• Death of 10-year-old involved in school fight declared a homicide
    36 replies, posted
Source: [URL]http://www.cnn.com/2012/02/27/justice/california-girl-dead/index.html?hpt=hp_t3[/URL] [quote] Officials have ruled the death of a 10-year-old girl who got into a fight last week to be a homicide, authorities said Monday. Joanna Ramos, a fifth-grade student at Willard Elementary School, died of blunt force trauma to the head six hours after an altercation with a female classmate that lasted less than a minute, said Long Beach Police spokesman Sgt. Rico Fernandez. Authorities have identified the other girl, who is 11, as well as several onlookers, and they are continuing to investigate what happened. "There are several accounts of what transpired based on interviews with witnesses, but we have not concluded the precise motive," Fernandez said. In a statement, police said Ramos and her unidentified classmate had challenged each other to a planned fight when their school session ended Friday. "The two girls met in a nearby alley next to a church and began hitting each other," Fernandez said. The fight was brief, and no weapons were involved, authorities said. According to Long Beach Unified School District spokesman Chris Eftychiou, Ramos finished her regular school session at 2:12 p.m. Friday and was supposed to remain on campus to begin her scheduled after-school program at 2:30. "We believe the altercation occurred during that 15-minute window because she apparently left and returned for the session, which involves help with homework and academic-related activity," said Eftychiou. After the fight, the girls left and went their separate ways. Ramos stayed in the afternoon session for about an hour but did not exhibit obvious signs of physical trauma, said Eftychiou. "When she did complain of not feeling well, her cousin picked her up, but we had no indication she was involved in an altercation," he said. "Only when she was at the hospital did we get word about the altercation, and there is no indication that bullying was a factor," said Eftychiou. Once the investigation and autopsy are complete, the findings will be turned over to the Los Angeles County District Attorney's Office for review and to determine whether charges will be filed in the case. No arrests have been made, authorities said. On Monday, grief counselors were brought into Willard Elementary to assist instructors and students. "It was a somber day," said Eftychiou. Ramos had been enrolled at the school for about a year and a half, he said. [/quote] Fucking news today is horrible.
How can I be called homicide if the fight was between two girls in about the same age group? Surely it wasn't intentional to kill the other person
[QUOTE=Crash15;34902752]How can I be called homicide if the fight was between two girls in about the same age group? Surely it wasn't intentional to kill the other person[/QUOTE] You need to learn what homicide is.
I'd still like to know how exactly she died. I mean no weapons where used, and the fight didn't seem to last very long, and it seems like she didn't suffer any bruising or anything that could be seen from the fight.
[QUOTE=Crash15;34902752]How can I be called homicide if the fight was between two girls in about the same age group? Surely it wasn't intentional to kill the other person[/QUOTE] It really depends, I cant see any info about weapons or anything. It will probably be second degree murder at most though.
[QUOTE=faze;34902766]You need to learn what homicide is.[/QUOTE] You need to learn waht homicide is... Your looking for manslaughter.
[QUOTE=Crash15;34902752]How can I be called homicide if the fight was between two girls in about the same age group? Surely it wasn't intentional to kill the other person[/QUOTE] Homicide =/= Murder She'll probably be charged with manslaughter.
[QUOTE=laxplayer77alt;34902782]You need to learn waht homicide is... Your looking for manslaughter.[/QUOTE] 1st degree murder: killed with intent and planning 2nd degree murder: killed with intent in the spur of the moment manslaughter: accidental killing homicide: person killing a person, including all the above
[QUOTE=Sir_takeslot;34902774]I'd still like to know how exactly she died. I mean no weapons where used, and the fight didn't seem to last very long, and it seems like she didn't suffer any bruising or anything that could be seen from the fight.[/QUOTE] It said blunt force trauma, literally in the second sentence.
Homocide just means a person was killed by another person, guys. It isn't murder. If I hit someone with my car and killed them, that is classed as homocide until a court deems it as manslaughter.
[QUOTE=laxplayer77alt;34902782]You need to learn waht homicide is... Your looking for manslaughter.[/QUOTE] Homicide is the general term that refers to the act of one human being killing another. It doesn't concern itself with the intentions of the participating parties. Manslaughter is a form of homicide brought about in a non-culpable or less than culpable manner (meaning it was unintentional or stemmed from an honest accident; in any case, the background elements that led to the person's death must be examined in order to determine culpability).
[QUOTE=laxplayer77alt;34902782]You need to learn waht homicide is... Your looking for manslaughter.[/QUOTE] IIRC: Manslaughter implies there was no premeditation. The word you're looking for is murder.
[QUOTE=laxplayer77alt;34902782]You need to learn waht homicide is... Your looking for manslaughter.[/QUOTE] Homicide is a blanket term for a human killing another, which includes manslaughter. [QUOTE=Incognito;34902798]Homicide =/= Murder She'll probably be charged with manslaughter.[/QUOTE] She won't be charged with anything. She is fucking 11. There were no visible injuries and she died from a blood clot to the head, that I personally don't believe an 11 year old's fist has enough force to produce. She will definitely feel like shit for the rest of her life.
Wow, must be one hell of a strong 11 year old to be able to cause trauma to the head to the point of killing. Fucking sucks, she must be feeling like shit. Also ITT: The meaning of homicide.
[QUOTE=Antdawg;34902815]It said blunt force trauma, literally in the second sentence.[/QUOTE] Cerebral hematoma maybe? If she went straight to the hospital they probably could of saved her, but she decided to wait it seems.
Damn that might stay in her conscience for the rest of her life
Old, this is the original; [url]http://www.facepunch.com/threads/1166539/2[/url]
[QUOTE=5killer;34902851]Homicide is a blanket term for a human killing another, which includes manslaughter. She won't be charged with anything. She is fucking 11. There were no visible injuries and she died from a blood clot to the head, that I personally don't believe an 11 year old's fist has enough force to produce. She will definitely feel like shit for the rest of her life.[/QUOTE] I'm an idiot disregard what i said..
All this because they both had to "be gangsta" and solve their issues with physical violence. They can't really hold the other child responsible for much, since they both agreed to take part in this moronic act.
[QUOTE=LADLEMAO;34902960]Old, this is the original; [url]http://www.facepunch.com/threads/1166539/2[/url][/QUOTE] This is an update. [QUOTE=Noble;34903030]All this because they both had to "be gangsta" and solve their issues with physical violence. They can't really hold the other child responsible for much, since they both agreed to take part in this moronic act.[/QUOTE] Give it a rest, they're 11. They don't know much better
I'm impressed a girl of her age is able to kill someone of her age with simply fighting.
Serves that girl right. [editline]27th February 2012[/editline] but at 10 and homicide... thats too much
[QUOTE=Sir_takeslot;34902774]I'd still like to know how exactly she died. I mean no weapons where used, and the fight didn't seem to last very long, and it seems like she didn't suffer any bruising or anything that could be seen from the fight.[/QUOTE] [quote]died of blunt force trauma to the head six hours after an altercation[/quote] Brain injury.
[QUOTE=kevaughan;34903295]I'm impressed a girl of her age is able to kill someone of her age with simply fighting.[/QUOTE] Imagine the impression she'll make on boyfriends after this: "I've killed someone with these bare hands." "So I should expect an intense hand job, is that what you're saying?"
[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;34903771]Imagine the impression she'll make on boyfriends after this: "I've killed someone with these bare hands." "So I should expect an intense hand job, is that what you're saying?"[/QUOTE] if some girl told me she killed somebody with her bare hands like it was an accomplishment i'd probably stop talking to her [editline]27th February 2012[/editline] if it was my girlfriend i'd just leave the situation all together
It ain't hard at all to kill someone with your bare hands, all it takes is the right amount of force to the right weak spot in the human anatomy.
[QUOTE=faze;34902766]You need to learn what homicide is.[/QUOTE] maybe you do.
Isn't she too young to be charged?
Homicide. Homo: Latin for "man" Cide: Latin for "to kill" To kill a man. Murder: A legal term for unlawful homicide. Manslaughter: A legal term for accidental homicide.
[QUOTE=LSK;34904914]Isn't she too young to be charged?[/QUOTE] She hasn't been charged with anything. Homicide refers to the killing of another human being. But she isn't too young to be charged, however the likelihood of any charge sticking to an 11 year old is unlikely. In many jurisdictions it's decided that those under the age of 14 (not sure of US) are unable to form the mind necessary to form criminal intent (called doli incapax), so are not criminally responsible for their actions. She'll likely be sent for treatment somewhere after a court order. [editline]28th February 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=gamefreek76;34905122]Murder: A legal term for unlawful homicide. Manslaughter: A legal term for accidental homicide.[/QUOTE] Both manslaughter and murder are unlawful homicides, however murder refers to the killing of another person with malice aforethought, or a guilty mind (they wanted to kill or injure another with no regard for life). Manslaughter is the unlawful killing of another person without the intent to kill.
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