The Connection Between Video Game Violence and "IRL" Violence
45 replies, posted
IMO, it's not the video game, but the person playing the video game. If you let a mentally unstable person play a virtual simulator where the goal is the kill others, what do you expect? Like guns, we have to be careful who we sell violent video games to. Think about this: How much do you play video games? Now, have these games ever influenced you to be violent or attempt to kill anybody? Exactly! Nearly 2.6 million people play Call of Duty, and in the past 10 years there have been around 9 mass shootings. If video games influenced people that much, just imagine the complete chaos we would be in right now.
We also have to remember that everybody sees themselves as the protagonist. So the mass murderer most likely morally supports what they are doing as "right". America is also a violent country to begin with. Since the country has been established, we have been involved in some sort of conflict. We also idolize soldiers as super heroes. When do you ever here about a charity owner, or a doctor getting as much respect.
IN CONCLUSION: It's not the video game's fault, it's the peoples'. Parents shouldn't be letting their young/mentally unstable child play violent video games.
It would be interesting if we had psychologists here to be about to debate about this stuff. I'll admit I have zero knowledge of psychology and so my following statements are normative in nature.
I believe that most cases like school shootings are performed by those who have poor mental wellbeing; such as those who may suffer from being antisocial, have depression or some other kind of mental illness. However saying that, I do not doubt that video games could be a trigger for such people to perform violent acts.
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=RedShirt;40982204]IN CONCLUSION: It's not the video game's fault, it's the peoples'. Parents shouldn't be letting their young/mentally unstable child play violent video games.[/QUOTE]
Sometimes it's hard to identify if a child has mental illness, yes this is an anecdote but my parents only realised my brother had bipolar after it had already been well-developed in him. It's not easy to identify mental illnesses in people.
A video game is not a weapon, we don't have to be very careful when selling them. If a person is mentally unstable anything can set them off, it could be an event, a movie, a book, and other people.
From my experience violent video games have never had any sort of effects on me or other children around me when I was younger. When I first saw M-rated games I thought they were pretty cool, I even got myself a few if I ever managed to get my parents to buy me them. Around 8 years old I had a clear understanding that what I saw on the screen wasnt actually real and all of my friends who played much more violent video games than me were friendly and social people.
Once upon a time I read an interesting theory that video games are the reason there are less violent crimes (specifically gun related crimes) in the real world. By letting someone play an open-world sandbox game such as GTAIV, they are more inclined to do in the game what they are otherwise morally inclined not to do in real life in the game due to the simulation of the event rather than the real thing.
For instance, a kid gets a ticket by a police officer and may be mentally unstable to the point he wants to kill the officer or some other cop in retaliation. Due to the fact he has the game at home to play to vent that anger on police officers, he no longer has the will to commit the actual crime in the real world.
Now the article I read was much longer and was much better worded and detailed than this, but it's the general idea that a simulation is a better alternative to some people to prevent a violent crime from happening.
My game library is about 90% violent in some way. I haven't gone out and shot anybody. I'm not being a public menace.
It's the person, not their favorite activity outside of crime.
I know for a fact that ones social life has a majority of influence on this.
A person without a social life could probably end up adopting from game characters, rather than the people surrounding them.
Just imagine the mind of someone who's entire life's dedicated to sleeping, eating, and virtual slaughtering. They'd become incredible mental unsable.
generally the people who go out and do something seem to all be either off their meds or completely suicidal
don't believe me? go lookup all the kids who have shot up places in the last 8 months, garentee that all those stories will blame some video game, but will make a small note that the person was off their meds for X amount of months or has severe depression
but like the whole gun-control vs mental health awareness debate, its easier to vilify the videogames than it is to demonstrate the backwards and archaic attitude we in the u.s. have towards mental health
I don't believe in any connection with violent behavior and video games. It's not an issue of games openly promoting violence, it's the fact that people who already have violent tendencies or a mental illness just happen to play video games with violence in them.
As a health student going into med with parts of psychology in my course, yes violent video games have an effect but no more/less than all sorts of violent media, and just cause you watch a django unchained or something doesn't make you a serial killer to be. Also it's not a sure thing, playing a round of battlefield didn't make you yell at your little brother for stealing your shit again, your little brother stealing your shit made you mad and you would have been just fine if your bro didn't take your shit. You still would have yelled at him if you didn't play the game but the game might make you yell louder and get a little madder.
[editline]12th June 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=The_J_Hat;41001897]I don't believe in any connection with violent behavior and video games. It's not an issue of games openly promoting violence, it's the fact that people who already have violent tendencies or a mental illness just happen to play video games with violence in them.[/QUOTE]
Every person has violent tendencies, its called the human condition. Unless you want to tell me you've never raised your voice at someone or hit a person in your life.
[QUOTE=Da Big Man;40985720]Once upon a time I read an interesting theory that video games are the reason there are less violent crimes (specifically gun related crimes) in the real world. By letting someone play an open-world sandbox game such as GTAIV, they are more inclined to do in the game what they are otherwise morally inclined not to do in real life in the game due to the simulation of the event rather than the real thing.
For instance, a kid gets a ticket by a police officer and may be mentally unstable to the point he wants to kill the officer or some other cop in retaliation. Due to the fact he has the game at home to play to vent that anger on police officers, he no longer has the will to commit the actual crime in the real world.
Now the article I read was much longer and was much better worded and detailed than this, but it's the general idea that a simulation is a better alternative to some people to prevent a violent crime from happening.[/QUOTE]
If that theory is true then it's kinda funny (for me at least) since (for some reason) It makes me think of a maniac barely holding back his homicidal instincts by going on his daily Cop rampage in GTA IV.
I don't think there is any more of a connection to violence in real life and videogames, than there is a connection between violence in real life and movies or books. Videogames, movies, and books alike are for the most part created as entertainment to help us relax by letting ourselves get immersed in a reality beside our own. People who draw inspiration from violent media for their actions in real life are people who had mental problems to begin with.
[QUOTE=mokkan;41002055]As a health student going into med with parts of psychology in my course, yes violent video games have an effect but no more/less than all sorts of violent media, and just cause you watch a django unchained or something doesn't make you a serial killer to be. Also it's not a sure thing, playing a round of battlefield didn't make you yell at your little brother for stealing your shit again, your little brother stealing your shit made you mad and you would have been just fine if your bro didn't take your shit. You still would have yelled at him if you didn't play the game but the game might make you yell louder and get a little madder.[/QUOTE]
I think that the "yelling louder" part has to do that you were in a competitive mind-set. I remember having rage-fits playing Super Mario Galaxy, and that's not violent. I think a person might do the same if they were playing sports or any other thing that challenges them.
I'm pretty sure Pekka-Eric Auvinen shot people at the school because he was deranged + bullied in the past, not because "teh vidyagams told him to!!!11!!1"
Try telling that to any moronic Christian soccer mom who also devoutly follows the media while she's not busy orbiting an imaginary person's dick and overall being a moron.
[QUOTE=SelfishDragon;41005721]I think that the "yelling louder" part has to do that you were in a competitive mind-set. I remember having rage-fits playing Super Mario Galaxy, and that's not violent. I think a person might do the same if they were playing sports or any other thing that challenges them.[/QUOTE]
Its a single factor not the entire cause. Violent media (not just games) definitely has an effect but it's not the cause like people make out.
[QUOTE=TorrentR;41011577]I'm pretty sure Pekka-Eric Auvinen shot people at the school because he was deranged + bullied in the past, not because "teh vidyagams told him to!!!11!!1"
Try telling that to any moronic Christian soccer mom who also devoutly follows the media while she's not busy orbiting an imaginary person's dick and overall being a moron.[/QUOTE]
Not to mention, I don't think any school shooter did it solely because of video games. That would be a very weird and a simple connection to make.
Video games just don't or can't count for all the school shootings and such violent incidents. Although it is notable that most, if not all school shooters do have been familiar with video games and the computer. So, video games etc. are evidently connected to a bigger scheme of things rather than being the only connection that leads into school shootings.
And since you are bringing Eric Auvinen here, some of them are more or less batshit. Usually they have a lot to say to their peers or whoever, like Cho or Breivik (Breivik even denied criminal guilt=that's batshit), but then there are cases like Lanza or Holmes, who are mostly shut-ins.
What does this all mean? I may as well quote the other poster in this thread by saying "I'll admit I have zero knowledge of psychology and so my statements are normative in nature."
I find it rather disturbing that video games (along with many other forms of media) often depict violence as the best solution to a problem. I think that to certain unstable individuals, video games might create or reinforce the impression that violence is a good idea.
Why don't they just ban severely mentally unstable people from playing video games then?
The only "solid" argument I have ever seen for any sort of violent media influencing the consumer is the [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobo_doll_experiment]Bobo doll experiment[/url] from the 1960s. I still think the study was shit, since what the fuck else are you going to do with a Bobo doll except smack it around, but still.
The fact of the matter is that very little research actually supports any claims against violent media (or specifically video games). There's also so, so, so, SO many factors that play into every single case where video games are blamed or mentioned that it could have been anything else that is probably much more likely.
I blame people who can't discern reality from fiction. Blame could also go to parents who let their kids do whatever the fuck they want and just ignore them. Plop 'em in front of a vidya and they'll notice the vidya character gets attention from violence. And when you're ignored, well, monkey see, monkey shoots up local school.
[QUOTE=coldroll5;41025102]Why don't they just ban severely mentally unstable people from playing video games then?[/QUOTE]
Because then they'd have to ban everybody because it effects everybody
[editline]15th June 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Unisath;41042525]The only "solid" argument I have ever seen for any sort of violent media influencing the consumer is the [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobo_doll_experiment]Bobo doll experiment[/url] from the 1960s. I still think the study was shit, since what the fuck else are you going to do with a Bobo doll except smack it around, but still.
The fact of the matter is that very little research actually supports any claims against violent media (or specifically video games). There's also so, so, so, SO many factors that play into every single case where video games are blamed or mentioned that it could have been anything else that is probably much more likely.[/QUOTE]
Banduras experiment had nothing to do with violent media, it was about the effect of role models and if you read it, children who saw the role model be nice to it were nice to it and children who saw it kicked around kicked it around, and children whose model ignored it also ignored it.
[QUOTE=mokkan;41043815]Banduras experiment had nothing to do with violent media, it was about the effect of role models and if you read it, children who saw the role model be nice to it were nice to it and children who saw it kicked around kicked it around, and children whose model ignored it also ignored it.[/QUOTE]
This is personally the reason to me that age restrictions are important for violent media (not just games). While many say they played GTA as kids and it didn't make them want to shoot anyone, I've seen kids try to replicate what they see in movies or pretend to be video game character, and I can see how mental or social circumstances could lead to actual physical violence replicated from that, because really, what stops them? They see a person who solves conflicts through violence, and becomes a hero through that, the kids see that, and wanna be just like them.
Violent media should be shown to those who are already past that phase, those who understand it and know it's not the way. Kids play shooters for fun, which, to the most part, don't seem to send messages further than "Shoot guns; become a hero", or at least not in a way that is understandable for kids. I am just generalizing violent games as a whole here, so please don't show me examples of which games don't send anti-violence messages. As you might can tell from my avatar, I am a big fan of Metal Gear Solid, so I am aware that not every game rewards you for being violent.
[QUOTE=Trismegistus;41107719]This is personally the reason to me that age restrictions are important for violent media (not just games). While many say they played GTA as kids and it didn't make them want to shoot anyone, I've seen kids try to replicate what they see in movies or pretend to be video game character, and I can see how mental or social circumstances could lead to actual physical violence replicated from that, because really, what stops them? They see a person who solves conflicts through violence, and becomes a hero through that, the kids see that, and wanna be just like them.
Violent media should be shown to those who are already past that phase, those who understand it and know it's not the way. Kids play shooters for fun, which, to the most part, don't seem to send messages further than "Shoot guns; become a hero", or at least not in a way that is understandable for kids. I am just generalizing violent games as a whole here, so please don't show me examples of which games don't send anti-violence messages. As you might can tell from my avatar, I am a big fan of Metal Gear Solid, so I am aware that not every game rewards you for being violent.[/QUOTE]
Because you are literally insulting people's intelligence by saying they are just going to blindly make those associations with no critical thought whatsoever.
I watched terminator 2 literally about 100+ times as a child. As far as I'm aware, I never shot anybody and I still dont think shooting guns makes you a hero.
Kids aren't as dumb as you think they are.
[QUOTE=JaegerMonster;41107795]Because you are literally insulting people's intelligence by saying they are just going to blindly make those associations with no critical thought whatsoever.
I watched terminator 2 literally about 100+ times as a child. As far as I'm aware, I never shot anybody and I still dont think shooting guns makes you a hero.
Kids aren't as dumb as you think they are.[/QUOTE]
I never meant to imply that, and I am sorry if I did. I am not saying kids are dumb, but are easier to influence than adults are, and just to make myself clear, that does not go for anyone, so I hope we can agree on that.
Perhaps I was a bit vague on saying "mental or social circumstances". I just meant to say that kids can adapt those to be their role models under certain circumstances, which does not imply that every kid would do that as you might have derived from my post. There are always other reasons, but I think that comes without saying, because if really violent media had that much impact on everyone's development and behaviour, there would have been a global ban already.
[QUOTE=IKTM;41020417]I find it rather disturbing that video games (along with many other forms of media) often depict violence as the best solution to a problem. I think that to certain unstable individuals, video games might create or reinforce the impression that violence is a good idea.[/QUOTE]
This is not entirely true. In several recent games, especially stealth-action, you get rewarded for avoiding murder as much as possible.
In games like Call of Duty or Half life, however, violence is depicted as not the "best solution", but rather as the "only possible choice", just like it is in real war. You can't negotiate with the enemy in the middle of a firefight.
There is no connection between these two it is simply the person and what their mental status is or hoe they feel and whst they've been through. There has never been a case where someone goes on a mass killing and says "I thought it was okay because in cod I kill people and they just respawn" Least I am pretty sure there hasn't.
I dont think theres a connection at all. If im honest, going on a game like GTA and massacring people calms me down somewhat if im angry :v:
In my opinion, people who blame video games have little/no knowledge of video games and have no proof to prove it. Until a detailed study is done into this, I believe there is no connection in the slightest
One of my papers for an English composition class this past fall semester in college was on this topic, are video games linked to an increase in violence in youth?
Realize that our minds process millions of thoughts daily. Obviously all of these thoughts are not desirable. Some are just uncomfortable thoughts we think about willingly, and others just pop into our head on impulse. You look at someone at the top of a set of stairs and think "It would be funny if I push them off." I could possibly bet money that most people think their the only people who think of things like that, and that is makes them terrible people.
The fact of the matter is that violent and unwanted thoughts are not abnormal at all. The correct term for these thoughts is call "intrusive" thoughts. They don't make you a bad person, in fact everyone gets them occasionally. Many studies have been done into the topic, however I can not recall my paper enough to cite any of them
With that topic put forward, thoughts are just that, thoughts. Not actions. Video games may put more thoughts in your head, but a person in a correct mental standing, who knows the difference between right and wrong, reality and non-reality, should have no problem simply putting these thoughts aside, just like other intrusive thoughts.
I, personally, am not the most stable person out there. I'm not exactly fucked up, but I am far from a normal person. I have been playing video games since I was about 10 or so years old. I was playing shooters from the age of 12 or 13. I could never harm anybody in reality. It is just out of the question.
After playing violent games, I find it numbs my mind to violence in games, but no where else. Since I don't watch movies as much as most other people, I am more shocked by a violent act in a move more easily than a much more violent act in a game (whether by myself or another character).
The "violent games = violent children" argument only seems to help politicians exploit people's fear of the relatively new medium.
There is no connection in my opnion
In my opinion, video games are no better (and also, no worse) than any other form of "violent" entertainment. The fact that congressmen continue to blame the popular form of entertainment as the problem is part of the problem itself.
Despite what they might tell you, constant, violent crime is on the decline.
[video=youtube;iGsKKX9qZtA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGsKKX9qZtA[/video]
This is, without a doubt, one of my favorite videos about the issue, simply because how thoroughly John Stossel (a [i]Fox News Host[/i]) puts it to bed as illogical. Amusingly, the video also discusses the fact that the "problem" in the 50's and 60's was... the comic book. It displays the possibility that people who are indeed placing blame on forms of entertainment might truly have little to no idea what they are talking about.
The facts from the video:
-Violent crime is on the decline. We can possibly attribute this to the fact that violent crime is more often reported by the media, however.
-There is no direct correlation (and there never was any direct correlation, and there probably won't be any direct correlation) between violent video games and violence such as mass shootings.
-[del]John Stossel is a bro.[/del]
The problem, in my humble opinion, is the lack of support of mental healthcare. This is not just simply mental healthcare not being accessible enough, it is also compounded by the fact that we know very, very little about the brain and its workings (although incidents in the past, such as Phineas Gage's accident, have given us an [i]idea[/i] that different parts of the brain may affect thoughts and memories).
The true remedy to the problem, in my opinion, would be to sharply improve mental healthcare in order to adequately treat the criminally insane.
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