• Jeff Kaplan says Overwatch is balanced, and he likes the "dive meta" just fine
    27 replies, posted
[url]http://www.pcgamer.com/jeff-kaplan-says-overwatch-is-balanced-and-he-likes-the-dive-meta-just-fine[/url]
[QUOTE]"super-high-skill heroes doing very OW things,"[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]in which a fairly rigid group of heroes—Tracer, Genji, [B]Winston[/B], and D.Va [/QUOTE] I cannot tell you how many times I've had a Winston jump me when I play Ana, and he just plops his shield down, hides behind it, and holds left click. And there's not a damn thing I can do about it as he'll likely survive long enough to kill me.
you see ivan, when your game is full of choke points, there is no need to recompile maps, simply create a meta where everyone jumps over them
Jeff Kaplan is an idiot, then.
[QUOTE=Nookyava;52444550]I cannot tell you how many times I've had a Winston jump me when I play Ana, and he just plops his shield down, hides behind it, and holds left click. And there's not a damn thing I can do about it as he'll likely survive long enough to kill me.[/QUOTE] To be fair, he's extremely counterable. If he dives down near a reaper he's as good as dead.
What is the dive meta exactly? I don't play sooo I hear a lot of complaints about balance but don't understand what exactly is wrong
Put Jeff in charge of PR, fire him from his current job along with everyone else on the balance team. Maybe then Blizzard will actually fix the goddamn game.
who would win in a fight the entire universal community feedback or 1 man's "likes" [editline]7th July 2017[/editline] I know you're thinking of SMITE but guess again!
[QUOTE=J!NX;52445105]What is the dive meta exactly? I don't play sooo I hear a lot of complaints about balance but don't understand what exactly is wrong[/QUOTE] Basically a team composition consisting of three damage-dealers, two healers, and a really annoying-to-kill tank like Winston. It kinda sucks because as far as the competitive scene is concerned, that is the only way you should be arranging your teams if you want to succeed. Of course, there's still the 2-tanks-2-dps-2-healer and 3-tanks-1-dps-2-healer compositions but dive comps have become the "thing" now I guess. I'm not sure how much in control Blizzard is over the meta. People have been using heroes outside of the roles they were officially labeled as and it's been working fine in some cases. If nothing's done by them to make other playstyles viable against dives then the meta's gonna stale sooner or later. Adding maps and heroes can only do so much.
[QUOTE=Octopod;52445154]Basically a team composition consisting of three damage-dealers, two healers, and a really annoying-to-kill tank like Winston. It kinda sucks because as far as the competitive scene is concerned, that is the only way you should be arranging your teams if you want to succeed. Of course, there's still the 2-tanks-2-dps-2-healer and 3-tanks-1-dps-2-healer compositions but dive comps have become the "thing" now I guess. I'm not sure how much in control Blizzard is over the meta. People have been using heroes outside of the roles they were officially labeled as and it's been working fine in some cases. If nothing's done by them to make other playstyles viable against dives then the meta's gonna stale sooner or later. Adding maps and heroes can only do so much.[/QUOTE] Considering most the roster isn't even used it's already in a pretty sad state.
I really wish McCree was staple again. I don't mind Genji, Pharah, and Tracer but McCree seems like he's all about his shooting instead of his ult and extra buttons. [QUOTE=J!NX;52445105]What is the dive meta exactly? I don't play sooo I hear a lot of complaints about balance but don't understand what exactly is wrong[/QUOTE] Hero's that are able to quickly and easily ambush an important hero(s). Tracer can pretty much teleport, Genji has high double jumps and a quick dash, Winston has an extremely big leap, and D.Va is in a mech that can fly for a short period of time. Apart from Genji to an extent, these heros are also very good at surviving and retreating quickly even if their 'dive' goes bad. Dive comp is definitely not very fun, but the previous meta was tank meta. That was exactly what it sounds like, a whole lot of tanks.
[QUOTE=J!NX;52445105]What is the dive meta exactly? I don't play sooo[/QUOTE] Most maps rely too heavily on a single choke point, so at first the meta evolved to having tanks defending a single corner of the map and stall time. Nothing really counters barriers very well in this situation, so the meta became the dive comp, which means everybody on attack picks heroes that can leap/fly/teleport and just bypass the choke point and shields entirely, which isn't fun to fight against. The dive meta problem doesn't come from hero design, it comes mostly from the level design. Yet the devs seem completely against going back to the drawing board to fix existing maps. So half the heroes are doomed to stay unused because of this stubbornness. ...unless they turn the entire cast into heroes who can either dive or hard CC.
we need an anti-air hero
[QUOTE=Dr. Evilcop;52445484]we need an anti-air hero[/QUOTE] Tbh give him a bio/gloo-gun that slows smaller targets down / prevents movement [t]http://www.unreal.pl/pic/bronie/biofire.JPG[/t] The demo man but instead of grenades he spreads hot goo everywhere [editline]8th July 2017[/editline] I HOPE that idea would at least make sense in a game like OW
[QUOTE=Segab;52445449]Most maps rely too heavily on a single choke point, so at first the meta evolved to having tanks defending a single corner of the map and stall time. Nothing really counters barriers very well in this situation, so the meta became the dive comp, which means everybody on attack picks heroes that can leap/fly/teleport and just bypass the choke point and shields entirely, which isn't fun to fight against. The dive meta problem doesn't come from hero design, it comes mostly from the level design. Yet the devs seem completely against going back to the drawing board to fix existing maps. So half the heroes are doomed to stay unused because of this stubbornness. ...unless they turn the entire cast into heroes who can either dive or hard CC.[/QUOTE] I think the problem is more that people seem okay with how the maps and meta is right now. You guys make a great point against the meta and the map design but if I'm honest the only place I've ever seen any kind of argument was from here. Then again, I don't read the reddit, so maybe I'm wrong.
[QUOTE=J!NX;52445713]The demo man but instead of grenades he spreads hot goo everywhere[/QUOTE] This description also works to describe a respectable amount of Overwatch porn.
[QUOTE=Gmod4ever;52445733]This description also works to describe a respectable amount of Overwatch porn.[/QUOTE] its roadhogg but instead of using his chain thing to reel people in he uses [sp]hahaha no fuck you not going there[/sp]
[QUOTE=J!NX;52445739]its roadhogg but instead of using his chain thing to reel people in he uses [sp]hahaha no fuck you not going there[/sp][/QUOTE] it's roadhog but instead of using his chain thing to reel people in he [sp]gets nerfed[/sp]
[QUOTE=Octopod;52445720]I think the problem is more that people seem okay with how the maps and meta is right now. You guys make a great point against the meta and the map design but if I'm honest the only place I've ever seen any kind of argument was from here. Then again, I don't read the reddit, so maybe I'm wrong.[/QUOTE] At this point, the only people still actively playing Overwatch and getting involved in the comp scene are people who more or less agree with the general direction of map/hero design, so you probably won't find any detractors to this if you look at the game's active communities. The detractors left long ago because it was clear that nothing was going to change, the new maps (like 3 in 1 year lol) have pretty much the same design philosophy applied to them. Granted, they're slightly more open, but not by much.
oh, great. it's the guy who said "gg ez" ... as the man who he is. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX0DutLp7Rw[/media] yeah, okay. did it really came that far now? am i the only one who can't stand it to death, when kids writing this in the chat of any competitive mp title?
[QUOTE=TheMask;52446634]oh, great. it's the guy who said "gg ez" ... as the man who he is. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX0DutLp7Rw[/media] yeah, okay. did it really came that far now? am i the only one who can't stand it to death, when kids writing this in the chat of any competitive mp title?[/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure these days "ggez" is less about what it means and more about how other people react to it. basically low-effort trolling
[QUOTE=TheMask;52446634]oh, great. it's the guy who said "gg ez" ... as the man who he is. [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX0DutLp7Rw[/media] yeah, okay. did it really came that far now? am i the only one who can't stand it to death, when kids writing this in the chat of any competitive mp title?[/QUOTE] I don't see how Jeff being goofy for a video is related
I don't play competitive because that's not really my thing, but I haven't encountered a whole lot of this. When I have it was usually pretty easily countered.
[QUOTE=Octopod;52446737]I'm pretty sure these days "ggez" is less about what it means and more about how other people react to it. basically low-effort trolling[/QUOTE] yeah, i get it's just kids being kids. no biggie. it's just (to me personally) sad to hear someone in his position spreading such a phrase. i'm only talking about "ez". [QUOTE=DeEz;52446748]I don't see how Jeff being goofy for a video is related[/QUOTE] it may isn't, aye. but after thinking about a vid, i saw a weeks back, i was just like, wasn't it this guy? and yeah. it's the same dude. anyways, i shouldn't derail the thread. that being said, the game to me personally felt balanced when i played it. but take that with a grain of salt. i just played for three, max four days. widowmaker always got me and my buddy.
[QUOTE=elowin;52446849]I don't play competitive because that's not really my thing, but I haven't encountered a whole lot of this. When I have it was usually pretty easily countered.[/QUOTE] Uncordinated dive in solo Q is practically just a bunch of idiots ramming their head against the wall. You wont see cordinated dives in SRs lower than GM.
[QUOTE=Dr. Evilcop;52445484]we need an anti-air hero[/QUOTE] You kill Pharah with like 4 body shots from Mcree, that's pretty effective anti-air for me and at 2 shots a second if you land them all he'll out DPS any mercy healing
[QUOTE=FingerSpazem;52447797]You kill Pharah with like 4 body shots from Mcree, that's pretty effective anti-air for me and at 2 shots a second if you land them all he'll out DPS any mercy healing[/QUOTE] For anyone with high mobility, I use Roadhog. As long as you're good with his hook, he's a perfect counter.
In Jeff's own post he said that it is his own opinion and doesn't represent the team. The headlines skew it. He wasn't speaking on behalf of the OW dev team, just from his perspective. [editline]10th July 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Nookyava;52444550]I cannot tell you how many times I've had a Winston jump me when I play Ana, and he just plops his shield down, hides behind it, and holds left click. And there's not a damn thing I can do about it as he'll likely survive long enough to kill me.[/QUOTE] Then your team should do something about it. He's a tank, why should a healer be able to 1v1 him.
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