Why is downtown so common. - Developers

Why is rp_downtown so common? My look on things is that nobody will join a new map that is unheard of. Therefore most people have to use the most used maps and not the most underused maps and those underused maps can be really damn good. Post you opinion and why you think no one will join a new map.

In all honesty I don't know why, It may be just a map that finds that magic button, I bet if a new version of the map came out they wouldn't even bother downloading it; I really want to see rp_littletown be used a bit more. Dark rp is just so stagnant, I'd like some insight on it because it just seems so dumb.

V6 was realesed two months ago and i see only one server with it and not one person has joined it. If one day everybody changed the map to little town then maybe it would get popular but that is not going to happen.

Because people are too lazy to wait for another map to download.

There's always been at least one immensely popular rp map, when I started playing they were ovicity and hometown 1999. People will move on eventually.

It is a shame but I think it's the sheer simplicity and functionality. I can't count how many times I've wanted to see more rp on apocalypse or atomic and I myself am making my map which I think will be more popular for individuals and lan parties than rp. I hope I'm wrong but people just like it straight-forward and no hassle over quality. I guess once it's become familiar it's like moving house for some people.

[QUOTE=Trixie;40441668]Because people are too lazy to wait for another map to download.[/QUOTE] People are too lazy to wait for a LARGE map to download. If your server already has a decent player base, switching maps isn't a huge issue. People already have you in their history, and you have enough devoted players to keep you high on the player list. The problem is that maps like littletown are extremely large (~100mb zipped, ~300 unzipped). At this size, even people with great connections and fastDL can expect minutes of extra loading time. Without FastDL, it can be around a half hour. For rather obscure, if amazing, community maps, this means that people need to already know of the map, and want to play on the server badly enough to download it. Most people don't. This is why downtown, I think, is so popular. It offers a lot of content, at a small download size (10-20mb zipped). New maps CAN get into this, as Bangclaw has. It's got many buildings, a massive sewer, and because it uses mostly default textures, it's only around 18mb zipped (or it's 25, I cannot check at the moment). Because of all this, unless an IMMENSELY popular server switches to a map like littletown, or the littletown dev makes a smaller version using less custom soundscapes and the like to get it down to a more manageable size (~100mb unzipped), I don't see it ever becoming widely used. Not because of its quality, but because of it's size versus the size and features of the actual map. TLDR: Maps like bangclaw and downtown are ugly, but offer a lot of space and content at only around 20mb a map. Maps like littletown are beautiful, but offer similar amounts of playable space at sizes that aren't feasible to be downloaded from the server, and it sucks because being downloaded from hundreds of servers is what makes a map popular.

Cheap and cheerful could be the term for it.

I will never see the day where a server gets popular off of a different rp map

[QUOTE=nickster50;40443650]I will never see the day where a server gets popular off of a different rp map[/QUOTE] You probably will. I've been playing Garry's Mod since 06, I've seen the popular map go from hometown 1999 to downtown, to the newer versions of downtown and finally Bangclaw. It happens, it just takes a map with the right formula (see my huge ass post above).

[QUOTE=nickster50;40443650]I will never see the day where a server gets popular off of a different rp map[/QUOTE] My server using rp_bangclaw manages to fill 80 slots everyday and stays 60+ for 8-12 hours per day, I think the filesize is a big factor to why some maps don't get used though.

But content on your server is other way around though. You will mostly get more players when you have stuff to download on your server which is twice the time it takes to download a map.

[QUOTE=Fartomatic;40442481]Cheap and cheerful could be the term for it.[/QUOTE] I fully agree, Since i played some HL2 deathmatch with puzzle/coop maps from like: js_puzzle_version8b I don't know if you guys remember these maps but they all have a tag with js__coop_mapname and stuff, and there are alot of them that are puzzles or NPC's spamming in the levels to achieve some buttons to go on etc... They are quite enjoyable to play but they really lack details! It's just so bad that it's terrible. But yet, alot of players join on the server (No idea why) but it seems that people just rather want "el cheapo - yet enjoyable map". And i'm the only one complaining about how bad those maps are and that they are extremely blocky and stuff. Sadly, Nobody reacts at it and just ignores it. This just makes me think about to make my own small coop map for hl2dm but with good DETAILS and more enjoyable than just blocky rooms with NPC_template_makers on the map. That is all.

[QUOTE=snijboer;40446988]I fully agree, Since i played some HL2 deathmatch with puzzle/coop maps from like: js_puzzle_version8b I don't know if you guys remember these maps but they all have a tag with js__coop_mapname and stuff, and there are alot of them that are puzzles or NPC's spamming in the levels to achieve some buttons to go on etc... They are quite enjoyable to play but they really lack details! It's just so bad that it's terrible. But yet, alot of players join on the server (No idea why) but it seems that people just rather want "el cheapo - yet enjoyable map". And i'm the only one complaining about how bad those maps are and that they are extremely blocky and stuff. Sadly, Nobody reacts at it and just ignores it. This just makes me think about to make my own small coop map for hl2dm but with good DETAILS and more enjoyable than just blocky rooms with NPC_template_makers on the map. That is all.[/QUOTE] Bro remember team fortress classic! they had awesome coop maps those were the times man!

[QUOTE=nickster50;40447232]Bro remember team fortress classic! they had awesome coop maps those were the times man![/QUOTE] But now your talking to an much older game than HL2 deathmatch.

I can kind of see why Downtown is so popular. Though I simply cannot understand why the most played played variants of the map are the most poorly designed and unfinished versions, that remove all the vaguely interesting elements from the map .

[QUOTE=Creeper;40448255]I can kind of see why Downtown is so popular. Though I simply cannot understand why the most played played variants of the map are the most poorly designed and unfinished versions, that remove all the vaguely interesting elements from the map .[/QUOTE] Downtown V2 is still the best, most polished version IMO.

[QUOTE=Fartomatic;40442292]It is a shame but I think it's the sheer simplicity and functionality. I can't count how many times I've wanted to see more rp on apocalypse or atomic and I myself am making my map which I think will be more popular for individuals and lan parties than rp. I hope I'm wrong but people just like it straight-forward and no hassle over quality. I guess once it's become familiar it's like moving house for some people.[/QUOTE] this, really. thinking from your average darkroleplayer, they'd want to be close to the general population commonly, with out having to walk from one area to another area, and they wouldn't want a complex, housing area because usually a darkrp server may house only few as 20-40 people. some maps have enough rooms for 100 people, and are very big and separated. a good example would be evocity, usually you'd see most of the people at the city area, and your average money printer players and crime committing players at the industrial/forest areas where only a few are there.

The server that I am super admin on started off on Downtown_v2, once we got really popular, we decided to make out own map. We still hit 64 players a day.

They are mostly created by clans. And i have to say that not every js map is ugly,bad, squared. I also saw some nice edited maps from the orginal HL2 maps to a coop map, and they were pretty fun and enjoyable to play! But here are some bad examples of these horrible maps that were created but yet enjoyable by players: [thumb]http://i42.tinypic.com/51ptfn.jpg[/thumb] "A huge room with no details, only a huge manhack flying around but that is pretty creative" [thumb]http://i41.tinypic.com/jj7eyh.jpg[/thumb] "Long hallways with the same textures and with zombies spawning all over the place" [thumb]http://i44.tinypic.com/10ieypg.jpg[/thumb] "Putting 100s of copies of trees and rocks and blocky buildings" [thumb]http://i39.tinypic.com/24oa9s3.jpg[/thumb] "A huge room but with poles everywhere and physical boxes so the antlionguard can push them at you" These are not yet the worst of the worst because there is some proper lighting and a skybox. I know at some screenshots you need some empty spaces to properly play the level with others. (So you wont get stuck) and so thats why there aren't so much objects. But the details/brushes of the map are so simply made, they've could simply add some more details and so on. Those levels are just simply made to enjoy, but how i see it to enjoy a map is [b]"Great looking level with details".[/b] these levels probably makes you play for a few times with groups of players, but i don't think you will recognize the creator of the map when you finishes it and saying how beautiful the map is. But yeah what do people think about those maps? I have no idea, yet they play those maps. And even me...

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Source 2 update is going to save us :v: [editline]29th April 2013[/editline] (If Garry even decides to update to src2)

[QUOTE=oskutin;40457917]Source 2 update is going to save us :v: [editline]29th April 2013[/editline] (If Garyy even decides to update to src2)[/QUOTE] Source 2 isn't gonna make people want to be more creative lol.

With the way Valve has been supporting mod tools lately I bet we won't get a functional Source 2 SDK for quite a while.

[QUOTE=DaApocalypse;40460580]With the way Valve has been supporting mod tools lately I bet we won't get a functional Source 2 SDK for quite a while.[/QUOTE] That's true. Steam pipe should have been announced to Garry way before it was publicly so he would have been prepared. Anyway ya I don't think we will see source2 sdk until hl3 *cough* I mean until tf2 gets transferred to source2

I used to go on an RP server that changed to map every few hours that was reasonably popular. The most common map picked was a Fallout inspired RP map. It wasn't the most pretty map, but it was fun as hell to play on. When the map started, a race started to see what group of people got a underground vault working (there were three batteries scattered around the map). Then the vault group would basically become a superpower for the rest of the map. I wouldn't mind more interactive RP maps, rather then "safe" bland ones, secrets are the best parts of RP maps imo as long as they aren't too game breaking. I would make one but I have no idea what to base it off.

I hope source 2 is somewhat compatible with this source so all the maps aren't lost for good :/

[QUOTE=oskutin;40457917]Source 2 update is going to save us :v: (If Garry even decides to update to src2)[/QUOTE] What do you mean? Maybe the new engine version will be far more different than the old source has right now. [QUOTE=Fartomatic;40463471]I hope source 2 is somewhat compatible with this source so all the maps aren't lost for good :/[/QUOTE] After many years that valve hasn't released any news for HL3 and the new engine, i'm kinda want a fresh new engine than rather just a few tweaks with the lighting/graphics and stuff. I want to see new graphics, totally new engine. I will be dissapointed if the Source 2 engine is actually almost the same as 1, please i've been playing this game for like 6-8 years and i'm kinda done with those HL2 graphics. But we will see it when Source 2 tech demo's are here. [b]EDIT[/b] Maybe i just went a bit overboard here, but yes i do agree that we hope that it "somehow" will be compatible to use our old source maps to the new one. That will be really handy.

Most likely valve will realase a converter with there source 2. For older maps

[QUOTE=nickster50;40467092]Most likely valve will realase a converter with there source 2. For older maps[/QUOTE] Probably not Valve but if its possible some other person will do it.