So here's my starting position: the current server list in Garry's Mod sucks. Listing off absolutely every gamemode by player count alone is a bad idea for multiple reasons. Lower player count servers aren't noticed (which is a disingenuous way to judge gamemode quality, see: gamemode competition gamemodes), higher-player count servers are the only gamemodes ever immediately noticed (DarkRP and TTT don't need more attention, nor Prop Hunt, nor Murder, etc), and the server list gets incredibly cluttered during high player count hours.
Here's my (minor) idea: Instead of just separating the servers by gamemode, and sorted by player count, we first separate out the gamemodes by self-provided tags, akin to how addons are generally sorted in the workshop. These tags are pre-provided only, and gamemode developers could, if they wanted, select one or a few tags that most accurately describes their gamemode. For example: deathmatch gamemodes, role-playing gamemodes, minigames gamemodes, surf gamemodes, survival gamemodes, etc, with maybe a "Miscellaneous" option for those gamemode developers who don't select one at (either because they're lazy, no tag fits, or the gamemode's dropped).
This accomplishes something that I feel would help less-played modes. Players who want to have a particular experience can choose what tag they most think fits, and from there, they're exposed to the traditional server-choosing experience (but with reduced gamemodes to clutter the menu).
We could additionally add in special tags for events, such as a certain gamemode competition, and highlight them for a month or so.
Thoughts? Other ideas?
In addition to more generalized organization, preprogrammed tags would give an easy way to quick filter the list. Would save time finding servers that appeal to the player's likes by saving these filters locally. On paper it's a good idea.
The tradeoff is when server owners are disingenuous about their server's tags and use incorrect tags, or all tags at once.
You could have a report system for servers that abuse that, but then the report system would be abused/flooded by users against innocent servers for no good reason.
There are a lot of factors to consider when modifying the server list; that's why it's gone so long in the state that it's in right now, really.
> When server owners are disingenuos
I try to use my words as precisely as possible. Server owners are not allowed to have any part of this. This sort of organization would rely solely on the gamemode developers to choose the right tags for the gamemode. This is something we already "trust" any addon uploader to do, with the correct intention. Why not also expand this thinking to the server browser?
You have some very broad categories this could work with, and maybe allowing (and limiting) to 2 tags would work even better, for the gamemodes that feel caught in-between game types.
People who upload addons have nothing to gain from mistagging an addon. Suppose someone tagged something "build" instead of "realism." What's the point?
If the only thing getting in the way of small gamemodes getting recognized is a bunch of lines on the screen full of NicheRP servers (and not just people only wanting to RP), then wouldn't it be better to let people wade through the shit visually instead of making them click around through specific categories to find something they're not specifically looking for?
I don't follow your line of logic here. No it wouldn't be better? As a player who's actively browsed the server browser looking for something entertaining somewhat frequently (due to boredom), I might cry a little if I could outright disable every goddamn RP gamemode from showing up. It's INCREDIBLY frustrating to glaze your eyes over line after line after line of the same gamemode type. And then when you find one interesting but decide against joining and go back to the gamemode list, it resets you at the top... gahhhhh I want to pull my hair out.
Maybe that's why I'm suggesting this, haha. I just hate all RP modes and never want to see them again? I kid, but, I genuinely don't follow your thinking here.
I guess it should be asked how many people who buy Garry's Mod are actually interested in playing unpopular gamemodes? And out of all the people who have ever complained about the server list, how many of those people actually go out and seek new gamemodes to play on?
Hate to be negative Nancy, but those questions can't be answered and serve no purpose except to de-legitimize my point without any substance to the question's intent. What does it matter?
Would that number of people warrant the creation of your category system, and would your system solve anything for these people or just make stuff look better?
I feel the facts: that we can recognize it isn't a perfect system, that we can recognize enough people are annoyed by its inadequacies for it to be a somewhat common topic of complaint on this forum, and, that we can recognize there's better systems we can put in place are reason enough to look at changing it, even if you don't personally feel it is all that necessary.
Would it be forced on all the time?
We still have the legacy browser, don't we? I see no reason why we can't have an "all" category stapled to the top, which looks just like it does now. Again, this would be akin to how the Workshop does it.
And I would like to re-emphasize this kind of sorting allows for new functionality to be in place. I heavily stress our most recent gamemode competition gamemodes as being a fantastic example of the benefit this could provide. All but one died out within the first month of the competition taking place. Imagine, instead, we have a special category for gamemodes that participated in the gamemode competition that's stickied to the top of the categories for every player to see when they're about to join any multiplayer game. All of the sudden, I would wager, the gamemodes see a large influx of players due to the ease of accessibility (and the appeal to play on a gamemode that's "competing" in an event) and they stay in the limelight of players for a long while.
On your first point, then why not just go for local filters instead of premade categories? Who would be responsible for retroactively tagging gamemodes created and forgotten before a category system was put in place?
I'm not throwing questions out there to piss you off, and my questions don't have no substance as you insinuate. Should I add my concerns about retroactive tagging like I mentioned above or will this be a trend?
how many people are clamoring for a new system that would mean every gamemode creator would have to go back and tag their gamemodes to fit its function, even gamemodes that aren't hosted on workshop?
Stop that, please. I'm opposed to your questions because they can't be answered. Who knows? 10? 5000? It doesn't matter, does it? What's the point of asking it?
I don't want to make this thread an angry back-and-forth, because that would entirely nullify any chances of this discussion resulting in anything.
On your first point, then why not just go for local filters instead of premade categories?
Sure, that could work. How do we plan on implementing something like that, a search bar? The problem is, there's a shitload of servers and server owners will try to cheese a system in place for maximum exposure. If it's based on gamemode tags instead of a search bar or local filters, we take the servers out of the equation, which is for the best, imo.
a search bar with the ability to EXCLUDE certain results would be prefered.
IE google
-"RP"
gamemode
Yea same kind of idea, just a different execution.
My problem with THAT is not every type of gamemode follows the same naming sequence. Not every RP gamemode is gonna have "RP" in it, or "role-playing," or anything similar.
That's why I would like tags for the gamemodes. Every developer (which includes myself) is incentivized to tag the right tag(s) because it's in their own best interest.
true but it would be most of them and that would reduce the need for you to scroll by ALOT. even if "rp" is not in the name you can just add more tags things to take out
What about gamemodes you've not heard of before but are of a type you don't care for? Take, for example, Combine Control. I don't like most RP modes. Combine Control is an RP mode. Nothing about the title of that mode indicates it's an RP gamemode. Me joining a server of the gamemode is a waste of my time.
Assuming we're not concerned about ease of implementation (some things would probably be easier to implement than others, certainly), self-defined tags I still feel would work the best. Why bother eliminating anything you don't want to play when you can instead just browse through the 1 or 2 you do want to play?
Maybe I'm not outlining my thoughts clearly enough, or maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're writing.
Server owners don't get one single % of a say where their server shows up. It shows up with the REST of the servers who are ALSO running the same gamemode.
It's on the GAMEMODE DEVELOPER to correctly tag their gamemode appropriately. I can re-outline why they're incentivized to do so if needed, but I hope it's more self-evident.
Now, allowing for multiple tags is certainly an avenue that can be explored. Take something like TTT. What kind of category does it fall under? Role-playing? Shooter-based? Minigame? We shouldn't outright limit a gamemode that may possibly fall under multiple categories, but at the same time, we don't want to let gamemode developers cheese the system either, and tag MORE modes than are needed (and getting unfairly acquired exposure).
As a server owner AND a dev i have to say i could make my server appear anywhere on the list even now. the real question is would someone join a TTT server if it was posted under darkrp? probably not
Right, that's the incentive I'm talking about. Gamemode developers are incentivized to choose the right tag, because that's the best place players are going to look for them.
At the very least it'd be nice to see DarkRP/other RP derivatives grouped together since none of them really offer a massive difference over others besides community, and most of the ones that do offer substantial gameplay changes sit comfortably at the top of the server browser anyway.
If Roleplay had it's own category entirely, a subcategory within it that showed the gamemode name (AuschwitzRP, SlaveRP, MemeRP, etc), and Roleplay gamemodes didn't clutter up the main browser, people who want to play RP can still stay in their own world and people who want to support upcoming gamemodes can find new stuff easily without scrolling through dozens of RP spin-offs.
And speaking of supporting upcoming gamemodes, how about a "show some love" tab as well that shows only gamemodes that have under 5 servers and average low playercounts?
That category would clutter up VERY quickly. 80% of gamemodes, I bet, considering most of them are populated by empty servers.
Isn't that the point of this thread
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