• Turkey's PM calls Zionism a crime against humanity, gets bashed by US and UN
    65 replies, posted
[IMG]http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/66143000/jpg/_66143534_66143529.jpg[/IMG] [quote]Turkey's Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has been heavily criticised by the US, Israel and the UN for branding Zionism a "crime against humanity".He told a UN forum this week: [B]"As with Zionism, anti-Semitism and fascism, it is inevitable that Islamophobia be considered a crime against humanity."[/B] Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu strongly condemned his comments.[/quote] [URL]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-21628757[/URL]
Hey, I've got an idea. Let's not condemn people merely for holding beliefs, stupid though they may be.
[QUOTE=That Poster;39759986]Hey, I've got an idea. Let's not condemn people merely for holding beliefs, stupid though they may be.[/QUOTE] We don't unless they try to impose something on other people. Which is what [I]all[/I] of those do.
[QUOTE=Stopper;39759994]We don't unless they try to impose something on other people. Which is what [I]all[/I] of those do.[/QUOTE] It works both ways. Those beliefs may be idiotic, but calling them 'crimes against humanity' is just as stupid.
[QUOTE=That Poster;39760024]It works both ways. Those beliefs may be idiotic, but calling them 'crimes against humanity' is just as stupid.[/QUOTE] Uh, no it's not. That's exactly what they are.
[QUOTE=Stopper;39759994]We don't unless they try to impose something on other people.[B] Which is what [I]all[/I] of those do.[/B][/QUOTE] Wait wait, 'splain that please. And this [QUOTE=Stopper;39760049]Uh, no it's not. That's exactly what they are.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=That Poster;39760024]It works both ways. Those beliefs may be idiotic, but calling them 'crimes against humanity' is just as stupid.[/QUOTE] No, you fail to comprehend those systems, those aren't beliefs they are aggressive anti something, zionism aggressively pushes people off land around Israel thanks to some peoples beliefs that it is what god desires for Israelis.
[QUOTE=Pierrewithahat;39760093]No, you fail to comprehend those systems, those aren't beliefs they are aggressive anti something, zionism aggressively pushes people off land around Israel thanks to some peoples beliefs that it is what god desires for Israelis.[/QUOTE] -googles- Oh shit, you're quite right. Yeah thats kinda fucked up, I can see how that'd be considered a crime. Crime against all of humanity though? Hmmmmmmmyeah I guess I can see that too.
[QUOTE=That Poster;39759986]Hey, I've got an idea. Let's not condemn people merely for holding beliefs, stupid though they may be.[/QUOTE] YES. YEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS. Zionism is not your enemy.
[QUOTE=S31-Syntax;39760065]Wait wait, 'splain that please. And this[/QUOTE] Zionism is, as Pierre said aggressive defense of the "Holy Land". Anti-Semitism is the exact opposite. Fascism... Should I even begin? Islamophobia, as the name implies is a hatred of all Islamic people. All of those beliefs hold that someone is less of a human just because he's a jew or not a jew or a muslim or whatever. They're aggressive and should not be tolerated. And I see you came to the conclusion on why they're crimes against humanity by yourself, so there's no need to clarify that...
[QUOTE=Stopper;39760273]Zionism is, as Pierre said aggressive defense of the "Holy Land". Anti-Semitism is the exact opposite. Fascism... Should I even begin? Islamophobia, as the name implies is a hatred of all Islamic people. All of those beliefs hold that someone is less of a human just because he's a jew or not a jew or a muslim or whatever. They're aggressive and should not be tolerated. And I see you came to the conclusion on why they're crimes against humanity by yourself, so there's no need to clarify that...[/QUOTE] Your clarification was still welcome, in my lack of understanding I had thought it to be a blanket religious statement. I understand now though, thank you.
But Zionism is a horrible ideology.
I do agree on the Zionism is a crime against humanity part.
[url]http://lesswrong.com/lw/ls/when_none_dare_urge_restraint/[/url] relevant
[QUOTE=Stopper;39760273]Zionism is, as Pierre said aggressive defense of the "Holy Land". Anti-Semitism is the exact opposite.[/QUOTE] from the article: Zionism is an ideology or movement that asserts that the Jewish people have a right to a national home or state in what was the Biblical "Land of Israel". It's like if I, tomorrow morning, wake up and say, I'm italian, thus I have a right on every european territory because it was Roman. Pack your stuff and get out of your homes, they belong to me. What? You've been here for 2000 years? Why would I care! My book here, [i]Commentariio de Bello Gallico - Julius Caesar[/i] says otherwise.
[QUOTE=lapsus_;39760491]from the article: Zionism is an ideology or movement that asserts that the Jewish people have a right to a national home or state in what was the Biblical "Land of Israel". It's like if I, tomorrow morning, wake up and say, I'm italian, thus I have a right on every european territory because it was Roman. Pack your stuff and get out of your homes, they belong to me. What? You've been here for 2000 years? Why would I care! My book here, [i]Commentariio de Bello Gallico - Julius Caesar[/i] says otherwise.[/QUOTE] Pretty much this.
[QUOTE=lapsus_;39760491]from the article: Zionism is an ideology or movement that asserts that the Jewish people have a right to a national home or state in what was the Biblical "Land of Israel". It's like if I, tomorrow morning, wake up and say, I'm italian, thus I have a right on every european territory because it was Roman. Pack your stuff and get out of your homes, they belong to me. What? You've been here for 2000 years? Why would I care! My book here, [i]Commentariio de Bello Gallico - Julius Caesar[/i] says otherwise.[/QUOTE] this was part of mussolini's italian lebensraum idea actually although i dunno exactly how ambitious he was, he did have designs on spain
[QUOTE=Marbalo;39760681]nobody was 'first' in israel. there were both jews and palestinians living in the area for centuries before the british came and took a massive shit on everything which sparked the conflict we have today. and, again, look at it from a different perspective. how come you are not seeing the US as a murderous vile nation when they founded their state upon the graves of the natives? is it because they don't keep most of them alive in a cornered land today? well that's because there weren't any left to corner off in the first place. why is americanism not a crime against humanity? or nationalism in general for that matter? [sub]yes, i am aware this is a Tu quoque fallacy so don't take it as an actual counter-argument but rather a proposition for a new perspective[/sub] also as a side note: zionism has lost its meaning ages ago. few people think god gave them this land therefore fuck everyone else, it's more about "i was born here, might as well make myself comfortable". it's cute how people think israel is filled with fanatical text-book zionists.[/QUOTE] I do see the US as a murderous vile nation, but so is literally every other nation in the world.
[QUOTE=Marbalo;39760681]nobody was 'first' in israel. there were both jews and palestinians living in the area for centuries before the british came and took a massive shit on everything which sparked the conflict we have today.[/QUOTE] if britain had held on to palestine there wouldn't be this fucking catastrophe (yes i'm aware that it was just a temporary mandate)
I think the turkish PM is right. Its beyond that even
Solution: Isolate Israel completely from the world and keep it like that for a decade or two. Quit the isolation and see what happens.
Zionism is a bad thing.
I agree with the Turkish PM, however, we would love for him to make some examples, why not start by ending the illegal occupation of EU soil. Thank you.
[QUOTE=Stopper;39759994]We don't unless they try to impose something on other people. Which is what [I]all[/I] of those do.[/QUOTE] Some groups do so very violently, it is pretty shitty. Its hard to be sensitive to their beliefs when you run in to so many of their believers doing crazy shit. Like doing "Muslim/Islam patrol" were they harass people who don't even believe in Islam. Then you get the preachers that dance around the issue making it look like the condone the people but are actually saying it is ok. I always believed religion should be a relationship between you and god. Using teachings to provide some level of guidance and comfort to help yourself or better yourself, not a relationship to a building/house were you're blindly guided by someone who things they got the whole thing down.
[QUOTE=redhaven;39761352]I agree with the Turkish PM, however, we would love for him to make some examples, why not start by ending the illegal occupation of EU soil. Thank you.[/QUOTE] Wouldn't that be a racist decision?
[QUOTE=laserguided;39761564]Wouldn't that be a racist decision?[/QUOTE] How so?
[QUOTE=redhaven;39761580]How so?[/QUOTE] You're suggesting that they ban turks from immigrating to the EU.
[QUOTE=laserguided;39761584]You're suggesting that they ban turks from immigrating to the EU.[/QUOTE] I think he's suggesting that Turkey end their military occupation of Northern Cyprus
[QUOTE=smurfy;39761591]I think he's suggesting that Turkey end their military occupation of Northern Cyprus[/QUOTE] Oh then nevermind, its not the first time I've heard somebody say that and they mean't the what I said.
Calling it "EU soil" was kind of confusing though
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