Wait, how can a grenade be ambidextrous? I thought they were already that?
fucking sick, new nades in video games
-snip- nvm
That's actually pretty neat, being able to choose whether you want "frag" or "conc" with just one grenade.
This isn't entirely new, although it looks like the way they're doing it is. In WW2 the Germans had the "Splitterring" device for the M24 and M43 "stick" grenades - a sleeve that went over the explosive head of the grenade, turning it from a concussion grenade into a fragmentation grenade. I think the Russians had a similar thing for some of their grenades.
Why?
Flashbangs, which are dedicated to this task, are still only effective if used in exactly the right circumstances. This would be decent for special operations, but grunts are going to be worthless with them.
Just waiting for a grunt squad to be inserting into a house, but want someone alive
"ok chuck the new one in"
BOOM
"did you set it to fucking concussion you shit-based retard? God fucking damn it Carl"
[QUOTE=GunFox;51080236]Why?
Flashbangs, which are dedicated to this task, are still only effective if used in exactly the right circumstances. This would be decent for special operations, but grunts are going to be worthless with them.[/QUOTE]
"Concussion" in this case refers to grenades that use their blast wave to do damage, rather than fragmentation. Russians have been using this sort for a while IIRC.
[QUOTE=GunFox;51080236]Why?
Flashbangs, which are dedicated to this task, are still only effective if used in exactly the right circumstances. This would be decent for special operations, but grunts are going to be worthless with them.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Amplar;51080283]Just waiting for a grunt squad to be inserting into a house, but want someone alive
"ok chuck the new one in"
BOOM
"did you set it to fucking concussion you shit-based retard? God fucking damn it Carl"[/QUOTE]
Concussion grenades are not non lethal. They just limit shrapnel and use the explosive shock wave to kill instead.
[QUOTE=GunFox;51080236]Why?
Flashbangs, which are dedicated to this task, are still only effective if used in exactly the right circumstances. This would be decent for special operations, but grunts are going to be worthless with them.[/QUOTE]
I think you're misunderstanding what blast/concussion grenades are. They're basically just an explosive - they don't have the metal shrapnel of a fragmentation grenade. That makes their lethal radius a lot smaller - with a fragmentation grenade in an open field, you [I]can[/I] have casualties up to 30m from the grenade (although most are much closer), while concussion grenades are usually only dangerous within 2m or so (there's variance).
Neither of these are flash-bangs. Both of the modes on this grenade are lethal - it's just a matter of minimum safe distance. Think of it like the Dial-A-Yield system for nukes, just at a much, much smaller scale.
Fragmentation grenades are (according to conventional military doctrine) more useful while defending, since the user will be behind cover which shields them from the fragments, while concussion grenades are more useful while attacking, because they can be thrown farther than their lethal radius.
[QUOTE=DEMONSKUL;51079936]Wait, how can a grenade be ambidextrous? I thought they were already that?[/QUOTE]
Lefties have to hold it like this
[IMG]http://www.inetres.com/gp/military/infantry/grenade/hand/left.gif[/IMG]
To keep the thumb on the spoon.
why would they call it an ambidextrous grenade and not just like a multi-grenade?
[QUOTE=Pops;51081125]why would they call it an ambidextrous grenade and not just like a multi-grenade?[/QUOTE]
It is ambidextrous in addition to having two operating modes. Existing grenades can be used left-handed but you have to hold it differently, as Raidyr said. I'm not sure why that's the most noteworthy feature, but I never considered BBC a particularly good source for weapons info so it might just be weak reporting.
[QUOTE=milktree;51080541]Concussion grenades are not non lethal. They just limit shrapnel and use the explosive shock wave to kill instead.[/QUOTE]
This is what happens when people get their information about weapons from video games.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;51080860]Lefties have to hold it like this
[IMG]http://www.inetres.com/gp/military/infantry/grenade/hand/left.gif[/IMG]
To keep the thumb on the spoon.[/QUOTE]
Looks dangerous compared to the right-handed throwing position.
With the right-handed position, you have your thumb close to the base of the pin so you can pull it out straight.
With the left handed position, it looks like you could accidentally leverage the grenade out of your hands when pulling the pin.
[QUOTE=milktree;51080541]Concussion grenades are not non lethal. They just limit shrapnel and use the explosive shock wave to kill instead.[/QUOTE]
I am aware. My assumption was that they were fucking it up in the news article because concussion grenades were shit at their job and it is super weird that anyone would want to bring them back. Especially given the physics here.
A concussion grenade needs to generate a large shockwave in order to overpressure the room it is in. This means more explosive. Alternatively, the amount of explosive in an M67 is already sufficient (previous concussion grenades were TNT and not Comp B), which presents an amusing problem:
If the amount of Comp B in an M67 is sufficient to serve as a concussion explosive, then just unscrew the metal casing from an M67 and throw the core.
If you need MORE explosive, then you are adding more weight and reducing the effective range of the frag, and thereby increasing the safety hazard of using it in frag mode. Can't throw it as far and therefore risk falling short and ending up in the wounding zone (15m).
Frankly I'd rather just throw it in frag mode and stand further back, which means roughly the same amount of concussive force coupled with shrapnel. If you throw a concussive grenade and it turns out that there was a sufficient number of windows open, or even just enough windows in the building, you might not generate enough overpressure.
This is how a suitcase bomb in the same room as Hitler failed to kill him. Humans are inherently resistant to concussive force.
The only grenade type we didn't dump because it sucked compared to the M67 were white phosphorous grenades. Which, if we are talking about minimal collateral damage, are still technically the ironic victors.
[QUOTE=GunFox;51084780]I am aware. My assumption was that they were fucking it up in the news article because concussion grenades were shit at their job and it is super weird that anyone would want to bring them back. Especially given the physics here.
A concussion grenade needs to generate a large shockwave in order to overpressure the room it is in. This means more explosive. Alternatively, the amount of explosive in an M67 is already sufficient (previous concussion grenades were TNT and not Comp B), which presents an amusing problem:
If the amount of Comp B in an M67 is sufficient to serve as a concussion explosive, then just unscrew the metal casing from an M67 and throw the core.
[/QUOTE]
You can't just unscrew an M67's casing and throw the "core", there is no core unless you count the detonator. The explosive charge is packed into the grenade and generally isn't removable without melting it.
Plus the suitcase bomb that Hitler survived was said to have been behind a 2-3in thick board that was the table leg. That directed the pressure outwards and away from him. You can still get shit like blown ear drums, burst lungs, or even traumatic brain injury from a 3oz block of C4 going off in the same room as you. The whole point of an offensive grenade is to be tossed into a room that you're about to clear, because fragments from frag grenades can go through the wall you're behind and fuck you and your team up.
If this new grenade is worth a shit, it would help a lot with logistics. Just ship them out in frag configuration and teams themselves can reconfigure them into offensive grenades for room clearing. No need to keep the M67, unless this one is more expensive or complicated than it.
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