Anger in Berlin after Saudi driver who killed cyclist claims diplomatic immunity - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE][B]The death of a cyclist has provoked anger in Germany after it emerged the driver responsible is a Saudi who cannot be prosecuted because he has diplomatic responsibility.[/B] Police said the unnamed driver had opened the door of his Porsche directly into the cyclist’s path in Berlin’s fashionable Neukölln district without checking to see if the road was clear. The 55-year-old cyclist, named only as Michael E under German privacy laws, had no time to brake or swerve out of the way. He was rushed to hospital but died of his injuries.[/QUOTE] [URL]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/16/anger-berlin-saudi-driver-killed-cyclist-claims-diplomatic-immunity/[/URL]

diplomatic immunity is pretty good at ruining diplomatic relationships

Diplomatic immunity is a load of bullshit

There [I]needs[/I] to be a limit on diplomatic immunity. Diplomatic immunity is a necessary thing, for sure, but there's been too many cases like this in which people like the Saudi hegemony take no responsibility for their actions in other countries. This needs to be stopped.

[QUOTE=Omilinon;52370944]There [I]needs[/I] to be a limit on diplomatic immunity. Diplomatic immunity is a necessary thing, for sure, but there's been too many cases like this in which people like the Saudi hegemony take no responsibility for their actions in other countries. This needs to be stopped.[/QUOTE] [URL="https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/17/saudi-diplomat-accused-of-raping-two-maids-uses-immunity-to-leave-india"]No kidding. [/URL] [URL="http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/saudi-diplomat-case-maid-was-hurt-with-knife/article7634447.ece"]Here's her testimony.[/URL] Speaking of, nothing happened to the guy responsible for this.

[QUOTE=Omilinon;52370944]There [I]needs[/I] to be a limit on diplomatic immunity. Diplomatic immunity is a necessary thing, for sure, but there's been too many cases like this in which people like the Saudi hegemony take no responsibility for their actions in other countries. This needs to be stopped.[/QUOTE] Frankly, diplomatic immunity should just be completely nullified if the person in question has caused serious bodily harm or killed someone. At that point it becomes indefensible.

[QUOTE=Spetsnaz95;52370961]Frankly, diplomatic immunity should just be completely nullified if the person in question has caused serious bodily harm or killed someone. At that point it becomes indefensible.[/QUOTE] It really should just apply to misdemeanors and the such, things like manslaughter or assault should most definitely be exempt.

Yet another case for diplomatic immunity needing to be given some serious limits.

[QUOTE=Spetsnaz95;52370961]Frankly, diplomatic immunity should just be completely nullified if the person in question has caused serious bodily harm or killed someone. At that point it becomes indefensible.[/QUOTE] When I was in New York, I remember a cab driver telling me what assholes the cars with the diplomatic plates were because they double parked all over the place and would pretty much laugh and toss away the parking tickets. :frown: I think it should be treated as a pretty simple "If you break the law of the host country when you are outside embassy walls, you're subject to their laws."

[QUOTE=snookypookums;52370968]When I was in New York, I remember a cab driver telling me what assholes the cars with the diplomatic plates were because they double parked all over the place and would pretty much laugh and toss away the parking tickets. :frown:[/QUOTE] [url=https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/sep/23/fine-diplomats-not-paying-parking-tickets]Diplomatic immunity has racked up $16m worth of fees in NYC that will never get paid[/url]

[QUOTE=KillerJaguar;52370989][url=https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/sep/23/fine-diplomats-not-paying-parking-tickets]Diplomatic immunity has racked up $16m worth of fees in NYC that will never get paid[/url][/QUOTE] From the article: [QUOTE]The real story here, however, is the congestion charge. Nearly £100m of congestion charges fees remain unpaid since it was introduced in 2003 – [B]more than 10% of it from the US embassy[/B].[/QUOTE] 10 Million GBP, or nearly 13 million USD. :hammered:

[QUOTE=snookypookums;52370968]When I was in New York, I remember a cab driver telling me what assholes the cars with the diplomatic plates were because they double parked all over the place and would pretty much laugh and toss away the parking tickets. :frown: I think it should be treated as a pretty simple "If you break the law of the host country when you are outside embassy walls, you're subject to their laws."[/QUOTE] Yeah one of my professors who happens to be an ex-diplomat told us about that during one of our classes.

Isn't the way this should work be that UK makes a request towards SA to withdraw the claim to this guy's diplomatic immunity so he can be charged and the motivation to comply is to keep diplomatic relations sane and healthy? It can't be like the immunity is end all irrevocable rule, otherwise some diplomat could rob a bank and be like "yeah suck it". [editline]17th June 2017[/editline] The only diplomatically sane alternative I can see is that the Saudis gonna arrest him themselves and punish him on basis of a decision of a Saudi court.

[QUOTE=millan;52371004]Isn't the way this should work be that UK makes a request towards SA to withdraw the claim to this guy's diplomatic immunity so he can be charged and the motivation to comply is to keep diplomatic relations sane and healthy? It can't be like the immunity is end all irrevocable rule, otherwise some diplomat could rob a bank and be like "yeah suck it".[/QUOTE] The problem tends to be, in KSA's specific case, that said diplomat is likely pretty high up on the prince hierarchy of the House of Saud. Most of the cushy diplomatic, armed forces and key government forces are pretty much held by the progeny of the House of Saud, so they look after themselves. Any other country would have the guy/gal ass-blasted by his government and then stuck in whatever their diplomatic version of "sending someone to the Russian Front" is.

[QUOTE=snookypookums;52370951][URL="https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/17/saudi-diplomat-accused-of-raping-two-maids-uses-immunity-to-leave-india"]No kidding. [/URL] [URL="http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/saudi-diplomat-case-maid-was-hurt-with-knife/article7634447.ece"]Here's her testimony.[/URL] Speaking of, nothing happened to the guy responsible for this.[/QUOTE] That's insane. I dont give a fuck what your job is, you should get locked up for rape and murder. Any respectable human would have done something regardless of diplomatic immunity. Feds shouldve locked him up.

[QUOTE=Sky King;52371211]That's insane. I dont give a fuck what your job is, you should get locked up for rape and murder. Any respectable human would have done something regardless of diplomatic immunity. Feds shouldve locked him up.[/QUOTE] Sadly the only measure of justice these pricks will face is if an angry mob gets their hands on them, also unlikely since they're more likely to slink away under the protection of their shithole nation.

[QUOTE=GordonZombie;52371232]Sadly the only measure of justice these pricks will face is if an angry mob gets their hands on them, also unlikely since they're more likely to slink away under the protection of their shithole nation.[/QUOTE] I wouldn't quite put it in those terms, but honestly I really wouldn't mind if one of these people would get into really serious self-provoked trouble. Too bad they have bodyguards. And I'm saying that despite having a huge problem with the whole 'punch nazis' thing. I wish my government would crack down on diplomats who abuse their protections a long time before they had the chance to hurt anyone directly.

diplomatic immunity is necessary and it shouldn't be possible to revoke by anyone but the country the diplomat is from, however the system clearly has flaws with nations like saudi arabia that fail to punish or discipline their "diplomats". I'm not sure what the solution would be without completely ruining relations (personally I'd be fine if the entire world told the saudis to fuck off but that's not gonna happen), maybe after kicking out the diplomat the country could permanently sanction them so they could never fly on german airlines or use german hotels, for example. if several nations cooperated or the sanctions were EU-wide it could seriously start to chip at the quality of life of these assholes.

Diplomatic immunity has become one of those cases of 'this is why we can't have nice things'.

Fuck Saudi diplomats, some of the worst scum on this planet.

Honestly I feel like the charges should go to whoever okayed them getting diplomatic immunity if they don't get the immunity revoked.

I don't get diplomatic immunity at all. When you're willingly breaking the law or kill someone, you should get prosecuted no matter who you are. The fact that even a maid who is working for a diplomat gets immunity is insane.

[QUOTE=Zezibesh;52371289]diplomatic immunity is necessary and it shouldn't be possible to revoke by anyone but the country the diplomat is from, however the system clearly has flaws with nations like saudi arabia that fail to punish or discipline their "diplomats". I'm not sure what the solution would be without completely ruining relations (personally I'd be fine if the entire world told the saudis to fuck off but that's not gonna happen), maybe after kicking out the diplomat the country could permanently sanction them so they could never fly on german airlines or use german hotels, for example. if several nations cooperated or the sanctions were EU-wide it could seriously start to chip at the quality of life of these assholes.[/QUOTE] This is really it. If we really wanted to punish diplomats for offenses like these, we could do it. They get away without so much as a slap on the wrist not because diplomatic immunity makes them untouchable, but because we roll over and let the Saudis do whatever they want as long as they control the oil. [editline]17th June 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=JackDestiny;52371338]The fact that even a maid who is working for a diplomat gets immunity is insane.[/QUOTE] Actually maids and other service staff typically don't get diplomatic immunity. Even lower-level government officials only receive provisional or partial immunity, where the immunity applies only during the course of their work duties. Only actual diplomats and other high-ranking officials get full diplomatic immunity.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;52371370]Not every country has a functioning rule of law.[/QUOTE] So how is diplomatic immunity gonna help in a shithole with a corrupt justice system?

[QUOTE=CarnolfMeatla;52371531]So how is diplomatic immunity gonna help in a shithole with a corrupt justice system?[/QUOTE] As far as I understand it, it's essentially a threat of an international incident in case a country misuses it's criminal justice system for political purposes. Of course this - assumes the diplomat in question isn't a criminal and - isn't really that necessary in places like this one (though I assume it's [I]much[/I] easier to make this a symmetric contract).

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;52371696]And justice isnt objective so Saudis can say German law is trash. So immunity needs to be absolute & blind. Incidents like these are generally resolved through diplomacz - Russian diplomat who killed a teenager got convicted in Russia, Americans get convicted in USA, etc. - whether the diplomat really committed the crime or not requires trust in one justice system anyway, which happens through diplomacy. If Saudis wont do anything about it then diplomatic action is the only way to act. Immunity is counterintuitive but it is better than no immunity. Very rarely diplomats who kill / hurt people go unpunished so there is no big problem anyway, and small things, you can ignore. [editline]17th June 2017[/editline] Ask yourself this: Would you want Trumps diplomats to be arrested for hate speech in Germany? :)[/QUOTE] That agree is for your post in general, not that last question. [I]That said[/I], I really don't have an issue with foreign officials not getting a platform here outside of official visits, or our hate speech laws inconveniencing one of them in diplomatic terms for that matter.

Such a shame that the US makes Saudi Arabia so important. I don't even think Iran would be as scummy as them.

Saudi Arabia needs to have political pressure applied so they start upholding their responsibility and stop their "diplomats" from committing crimes. ...Which in reality isn't going to happen.

The Saudi royal family and their connected friends are a plague on humanity. They hand diplomatic immunity out like candy. They're above the law in their own country, and they're virtually above the law in the rest of the world - a privilege they've been known to abuse with impunity. When no law on earth will touch a criminal, I'm totally fine with good old-fashioned vigilante justice. Really, Germany would be doing this fool a favour by prosecuting them as they would any other criminal - it beats having a target painted on your back.

[QUOTE=archangel125;52373418][...] it beats having a target painted on your back.[/QUOTE] It's not like we have a problem where people will actually attack criminals who got off free here, so that's not really [I]that[/I] much of an issue. As far as I know, his name and photo also aren't widely made public.