• UK Transport Secretary: drivers considering buying diesel cars should take a "long, hard think"
    33 replies, posted
[QUOTE]The transport secretary has said drivers considering buying diesel cars should take a "long, hard think". Chris Grayling made the remarks to the Daily Mail, which said the government was considering a scrappage scheme for older diesel cars. Concerns over nitrogen dioxide (NO2) emissions from diesel vehicles have been raised in recent years. The Department for Transport said Mr Grayling was not telling people to stop buying diesel vehicles. It declined to comment on reports of a new scrappage scheme. [/QUOTE] [url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39088631[/url]
Meanwhile in America, [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal"]Rolling[/url] [URL="http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/07/why-people-are-paying-5000-to-pollute-more.html"]Coal [/URL]is still ambiguously legal,[URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html"] due to[/url] [URL="http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/coal-rollers-envionrment-prius-vermont-cyclist-1.3619909"]lack of enforcement[/URL].
what advice/grants have they got for people considering biofuel for domestic heating?
[QUOTE=FreakyMe;51872830]Meanwhile in America, [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal"]Rolling[/url] [URL="http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/07/why-people-are-paying-5000-to-pollute-more.html"]Coal [/URL]is still ambiguously legal, due to lack of enforcement.[/QUOTE] [quote]To get a single stack on my truck—that’s my way of giving them the finger. You want clean air and a tiny carbon footprint? Well, screw you.[/quote] What a delightful person!
Incentivise them to drive gas by nuking the gas tax that makes them want a diesel in the first place, then. [editline]25th February 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=FreakyMe;51872830]Meanwhile in America, [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal"]Rolling[/url] [URL="http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/07/why-people-are-paying-5000-to-pollute-more.html"]Coal [/URL]is still ambiguously legal,[URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html"] due to[/url] [URL="http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/coal-rollers-envionrment-prius-vermont-cyclist-1.3619909"]lack of enforcement[/URL].[/QUOTE]We do need to crack down on this shit, and we don't need new laws to do it. Rolling coal is a form of exhibitionist driving, something that's already ticketable with severe penalties as-is. We just need to convince cops to start impounding the brodozers that do it and we'll be good to go.
[QUOTE=r0b0tsquid;51872873]What a delightful person![/QUOTE] "You want clean air, screw you"? Can GTA please stop creeping into real life?
[QUOTE=FreakyMe;51872830]Meanwhile in America, [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal"]Rolling[/url] [URL="http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/07/why-people-are-paying-5000-to-pollute-more.html"]Coal [/URL]is still ambiguously legal,[URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html"] due to[/url] [URL="http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/coal-rollers-envionrment-prius-vermont-cyclist-1.3619909"]lack of enforcement[/URL].[/QUOTE] Should we be preaching for a greater police presence for people rolling coal? Its already against a few states and the EPA. So, we should be doing what?
[quote]Chris Grayling made the remarks to the Daily Mail, which said the government was considering a scrappage scheme for older diesel cars. Concerns over nitrogen dioxide (NO2) emissions from diesel vehicles have been raised in recent years.[/quote] Now I'm probably wrong but doesn't a single delivery ship shit more pollutants into the atmosphere in a year than all cars combined in the US in the same timespan or was I taught some alternative facts
Then make petrol cheaper. I'm pretty sure people wouldn't buy diesels if the shittiest petrol didn't cost as much as the most premium of diesel fuel per litre.
[QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;51873135]Then make petrol cheaper. I'm pretty sure people wouldn't buy diesels if the shittiest petrol didn't cost as much as the most premium of diesel fuel per litre.[/QUOTE] petrol is now cheaper than diesel in the UK.
Why not just scrap road tax and increase the levy on fuel so people who burn more petrol or diesel pay more for their choice of inefficient/polluting vehicle every day? That might incentivise people with fuel guzzling hunks of shit to actually give a fuck.
[QUOTE=FreakyMe;51872830]Meanwhile in America, [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal"]Rolling[/url] [URL="http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/07/why-people-are-paying-5000-to-pollute-more.html"]Coal [/URL]is still ambiguously legal,[URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html"] due to[/url] [URL="http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/coal-rollers-envionrment-prius-vermont-cyclist-1.3619909"]lack of enforcement[/URL].[/QUOTE] I remember seeing plenty of massive pick up trucks with stupid huge tires, and those shitty stacks that belong to absolute jerk offs that lived in the fucking suburbs when I was still in high school. They usually had truck nuts on them too so I used to jokingly call them penis mobiles, one of them even had a big decal on it that said "ozone killer"
[QUOTE=TestECull;51873085]Incentivise them to drive gas by nuking the gas tax that makes them want a diesel in the first place, then. [editline]25th February 2017[/editline] We do need to crack down on this shit, and we don't need new laws to do it. Rolling coal is a form of exhibitionist driving, something that's already ticketable with severe penalties as-is. We just need to convince cops to start impounding the brodozers that do it and we'll be good to go.[/QUOTE] They reduced the tax on diesel over a decade ago to incentivise diesel over petrol. Increase the tax on diesel rather than incentivisising petrol over low carbon alternatives. [editline]25th February 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=UK Bohemian;51872867]what advice/grants have they got for people considering biofuel for domestic heating?[/QUOTE] There's some grants for it but I don't think there really should be. The benefits to the environment are questionable. Really we need some major work done on heat pumps.
It's well and nice telling people not to use diesel cars from a well-paid position in government and all the financial security that comes with it, but at the end of the day, a lot of people here at the moment aren't on the best income and are taking what they can get. It doesn't help that the cunts currently in government levy such high taxes on the majority of the population (without anything going back ot them thanks to social and healthcare cuts), petrol just being among one of the many things affected by said taxation. [QUOTE=Morgen;51873328]They reduced the tax on diesel over a decade ago to incentivise diesel over petrol. Increase the tax on diesel rather than incentivisising petrol over low carbon alternatives.[/QUOTE] This isn't a solution, it just fucks more people over. EVs are still a way off from being affordable over here at the moment and believe me I know plenty of people who'd probably stick to public transportation if it wasn't for the fact that bus services are unreliable/don't take people where they need to go (plus they're raising fares with no improvement in service) and train fares are just downright extortionate.
I've been looking at getting a new car that has plenty of boot space, think like an estate. I'm travelling 60 miles/100km a day to get to work and back home. Most of my options are either a 2L turbo diesel, or a 1.4L petrol.
[QUOTE=GordonZombie;51873420]It's well and nice telling people not to diesel card but at the end of the day, a lot of people here at the moment aren't on the best income and are taking what they can get. It doesn't help that the cunts currently in government levy such high taxes on the majority of the population (without anything going back ot them thanks to social and healthcare cuts), petrol just being among one of the many things affected by said taxation. This isn't a solution, it just fucks more people over. EVs are still a way off from being affordable over here at the moment and believe me I know plenty of people who'd probably stick to public transportation if it wasn't for the fact that bus services are unreliable/don't take people where they need to go (plus they're raising fares with no improvement in service) and train fares are just downright extortionate.[/QUOTE] Right. Fuel prices are ridiculous in this country as it is, and most EVs are still in high demand with correspondingly high prices. Similar situation for small engined eco-hatches. It's all well and good being super concerned with the environment and using less fuel but truth is a lot of people simply can't afford to. EVs are a relatively new mainstream idea and they currently have a high entry price. I have to drive 40 miles per day to get to and from my workplace because I live on the set of Deliverance and there's no regular bus service that goes anywhere near my house. I drive a ten year old petrol-powered car (admittedly quite a lavish one) because it was dirt cheap and is going to cost me less to run over the next four or five years than the cost of a new EV, hybrid or even small-engined diesel or petrol hatchback. I've been out on a test drive in a Tesla Model S P90D and if I could afford one I'm not sure there's any other car I'd even consider at the price point, but most people just don't live that kind of life. I do, however, agree with the overall sentiment of a diesel scrappage scheme. The proliferation of diesel cars in Britain and resultant problems are entirely a result of brain-dead legislation that was made with little forethought or scientific input. An immediate legislative about-face on diesel cars and return to a majority of petrol passenger cars would be an easy stopgap to implement until EVs or other alternatives become more practical.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;51873189]petrol is now cheaper than diesel in the UK.[/QUOTE] Really? Lucky you :(
[QUOTE=GordonZombie;51873420]It's well and nice telling people not to use diesel cars from a well-paid position in government and all the financial security that comes with it, but at the end of the day, a lot of people here at the moment aren't on the best income and are taking what they can get. It doesn't help that the cunts currently in government levy such high taxes on the majority of the population (without anything going back ot them thanks to social and healthcare cuts), petrol just being among one of the many things affected by said taxation. This isn't a solution, it just fucks more people over. EVs are still a way off from being affordable over here at the moment and believe me I know plenty of people who'd probably stick to public transportation if it wasn't for the fact that bus services are unreliable/don't take people where they need to go (plus they're raising fares with no improvement in service) and train fares are just downright extortionate.[/QUOTE] Petrol and diesel should be taxed because of the damage they do to the environment. Everything that has a bad impact on the environment, and people's health should be taxed. Diesel kills tens of thousands of people every year. Obviously it's a cost of living increase though so it should be either phased in or schemes provided to help change. EVs are great in the UK. Leafs are fairly affordable and there's a lot of hybrid options. There's not much of a reason to get a regular non-hybrid vehicle anymore. [QUOTE=Strike 86;51873470]Right. Fuel prices are ridiculous in this country as it is, and most EVs are still in high demand with correspondingly high prices. Similar situation for small engined eco-hatches. It's all well and good being super concerned with the environment and using less fuel but truth is a lot of people simply can't afford to. EVs are a relatively new mainstream idea and they currently have a high entry price. I have to drive 40 miles per day to get to and from my workplace because I live on the set of Deliverance and there's no regular bus service that goes anywhere near my house. I drive a ten year old petrol-powered car (admittedly quite a lavish one) because it was dirt cheap and is going to cost me less to run over the next four or five years than the cost of a new EV, hybrid or even small-engined diesel or petrol hatchback. I've been out on a test drive in a Tesla Model S P90D and if I could afford one I'm not sure there's any other car I'd even consider at the price point, but most people just don't live that kind of life. I do, however, agree with the overall sentiment of a diesel scrappage scheme. The proliferation of diesel cars in Britain and resultant problems are entirely a result of brain-dead legislation that was made with little forethought or scientific input. An immediate legislative about-face on diesel cars and return to a majority of petrol passenger cars would be an easy stopgap to implement until EVs or other alternatives become more practical.[/QUOTE] I also drive 40 miles a day for work. A Leaf is fine for this and looks like it's going to cost me about £10 a month in electric vs £130 for my petrol car. [editline]25th February 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;51873509]Really? Lucky you :([/QUOTE] Petrol is actually cheaper to produce. If diesel costs less then your government is doing something to cause that.
[QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;51873135]Then make petrol cheaper. I'm pretty sure people wouldn't buy diesels if the shittiest petrol didn't cost as much as the most premium of diesel fuel per litre.[/QUOTE] Petrol is already cheaper than diesel over here by around 2p/litre on average. The price went up a bit after the whole NO2 thing.
[QUOTE=TestECull;51873085]Incentivise them to drive gas by nuking the gas tax that makes them want a diesel in the first place, then. [editline]25th February 2017[/editline] We do need to crack down on this shit, and we don't need new laws to do it. Rolling coal is a form of exhibitionist driving, something that's already ticketable with severe penalties as-is. We just need to convince cops to start impounding the brodozers that do it and we'll be good to go.[/QUOTE] And start cracking down on stancefags too. With how cash-strapped every department is, I don't see why the police don't start ticketing this shit more often.
[QUOTE=FreakyMe;51872830]Meanwhile in America, [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal"]Rolling[/url] [URL="http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/07/why-people-are-paying-5000-to-pollute-more.html"]Coal [/URL]is still ambiguously legal,[URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html"] due to[/url] [URL="http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/coal-rollers-envionrment-prius-vermont-cyclist-1.3619909"]lack of enforcement[/URL].[/QUOTE] This kind of shit goes beyond making a political statement and rolls over to just being straight sadism. At least people who buy low MPG guzzlers buy them for another reason beyond their low MPG. This is just killing the environment for the sake of being a genuinely awful person.
[QUOTE=Richard Simmons;51873108]Should we be preaching for a greater police presence for people rolling coal? Its already against a few states and the EPA. So, we should be doing what?[/QUOTE] You don't really need greater police presence, you just need existing police forces to actually ticket people when they do dumb shit like that.
[QUOTE=Fapplejack;51874223]This is just killing the environment for the sake of being a genuinely awful person.[/QUOTE] The American right wing did an excellent job of convincing people that: Climate change doesn't exists / Humans can't change the climate OR We don't even need the climate so just do what you want (this guy seems to believe that)
[QUOTE=FreakyMe;51872830]Meanwhile in America, [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal"]Rolling[/url] [URL="http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/07/why-people-are-paying-5000-to-pollute-more.html"]Coal [/URL]is still ambiguously legal,[URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/05/business/energy-environment/rolling-coal-in-diesel-trucks-to-rebel-and-provoke.html"] due to[/url] [URL="http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/coal-rollers-envionrment-prius-vermont-cyclist-1.3619909"]lack of enforcement[/URL].[/QUOTE] Jfc people who do this shit deserve to have their cars keyed.
Rolling Coal is a stupid gimmick with no purpose other than showing off. Downright scrapping Diesel and try and force people to pick something that isn't Diesel is just as stupid. Especially with how expensive gas is.
[QUOTE=Sunkite;51876414]Rolling Coal is a stupid gimmick with no purpose other than showing off. Downright scrapping Diesel and try and force people to pick something that isn't Diesel is just as stupid. Especially with how expensive gas is.[/QUOTE] Why? Diesel is proven to kill tens of thousands of people in the UK every year. At they very least people in cities should switch to petrol.
[QUOTE=Morgen;51873328] There's some grants for it but I don't think there really should be. The benefits to the environment are questionable. Really we need some major work done on heat pumps.[/QUOTE] my point being that same government warning us over diesel are giving grants for domestic biofuel systems which are not very good for the environment, I heard a guy on TV arguing that they are in fact worse than fossil fuels.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;51876631]my point being that same government warning us over diesel are giving grants for domestic biofuel systems which are not very good for the environment, I heard a guy on TV arguing that they are in fact worse than fossil fuels.[/QUOTE] To be fair on the government though credible studies on the issue are only relatively recent. They should certainly be repealed though, or at least stop accepting new applications. Heat pumps are the way to go but they are a bit expensive and could do with a bit more R&D.
[QUOTE=Morgen;51873541]Petrol and diesel should be taxed because of the damage they do to the environment. Everything that has a bad impact on the environment, and people's health should be taxed. Diesel kills tens of thousands of people every year. Obviously it's a cost of living increase though so it should be either phased in or schemes provided to help change. EVs are great in the UK. Leafs are fairly affordable and there's a lot of hybrid options. There's not much of a reason to get a regular non-hybrid vehicle anymore. I also drive 40 miles a day for work. A Leaf is fine for this and looks like it's going to cost me about £10 a month in electric vs £130 for my petrol car. [editline]25th February 2017[/editline] Petrol is actually cheaper to produce. If diesel costs less then your government is doing something to cause that.[/QUOTE] I'd NEVER get a Leaf though. Badly spent money. And you should only tax petrol and diesel when there are no reasons to use it, and when EV cars are fully viable, and not an extreme of "you either get garbage for cheap, or something good for all your money and your soul", which is why I wouldn't get a Leaf or anything else. I mean, for the price of a Leaf here, I could buy a fully equipped diesel A3 8P with all the features. So its either a bad looking and most likely badly equipped EV, or something nice in every way except that it pollutes. But this won't change for a good few years, until we have quite a bit of used and nice EV cars on the market. Taxing diesel and petrol can't be anything other than a pipedream for now, because so many families depend on it, and they surely can't sell their daily beaters for something as expensive as an EV. And my government is crap. We even get kicked in the ass with diesel, let alone petrol. Truckers go to Spain to fill up.
m8 "take a long hard think" about ur mum. but in all seriousness, i think traffic management is key to concentrated emission zones. some areas are beyond a joke.
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