Spy is the most pointless class in Team Fortress 2 - Games

Like the title said. Spy is the most pointless class in Team Fortress 2. His impact on the game is so minimal that if you removed him from the game, nobody would notice. [B]1. Spy is completely hampered by enemy competence[/B] Even if you were the world's best Spy, if the enemy team had an ounce of intelligence and constantly checked their backs and called out Spies whenever they saw them, all your skill invested into the class would be for naught. A Spy is too squishy and relies too much on a dumb opponent to make the best out of his potential. Pyros, Spy's natural enemy and hard counter require minimal skill to work well and a Pyro operating on minimal skill is enough to shut down veteran Spies. This brings us into the next point ..... [B]2. Spy's skill:reward ratio is completely skewered[/B] The skill required for a Spy to excel is insanely high. The time invested into him could be better placed into another class such as Soldier and Demoman. Even if you were a good Spy, luck and basic situational awareness on the enemy team's part would be enough to waste you. [B]3. There is nothing Spy can do, any class can't do better[/B] Spy was designed to spread paranoia into the enemy, assassinate priority targets and slow down enemy advancement. The design and concept was interesting but the execution was horrible on Valve's part. Taking out priority targets? Scout and Sniper can fare much better. Spread paranoia and panic? When the enemy team has half a brain and a Pyro worth his salt, that so-called panic will all but evaporate from the enemy team. Sapping sentries? The effort is, to say the least, too much for such a simple task. Why spend minutes sneaking into the enemy base, jumping at shadows and avoiding enemy hostiles before sapping the buildings only to have all your time wasted by a crit wrench and a couple of whacks ruining all your hard work? Soldiers and Demoman can simply exploit the sentry's blind spots and finish it off faster, quicker and easier than a Spy. To sum up, Spy was a fun concept Valve built but the execution was flawed. Spy should either be removed from the game completely rather than sit as a waste of player slots or Valve should buff up the Spy to be on par with his fellow mercenaries.

Sentry nests Massive knockback means ubers are practically worthless Put a sapper in while the medic and uber friends charge in Massive pushing power ho

Nobody would notice?Engineers, snipers, medics, heavies

[QUOTE=Notsoaveragejoe;32034430]Like the title said. Spy is the most pointless class in Team Fortress 2. His impact on the game is so minimal that if you removed him from the game, nobody would notice. [B]1. Spy is completely hampered by enemy competence[/B] Even if you were the world's best Spy, if the enemy team had an ounce of intelligence and constantly checked their backs and called out Spies whenever they saw them, all your skill invested into the class would be for naught. A Spy is too squishy and relies too much on a dumb opponent to make the best out of his potential. Pyros, Spy's natural enemy and hard counter require minimal skill to work well and a Pyro operating on minimal skill is enough to shut down veteran Spies. This brings us into the next point ..... [B]2. Spy's skill:reward ratio is completely skewered[/B] The skill required for a Spy to excel is insanely high. The time invested into him could be better placed into another class such as Soldier and Demoman. Even if you were a good Spy, luck and basic situational awareness on the enemy team's part would be enough to waste you. [B]3. There is nothing Spy can do, any class can't do better[/B] Spy was designed to spread paranoia into the enemy, assassinate priority targets and slow down enemy advancement. The design and concept was interesting but the execution was horrible on Valve's part. Taking out priority targets? Scout and Sniper can fare much better. Spread paranoia and panic? When the enemy team has half a brain and a Pyro worth his salt, that so-called panic will all but evaporate from the enemy team. Sapping sentries? The effort is, to say the least, too much for such a simple task. Why spend minutes sneaking into the enemy base, jumping at shadows and avoiding enemy hostiles before sapping the buildings only to have all your time wasted by a crit wrench and a couple of whacks ruining all your hard work? Soldiers and Demoman can simply exploit the sentry's blind spots and finish it off faster, quicker and easier than a Spy. To sum up, Spy was a fun concept Valve built but the execution was flawed. Spy should either be removed from the game completely rather than sit as a waste of player slots or Valve should buff up the Spy to be on par with his fellow mercenaries.[/QUOTE] You can say this about ANY of the tf2 classes if they solo, thats why this game is based around teamwork.

[QUOTE=Cajun;32034436]Sentry nests Massive knockback means ubers are practically worthless Put a sapper in while the medic and uber friends charge in Massive pushing power ho[/QUOTE] A Cow Mangler 5000 Soldier can also disable sentries. And to be frank, if your teammates aren't charging in with the Uber and the Medic isn't in front of the patient(thus the sentry will focus fire on the Medic, leaving the Heavy/Soldier/Demoman/whatever to take out the sentry), you're doing it wrong.

"i suck at spy so it must be useless"

[QUOTE] You can say this about ANY of the tf2 classes. [/QUOTE] How so? Each of the classes serve a clearly defined purpose. Scout = Taking out priority targets, capturing the point/intel/pushing the cart, flanking Soldier = General offensive unit Pyro = Multi-purpose offensive support unit Demoman = Area denial and also serves as offensive support Engineer = Defense Heavy = Tank Sniper = Long-range assassination Medic = Keeping the team alive and Ubercharges [QUOTE]"i suck at spy so it must be useless" [/QUOTE] Sorry to burst your bubble, but I have lots of experience with Spy. I can completely break down low-level teams but once the enemy has a Pyro who can rub two brain cells together and gains some basic situational awareness, you're suddenly a wasted player slot.

[QUOTE=Notsoaveragejoe;32034478]How so? Each of the classes serve a clearly defined purpose. Scout = Taking out priority targets, capturing the point/intel/pushing the cart, flanking Soldier = General offensive unit Pyro = Multi-purpose offensive support unit Demoman = Area denial and also serves as offensive support Engineer = Defense Heavy = Tank Sniper = Long-range assassination Medic = Keeping the team alive and Ubercharges[/QUOTE] Spy = Offensive support, taking out priority targets and disabling buildings The Cow Mangler may be able to disable buildings as well, but the spy's sapper does it much better.

Actually, if your team mates are having trouble, and your opponent is distracted, you'll be able to take them out, no problem.

also cow mangler takes like 4-5 seconds and makes you a walking target

[QUOTE=TacticalBacon;32034498]Spy = Offensive support, taking out priority targets and disabling buildings The Cow Mangler may be able to disable buildings as well, but the spy's sapper does it much better.[/QUOTE] It also actually damages it. I always say this, but I'm just not a fan of 1-hit-kills, but without the Spy, every map would have completely different layouts to cater to that absence.

[QUOTE=TacticalBacon;32034498]Spy = Offensive support, taking out priority targets and disabling buildings The Cow Mangler may be able to disable buildings as well, but the spy's sapper does it much better.[/QUOTE] On paper, the sapper does seem to out-do the Cow Mangler. But ingame, a Soldier with the Cow Mangler can still be a threat and push forward with the team. The Spy on the other hand, has to pull off some real Ninja-ry and waste lots of time before sneaking into the sentry nest. It should also be noted a charged Cow Mangler shot can obliterate the Engineer hiding behind the sentry. Sappers can be removed, Cow Mangler shots cannot.

you take out ANY of the characters: total chaos. Without spy, engy nests will rule. Without heavies, you can't really push forward towards enemies, which also ties into medics. The classes are perfect

I think sniper is far more useless than the spy.

[QUOTE=Region;32034536]you take out ANY of the characters: total chaos. Without spy, engy nests will rule. Without heavies, you can't really push forward towards enemies, which also ties into medics. The classes are perfect[/QUOTE] Heavy is fucking [B][I]DEFENSE.[/I][/B] [B][I]WHY DOES NO ONE USE HIM FOR THAT[/I][/B]

[QUOTE=Notsoaveragejoe;32034531]Sappers can be removed, Cow Mangler shots cannot.[/QUOTE] Compression blast Also, Short Circuit

[QUOTE=Hirouzamaki;32034559]Compression blast[/QUOTE] Because we all know that sentries auto-build a Pyro to stand by it all the time.

[QUOTE=Another Hater;32034551]I think sniper is far more useless than the spy.[/QUOTE] Not really, because it allows people to think twice about moving into an open area like a dumbass. Especially when I have my Huntsman ready. :v:

Try not spawn camping them and actually attacking while they`re busy doing something (like killing the shit out of your team)

Sure is 2Fort in here.

Notsoaveragejoe is the most pointless poster on facepunch. i don't need a valid arguement to back my claim up. i'm just going to spout shit since it's popular.

[QUOTE=Colour;32034626]Sure is 2Fort in here.[/QUOTE] I avoid that horrible map, along with Dustbowl and Gold Rush. My point still stands : Spy is pointless. [QUOTE=psyke]Notsoaveragejoe is the most pointless poster on facepunch. i don't need a valid arguement to back my claim up. i'm just going to spout shit since it's popular. [/QUOTE] Psyke is the most pointless poster on facepunch. See I can do it too. If you have nothing to add to the argument, don't spout nonsense.

Isn't this like the 50th spy hating thread? Yes I think it is.

[QUOTE=Izumo199;32034706]Isn't this like the 50th spy hating thread? Yes I think it is.[/QUOTE] Further adding to my argument. Spy is pointless and there are people besides me who agree.

The only thing I agree with is Point #2. A good spy is as useless as a mediocre spy.

I'd take this thread seriously if the OP wasn't posting exclusively from a proxy.

The SPUF infection. It's spreading.

With Spy as my 2nd most played class I will say that I feel you are wrong. I've failed against competent teams before, but all I had to do was shift my paradigm just a little to reap big rewards. Utilize your team as distractions, note where you can be most efficient and when. Spy is the most difficult class to play, but is far from useless.

OP has no idea how even the very basics of [i]Team[/i] Fortress 2 work.

[QUOTE=Leaf Runner;32034819]OP has no idea how even the very basics of [i]Team[/i] Fortress 2 work.[/QUOTE] Then do please enlighten me.