Hey there. This is an upcoming game I'm working on. After doing some extensive research, it appears to have the most realistic driving and AI behaviour known to man. Here's a vid showing a car-chase:
[video=vimeo;151343852]https://vimeo.com/151343852[/video]
Have you seen something comparable, and what do you think of it?
Thanks :smile:
pics:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/zQhTUzf.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/G1NEcz3.gif?1[/img]
[img]http://i.imgur.com/PYEOHrA.gif[/img]
Reading back my own blurbs in my first post here, I feel it's a somewhat dry introduction I've made. Apologies for that. Here are more details about the game:
Based on my upcoming short animation film, where the night devours the day after an experiment gone wrong, the game is a driving exploration adventure where the player is set to discover what happened to all lifeforms when sunlight disappeared. One of the core gameplay elements is "driving survival", where the player is implicated in intense car-chases.
One of my biggest priorities was to achieve a believable, human-like behavior of the NPC drivers. For me and other gamers with whom I've discussed this, one thing that is disappointing and immersion-braking in open-world driving games is bad AI. It's either too dumb or strongly cheating the physics, or both. Take Driver:SF for example. You can drive like a god but the cop cars chasing you will have extraterrestrial acceleration capabilities, coupled with a car mass of a locomotive and tires covered with suction cups. It just feels too unfair, and although a subjective notion: not fun.
So, I'm kind of proud of what I've achieved so far, the AI driving featured in the above gameplay video. And I would love to read what you think and feel about this subject :smile:
Cheers
teaser for the animation film:
[video=youtube;-T6mLqViq7I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-T6mLqViq7I[/video]
my last animation film (2010, full length) best viewed after smoking the devil's weed :smug:
[video=vimeo;80706397]https://vimeo.com/80706397[/video]
So if I'm reading you right, you have a kind of AI that is fully natural with no "cheat" abilities, but it's still good enough to keep up with a player?
That sounds like a hell of a feat on its own.
yea honestly im used to people posting bs here, but this looks pretty fucking mint all around. I was wondering why everything felt like almost silent hill-ish, thanks for explaining the plot some!
[editline]14th January 2016[/editline]
just watched your last film, holy shit dude im digging your style HARD.
Looks very good, I don't like the gritty/noise thing going on, I realize it's probably a stylistic choice but
it seems to me that it detracts the overall quality. (First thought when I saw the pictures was "Is this source?")
I'd suggest toning down the brightness and adding more lights.
It would help things pop-out and generally make it look better for minimal effort.
With that out of the way, I really love how the car has weight to it and how your driving AI looks on par with actual triple A games so far.
Is it being made on UE4?
And if so, I think there should be an easy way to make proper damage. As in, stuff getting teared off/meshes that dynamically get changed based on impact.
Great driving AI coupled with great destruction usually means a great game. At least in my opinion.
(See Flatout 1&2)
[QUOTE=TheAdmiester;49532121]So if I'm reading you right, you have a kind of AI that is fully natural with no "cheat" abilities, but it's still good enough to keep up with a player?
That sounds like a hell of a feat on its own.[/QUOTE]
Yes, for now, all three cars have exactly the same values (aero, weight, suspension, tires)
There are differences in weight distribution and max torque:
white car: rear engine/rwd, 101Nm @3500
orange car: front engine/fwd, 105Nm @3500
black car: front engine/rwd, 110Nm @3500
The are no differences in tire grip and no "cheats" that are common in most games, like extra side and rotational damping.
The chasers are also set up to drive aggressively -> late braking, power sliding, otherwise they would catch up faster with the player. But I wanted the chasers to drive like they were pissed-off and slide around more.
[editline]15th January 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=No Party Hats;49532156]yea honestly im used to people posting bs here, but this looks pretty fucking mint all around. I was wondering why everything felt like almost silent hill-ish, thanks for explaining the plot some!
[editline]14th January 2016[/editline]
just watched your last film, holy shit dude im digging your style HARD.[/QUOTE]
Thank you, I'm happy you enjoyed it :)
[editline]15th January 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=kattolil;49532209]Looks very good, I don't like the gritty/noise thing going on, I realize it's probably a stylistic choice but
it seems to me that it detracts the overall quality. (First thought when I saw the pictures was "Is this source?")
I'd suggest toning down the brightness and adding more lights.
It would help things pop-out and generally make it look better for minimal effort.
With that out of the way, I really love how the car has weight to it and how your driving AI looks on par with actual triple A games so far.
Is it being made on UE4?
And if so, I think there should be an easy way to make proper damage. As in, stuff getting teared off/meshes that dynamically get changed based on impact.
Great driving AI coupled with great destruction usually means a great game. At least in my opinion.
(See Flatout 1&2)[/QUOTE]
Glad you like the driving :)
The noise is a (failed) attempt at simulating drizzle. I have yet to implement real volumetric lighting - for now it's faked with particles (some are vertex-lit). I'm using Unity and there's a soft-body deformation plug-in which I'm looking into for the damage part.
I like the idea, but what you are talking about is a game mechanics, not a game in itself.
I think there are many historical examples of how creating a game around a game mechanic resulted in a proof of concept that got boring and shallow quick.
If it's a tie in to his animation, all it really has to do is stand out as a statement that compliments the film. The driving looks fun as hell.
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;49551077]I like the idea, but what you are talking about is a game mechanics, not a game in itself.
I think there are many historical examples of how creating a game around a game mechanic resulted in a proof of concept that got boring and shallow quick.[/QUOTE]
You're totally right about that and being chased the whole time would certainly get annoying in the long run. However, I did write "[B]One[/B] of the core gameplay elements is "driving survival"", and that's what's specifically showcased in the video.
You can also escape from the baddies and hide from them or just avoid being detected in the first place. It's a question of balancing the action moments with chill or stealth moments (and ideally, letting the player influence that balance, based on his choices). Then, there's the other gameplay elements like exploration and repairing things which I have not yet implemented - the game is still in early development. Sorry if I was unclear about that.
I guess one of the reasons why I posted the video is because I've never seen such a believable, non-cheating, driving AI in any open-world games so far, and I'd like to verify how this claim resonates with other players.
Sure, in the plethora of games that are popular today, ranging from flappy-flap/crossy-cross to AAA "sword-bearing elven, riding zombie-stomping mech dinosaur", an open-world driving sim is a tiny niche, but that's the format I've chosen to convey my game's universe and I'd like to make is as enjoyable as possible for players. That's why I'm here :)
I think it would be pretty awesome if you could eventually add huge trucks to chase you down.
Duel is one of my favorite thriller films of all time, it would be pretty awesome to play it in a game.
This looks really badass by the way, I can't think of many games that have competent chase AIs.
Simple games that are designed well and have solid mechanics can be as good as huge budget AAA games. Look at shit like Rocket League, iDarb, Crossy Road, Monument Valley, Limbo. Relatively simple games but good enough to keep the player engaged. This game could hold up on what you have so far if the environmental storytelling was up to scratch.
As long as you set realistic goals, then you could really be onto something, that driving AI really is something else.
[QUOTE=GrizzlyBear;49553788]I think it would be pretty awesome if you could eventually add huge trucks to chase you down.
Duel is one of my favorite thriller films of all time, it would be pretty awesome to play it in a game.
This looks really badass by the way, I can't think of many games that have competent chase AIs.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the feedback! Duel is great - that tension with the slowly approaching headlights in the rear view mirror. Definitely going for that kind of pacing in the game.
Concerning having a truck in the game, for now it wouldn't really fit with the story.
Although, I am planning to have a mining region in the game with those beasts :)
[img]http://i.imgur.com/AvI6fq9.jpg[/img]
and there will be some tourist buses:
[img]http://i.imgur.com/OvVOgV5.jpg[/img]
[editline]19th January 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=Wickerman123;49555286]Simple games that are designed well and have solid mechanics can be as good as huge budget AAA games. Look at shit like Rocket League, iDarb, Crossy Road, Monument Valley, Limbo. Relatively simple games but good enough to keep the player engaged. This game could hold up on what you have so far if the environmental storytelling was up to scratch.
As long as you set realistic goals, then you could really be onto something, that driving AI really is something else.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the motivating words. Just wanted to straighten out that the game is not based around a single game mechanic.
Getting the storytelling right will be a challenge, especially since I'm used to linear, being a filmmaker. Definitely looking forward to it.
You should post this in WAYWO: [url]https://facepunch.com/forumdisplay.php?f=240[/url]
I'm sure everyone there would be interested in how your AI and driving physics work.
Looks really cool. Can't wait to try it
[QUOTE=Zovox;49563799]Looks really cool. Can't wait to try it[/QUOTE]
Thanks, there will be a demo to check it out :)
This looks fucking sick. I share exactly the same sentiments about AI in games. Similar things apply to AI in other types of games, eg AI players cheating for resources in RTS, stuff like that. It's is probably the most stagnant aspect of game development, there are games from over 10 years ago in which their AI seems more sophisticated than those being released in the last few years, with most AAA titles prioritising multiplayer over SP
This looks so great, I used to spend hours just driving around in GTA 4, but when they arcadified the physics in GTA5 I was sad, been looking for an open world driving sim for a long time.
I love the idea of driving around in a decently-simulated car exploring an interesting world.
I know it's a long way in the future, but do you ever plan to have wheel support? I have a G27 and would be more than willing to help test should that ever be considered.
What will the damage modelling be like, if any? Will it be functional, cosmetic, or both, and to what extent? It seems like the rear-left of the player's car got crumpled a bit near the end but I can't really tell
i love the concept for the characters when the goons get right up on your rear bumper and all you see in the rear view mirror is a bunch of horrific looking faces. that definitely adds unforseen depth to the game
Since you guys are looking for a super good driving experience, check out Beam.ng on steam. It simulates every part of a car, down to the metal with soft body physics. This guy here has some very nice modelling and AI though, I love it. Definitely gonna check it out when the demo is released.
[QUOTE=Tmaxx;49594541]Since you guys are looking for a super good driving experience, check out Beam.ng on steam.[/QUOTE]
as far as i remember though, the handling isnt all that good yet in beamng. (unless its been improved since the last i tried it.)
It has been. Theyve updated the wheel and friction model and handling is very good now.
[QUOTE=Morbo!!!;49589701]This looks fucking sick. I share exactly the same sentiments about AI in games. Similar things apply to AI in other types of games, eg AI players cheating for resources in RTS, stuff like that. It's is probably the most stagnant aspect of game development, there are games from over 10 years ago in which their AI seems more sophisticated than those being released in the last few years, with most AAA titles prioritising multiplayer over SP[/QUOTE]
Thanks man. Concerning AI in games, yeah, seems like not much progress has been made in the last 10 years. I don't really get why that is. Hard to believe it would be for money reasons, but who knows. There is this popular opinion among game-devs that "every battle should feel like the odds of winning are scarce, but the player should always win so that he feels he's defied the impossible. And that cheating is OK as long as the player doesn't notice it" - could be tied to the dumbing-down of games.
[QUOTE=Morbo!!!;49589701]What will the damage modelling be like, if any? Will it be functional, cosmetic, or both, and to what extent? It seems like the rear-left of the player's car got crumpled a bit near the end but I can't really tell[/QUOTE]
For now, it's just cosmetic but I'd like to implement a more realistic system. Not totally realistic but punishing enough: drive into a tree at 120Kmh = you die. I' m thinking about using this: [URL="http://heartbroken.bitbucket.org/trussphysics/download/"]http://heartbroken.bitbucket.org/trussphysics/download/[/URL] (there's a car demo at the bottom you can try) .
[QUOTE=rhx123;49590042]This looks so great, I used to spend hours just driving around in GTA 4, but when they arcadified the physics in GTA5 I was sad, been looking for an open world driving sim for a long time.
I love the idea of driving around in a decently-simulated car exploring an interesting world.
I know it's a long way in the future, but do you ever plan to have wheel support? I have a G27 and would be more than willing to help test should that ever be considered.[/QUOTE]
Glad you like it. Wasn't too happy about GTAV driving physics either but at least there's a couple cars that have a more real driving feel, like the Futo and BMW7 equivalent. Although they felt a bit awkward, I prefered GTAIV physics too. Speaking of GTA, this guy made a pretty interesting video about the AI in GTAV, some of his criticism is a bit too much in my opinion, but he does make good points - especially those starting at 25:38.
[video=youtube;-qUJc20yu28]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qUJc20yu28[/video]
Wheel support is planned :) and so is cockpit view.
[QUOTE=69105;49592357]i love the concept for the characters when the goons get right up on your rear bumper and all you see in the rear view mirror is a bunch of horrific looking faces. that definitely adds unforseen depth to the game[/QUOTE]
Happy you like those :) wait till they squeeze you, jump out of their car and... :ohno:
[QUOTE=Tmaxx;49594541]Since you guys are looking for a super good driving experience, check out Beam.ng on steam. It simulates every part of a car, down to the metal with soft body physics. This guy here has some very nice modelling and AI though, I love it. Definitely gonna check it out when the demo is released.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for your feedback. Yeah, loved how BeamNG does damage. Been a while though, maybe I should check it again - especially since the handling has been improved.
Looks very very promising.
Enjoying the gritty aesthetic actually. The game sounds like a really cool idea.
This is an older test I did - for the 5% of you, who prefer cockpit view ;)
[video=youtube;LfU7Bee3CDA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfU7Bee3CDA[/video]
i was just going to ask if there was cockpit view, awesome. have you considered ever adding in VR support? if it is mostly driving it could work very well
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;49627347]i was just going to ask if there was cockpit view, awesome. have you considered ever adding in VR support? if it is mostly driving it could work very well[/QUOTE]
Hmm. I thought the old-school setup would be sufficient: dark room, headphones, big monitor - but although I haven't tried it yet, VR does sound very interesting. What about the reported headache/dizziness issues?
VR + wheel + cockpit view (+ [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx0ME65y72E"]bucket[/URL] eventually) could be awesome, yeah!
This game looks really cool! I love games that have their own unique vibe when so many games look and play all the same.
[QUOTE=SoulChallenge;49627523]Hmm. I thought the old-school setup would be sufficient: dark room, headphones, big monitor - but although I haven't tried it yet, VR does sound very interesting. What about the reported headache/dizziness issues?
VR + wheel + cockpit view (+ [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zx0ME65y72E"]bucket[/URL] eventually) could be awesome, yeah![/QUOTE]
Driving/cockpit games significantly reduce VR sickness due to the inside of the vehicle giving a stable frame of reference. Also, newest headsets coming this year are believed to have virtually removed the effect.
[editline]29th January 2016[/editline]
Also, do your drivers just try to ram you? Or do they do more advanced things like trying to push you side ways off the road and go for PIT maneuvers from behind?
[QUOTE=Matto;49627812]This game looks really cool! I love games that have their own unique vibe when so many games look and play all the same.[/QUOTE]
Thank you, great to hear that! Still in the process of sniffing around to see how people react to this project, and so far, I must say that I'm really pleasantly surprised by the feedback here. Also starting to look in diverse possibilities of funding the production (this has been a one man show till now) - crowdfunding would be one, although being a nobody (at least in game dev) and the game not being mainstream (no dinosaurs, zombies, floating islands, elven with titanic tits) makes me doubtful. :ohno:
[QUOTE=Matto;49627812]Driving/cockpit games significantly reduce VR sickness due to the inside of the vehicle giving a stable frame of reference. Also, newest headsets coming this year are believed to have virtually removed the effect.[/QUOTE]
Cool, sounds good. Third person view could be an issue, especially when using the mouse to rotate the cam around the car.
[QUOTE=Matto;49627812]Also, do your drivers just try to ram you? Or do they do more advanced things like trying to push you side ways off the road and go for PIT maneuvers from behind?[/QUOTE]
As of now, they always try to perform a PIT maneuver (or block when in front of the player car). I'll have to diversify that and implement some form of gradation that will reflect the pursuers pissed-off-meter.
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