort into their base should have plenty of sulfur by the time they're ready for crafting C4 to raid other people.[/QUOTE] True you will have enough to craft some C4 but I still find I've lost the will to live by the time I've crafted enough C4 to raid a decent sized base & escape. And if you want to carry on raiding armoured bases you'll have to mine more sulphur. Very rare that a raid is economically worth it though, it's really more a case of what else is there to do.

[QUOTE=IanH;47428683]True you will have enough to craft some C4 but I still find I've lost the will to live by the time I've crafted enough C4 to raid a decent sized base & escape. And if you want to carry on raiding armoured bases you'll have to mine more sulphur. Very rare that a raid is economically worth it though, it's really more a case of what else is there to do.[/QUOTE] I find the best bases to raid are the one transitioning from stone to armoured, there's usually plenty of sulfur kicking about in their storage boxes. My friend and I currently have over 20k sulfur, but that's from a mixture of farming and mostly wooden door tool raids, our server BP wiped recently and we haven't found the C4 BP yet.

[QUOTE=IanH;47428520]Your forgetting the 8hrs it took them to craft the C4 that they blew up in 20 minutes. It takes 40 minutes to craft the 1250 gunpowder you need to make 1xC4 and you have to mine & smelt the sulphur first.[/QUOTE] That is actually a non-argument as a lot of raiders will check out your furnaces as the first thing to do. And take all your processed metal / sulfur. I do not see a lot of raiders taking unprocessed materials ( after a few days. If they take them, it because they got space to spare in there inventory ). Check out a lot of youtube movies to see the "raiders" perspective. And you can hear them say: "hey, this already pays for all the C4 we used" or some other comments. Also... in order to get those unprocessed materials you do spend a lot of time mining. Then processing them. You spend time building your base. Somewhere in between they raid. They get a lot of processed materials and only need to spend time: a) re-crafting there C4 b) Raiding smaller players with less defenses for there resources. And then they go after big players again. And do not ask me where they get some of those resources. When i play solo, i have a extreme difficult time to get the needed 100 processed fuel to build just [B]one[/B] furnace ( and that is also with playing 10 or 15 hours / day ). Let alone a lot of the BP etc ... Yet you see 3 days after a wipe that clans have 10 to 15 furnaces processing sulfur etc. This allows them to quickly penetrate lesser players there base = more resources = more processed = more c4 production = ... ---- Armored bases are so wasteful in resources that its crazy. Lets say you have a 10 by 10 base. That means you have 1 door + 9 + 10 + 10 +10 pieces to build just for ONE level ( 39 ). You require for armored: 200 wood, 200 stone and 200 processed metal. Just for one level on a relative small base you require then: 7800 wood, 7800 stone and 7800 processed metal. While the rock and stone is doable with a lot of time. The processed metal takes a long time. And that is one outer wall. Nothing inside, no levels, no floors, nothing. The problem that you state IanH is you lost the will because your one guy. When you split the crafting for C4 over a bunch of guys while they raid or do other things = it goes fast. Very fast. Then they raid with 3 or 4 people, each with 10 C4 and no base can survive attacks like that. You as a single player if your lucky have just some defenses in place and take maybe 3 or 4 C4's to have your base penetrated. And there goes your few C4's, sulfur, metals. And you can start again while they then have the resources to raid even bigger targets. In simple terms, no matter how good you are or as much time you put in as a small player or a small group, you become nothing but farming materials for the bigger guys. Notice how you always will have 3 or 4 clans that dominate a servers. Or you can have the bigger clans even twice raid you on a single day. That is the disadvantage of the game. Its not a survival game. Its not you against nature anymore but you the "cattle" vs the biggest clans. Your almost forced to join a clan and do what the clan wants. Some servers even promote this with teleportations. tpr / tpa ... They raid your base, teleport back to there home base ( somebody there ). Offload your stuff and teleport back to a guy still at your base. Instead of wasting a lot of time running maybe 20 or 30 minutes from there base to your location, they can clean you out faster then anything. And its so much fun getting shot in the back with a AK47 when all you got is a half naked body with a bow and arrows, no armor, no nothing on any high level. While your opponend is carrying armor, ak47, c4 etc ... And you can not do anything against it beyond becoming a clan slave. In my eyes rust is at the first day after a wipe a survival game. You against nature, cold, etc ... but after day two its already more battle royal. And day three those who have not clan-up are nothing but farming materials. And you need to semi-cheat by rock building or water building to survive ( and even that is no sure thing ).

[QUOTE=IanH;47428520]Your forgetting the 8hrs it took them to craft the C4 that they blew up in 20 minutes. It takes 40 minutes to craft the 1250 gunpowder you need to make 1xC4 and you have to mine & smelt the sulphur first.[/QUOTE] Everytime I return to my base, the first thing I do is empty the sulfur from my furnaces and queue up about 20+ gunpowder. Then I restock my furnaces with wood and sulfur, cook some meat, repair my weapons and tools, and then drop off the gunpowder I have just crafted before leaving the base again. If you are organized and plan ahead, there is no reason you should be stuck indoors crafting gunpowder for hours at a time.

[QUOTE=neil.hillman;47435632]If you are organized and plan ahead, there is no reason you should be stuck indoors crafting gunpowder for hours at a time.[/QUOTE] That's crazy talk hillman. All that planning and thinking.

There are lots of threads at the moment about raiding - too easy, too hard, buildings too strong, not strong enough, twig towers etc etc. They come up several times a week and rarely add anything new to the discussion. I think pretty much everyone can agree that raiding and the end game suck a bit at the moment but I don't see any easy solutions. I'm hoping that the devs are clever enough to have a plan, but I sort of suspect that they're just hoping for an epiphany that gets them out of the hole they've dug with the building mechanics. The best outcome I think will be a raid game that doesn't destroy / clean out bases & allows the builder to recover and stay in the game to fight on. In the meantime I think the best way is to adapt & enjoy what's there whether that's part of a clan at war with another clan or a peaceful community fighting off bad guys or a solo player trying to survive or a builder trying to model the Taj Mahal. It can be quite a creative game as well as running round knocking guys on the head with a rock. Personally I've been giving it a rest since the last update - I've been wasting way way too much time on it & needed to get a life. :smile:

[QUOTE=neel11;47426038]Foundations and pillars needs to have atleast double the durability as the normal building block (Walls, Ceilings, Stairs, etc). For instance: Wood Structures: Normal Building Blocks - 250; Foundations/Pillars - 500; Stone Structures: Normal Building Blocks - 500; Foundations/Pillars - 1000; Armored Structures: Normal Building Blocks - 1000; Foundations/Pillars - 2000; etc. My reason for this is, some people while raiding, like to troll people and just destroy the foundations to see the whole house crumble. Even I have done this before, some guy on a server I used to play on, had a 3x2 house. But it was huge; probably like 8-10 stories tall, and it was fully upgraded to armored. But all it took was 8-10 at his foundations to make his whole house crumble. I know in previous builds of the new rust, foundations used to have A LOT more durability than other structures. Anyway, support structures (for stability) should have a lot more durability. Edit: Twig structures can all have the same durability (doesn't really matter).[/QUOTE] you can prevent this by building a proper base. i feel safe inside a simple dodecagonal tower because the ground and first floor are full of useless walls who are there just to absord c4 damage.