Why? - Donetsk rebels blocking 255 tons of humanitarian aid from the Red Cross.
34 replies, posted
[url]http://lugansk-news.com/trucks-with-humanitarian-aid-from-icrc-were-stopped-by-pro-russian-rebels-in-donetsk-region/[/url]
[quote=Lugansk News]The trucks with humanitarian aid from International Committee of Red Cross (ICRC) were stopped by pro-Russian rebels in Donetsk Region on the territory which is not controlled by Ukrainian authorities.
Yesterday 16 cargo trucks with humanitarian aid from ICRC passed by Ukrainian checkpoint “Bugas”. They were transporting 255 tons of food, construction materials and other things for people of Donetsk Region.[/quote]
These fuckers don't care about ethics. I wager they'd take the supplies for themselves.
Red cross is trying to smuggle NATO troops into the zone in them.
The why has a very simple answer. Russia.
Uh how about we wait a day and actually find out why and then post articles about it.
Would 16 trucks get stopped at the border of any other country who is at "war"?
[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;48260604]Uh how about we wait a day and actually find out why and then post articles about it.[/QUOTE]
Why? It's not like this didn't happen.
[url]http://uatoday.tv/news/militants-do-not-allow-red-cross-humanitarian-aid-entering-donetsk-459754.html[/url]
Citing the same source as above though, the SBU.
"What is this? Actual humanitarian aid?
I WAS EXPECTING TANKS AGAIN GOD DAMN IT!"
[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;48260148]Red cross is trying to smuggle NATO troops into the zone in them.[/QUOTE]
Well Russia does exactly that, why would they expect any different from other sources :v:
Literally the basics of an information war
Paint the other side as unexplainably evil and inept as possible while obscuring any other facts or pieces of information that may point to the opposite
Why are they blocking the trucks? Nobody knows, their motives are unknown to us therefore they must be up to something immoral or inherently evil.
Right? Oh wait Im being apologetic Ill go fuck myself then.
[QUOTE=Melnek;48261092]Literally the basics of an information war
Paint the other side as unexplainably evil and inept as possible while obscuring any other facts or pieces of information that may point to the opposite
Why are they blocking the trucks? Nobody knows, their motives are unknown to us therefore they must be up to something immoral or inherently evil.
Right? Oh wait Im being apologetic Ill go fuck myself then.[/QUOTE]
Or you could actually read the news article.
[quote=Lugansk News]But those trucks were stopped by illegal armed groups of so-called Donetsk People’s Republic on the territory which is not controlled by Ukrainian authorities, [B]they refused the trucks to pass by saying that they didn’t have some documents.[/B][/quote]
There was a reason, it was just incredibly stupid.
[QUOTE=purvisdavid1;48261119]Or you could actually read the news article.
There was a reason, it was just incredibly stupid.[/QUOTE]
"You "don't" have the "DOCUMENTS'" is more how I read this
[QUOTE=purvisdavid1;48261119]Or you could actually read the news article.
There was a reason, it was just incredibly stupid.[/QUOTE]
Just like every one of our enemies and people whose interests are less important to be sympathetic toward. Incredibly stupid.
[QUOTE=Melnek;48261212]Just like every one of our enemies and people whose interests are less important to be sympathetic toward. Incredibly stupid.[/QUOTE]
Whatever the fuck you're doing, knock it off.
First you ramble like you haven't read the article, now you ramble about this? The fuck?
"You don't have the right documents" means "Fuck off, we feel like not letting you through"
[QUOTE=Melnek;48261092]Literally the basics of an information war
Paint the other side as unexplainably evil and inept as possible while obscuring any other facts or pieces of information that may point to the opposite
Why are they blocking the trucks? Nobody knows, their motives are unknown to us therefore they must be up to something immoral or inherently evil.
Right? Oh wait Im being apologetic Ill go fuck myself then.[/QUOTE]
I'm sure they had good reason to shoot down that passenger jet too? I bet all those innocent people didn't have the right documents either.
[QUOTE=finbe;48262731]I'm sure they had good reason to shoot down that passenger jet too? I bet all those innocent people didn't have the right documents either.[/QUOTE]
Hardly comparable. Even if Ukraine doesn't want to admit, it is in war, therefore entire region over there is in a warzone, and soldiers don't take chances.
[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;48263091]Hardly comparable. Even if Ukraine doesn't want to admit, it is in war, therefore entire region over there is in a warzone, and soldiers don't take chances.[/QUOTE]
"It's a war" is [B]not[/B] an excuse to shoot down a passenger jet. It's not even about taking chances, it's about trigger happy rebels shooting down anything in the sky. This AA crew was "unlucky" enough to be armed with a weapon that could shoot much higher than the others, right out of the war zone and into civilian airspace. And that's what they did with it, shot down a civilian airliner.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;48263443]"It's a war" is [B]not[/B] an excuse to shoot down a passenger jet. It's not even about taking chances, it's about trigger happy rebels shooting down anything in the sky. This AA crew was "unlucky" enough to be armed with a weapon that could shoot much higher than the others, right out of the war zone and into civilian airspace. And that's what they did with it, shot down a civilian airliner.[/QUOTE]
To be fair, accidents happen in war and there's never a conflict without accidental civilian deaths or even a conflict with only a [I]few[/I] accidental civilian deaths.
The rebels are in control of the area and they have an obvious incentive to regulate what comes in and out of it. That's why they have security checkpoints at the border. Just like every other state that tries to control what passes its borders. And this area just so happens to be a warzone. Why is it surprising that they have regulations and want proper documentation for those passing through? From what the article says, it looks like the Red Cross is crying about their own fuckup and the only reason why this is news at all is because the Red Cross has enough clout to make a story out of nothing.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;48263443]"It's a war" is [B]not[/B] an excuse to shoot down a passenger jet. It's not even about taking chances, it's about trigger happy rebels shooting down anything in the sky. This AA crew was "unlucky" enough to be armed with a weapon that could shoot much higher than the others, right out of the war zone and into civilian airspace. And that's what they did with it, shot down a civilian airliner.[/QUOTE]
I think when you are in there, absolutely certain in yourself that you fight for a just cause that you believe in, and have a very direct threat of air-to-ground attacks, you become a tad bit nervous and trigger happy, dont you think?
[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;48266089]I think when you are in there, absolutely certain in yourself that you fight for a just cause that you believe in, and have a very direct threat of air-to-ground attacks, you become a tad bit nervous and trigger happy, dont you think?[/QUOTE]
Regardless, that doesn't make it any more acceptable. Nor does it excuse how the rebels have been vehemently denying it and looting the wreckage, trying to blame Ukraine in the process.
[QUOTE=Melnek;48261212]Just like every one of our enemies and people whose interests are less important to be sympathetic toward. Incredibly stupid.[/QUOTE]
Literally one of the worst posters I have ever seen.
[QUOTE=Headhumpy;48266554]Literally one of the worst posters I have ever seen.[/QUOTE]
I quite like melnek.
hate to be ' that guy. But are there any better sources for this? the article provided has got vested interests to smear one side, as would say BBC or guardian but I feel they are less likely to fabricate or spin as much.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;48263443]"It's a war" is [B]not[/B] an excuse to shoot down a passenger jet. It's not even about taking chances, it's about trigger happy rebels shooting down anything in the sky. This AA crew was "unlucky" enough to be armed with a weapon that could shoot much higher than the others, right out of the war zone and into civilian airspace. And that's what they did with it, shot down a civilian airliner.[/QUOTE]
[url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655[/url]
trigger happy Americans, right?
[url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_Arab_Airlines_Flight_114[/url]
trigger happy israelis, right?
As shitty as it is, this shit can happen accidentally.
what would they gain out of knowingly shooting down a civilian airline? Let alone a malaysian one with a majority of dutch passengers. What would the Americans or Israelis in the above articles get out of those incidents?
Its not acceptable of course, but mistakes happen no matter how shit they are.
Honestly as much as I don't like the rebels I'm going to have to sympathize with their point of view. Yeah it's a dumb one built out of paranoia of the West but they do have valid reasons for being strict on anything coming from that direction, documents or not.
That convoy should have had the proper documentation either way, and somebody is getting a reprimand. That's why aid sometimes takes so long, because the ICRC does make sure that they have permission to go into an area and they do not deviate from that so somebody fucked up here.
[QUOTE=Araknid;48267907][url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655[/url]
trigger happy Americans, right?
[url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_Arab_Airlines_Flight_114[/url]
trigger happy israelis, right?
As shitty as it is, this shit can happen accidentally.
what would they gain out of knowingly shooting down a civilian airline? Let alone a malaysian one with a majority of dutch passengers. What would the Americans or Israelis in the above articles get out of those incidents?
Its not acceptable of course, but mistakes happen no matter how shit they are.[/QUOTE]
I find it really surprising yet ironically funny that Australian FPers suddenly have a strong second opinion compared to UK/US FPers.
[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;48269439]I find it really surprising yet ironically funny that Australian FPers suddenly have a strong second opinion compared to UK/US FPers.[/QUOTE]
Maybe it's because I just got bonked in the head pretty hard by a flying chunk of wood but I'm not really understanding this sentence at all. Could you please explain?
[QUOTE=Araknid;48267907][url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655[/url]
trigger happy Americans, right?
[url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_Arab_Airlines_Flight_114[/url]
trigger happy israelis, right?[/QUOTE]
The handling and details are important as well. The crew thoughts it was a military plane and attempted to contact it but it did not respond to warnings, we later paid compensation for the incident. The Separatists did not try to identify the craft, and looted the crash site, the black box is missing, and they deny they did anything wrong.
[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;48260148]Red cross is trying to smuggle NATO troops into the zone in them.[/QUOTE]
You jest, but it has happened before that special forces from various nations have used red cross, UN inspection teams and even disguising themselves as journalists to get into enemy held territory.
So that is an actual possibility as far fetched as it sounds. Id wait till there is more information before everyone works themselves up into a tizzy.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.