Alright this may not be the proper time/place for a rant, but I feel like it needs to be said.
It seems like there is a lack of quality control in Creationism Corner.
I've seen so many brush-rape images made in photoshop by people claiming it is 'graphic design' or 'my best original work of art ever', it hurts.
Seriously, I can do brush rape too. Not very well, as I actually learned a bit about colour theory and I hate making 'bad' artwork, but there is an example i made in about half a minute below.
[media]http://i429.photobucket.com/albums/qq13/Element_Spirits/BrushRape.png[/media]
Now I'm not trying to be overly harsh or anything. Maybe to the artist, it actually is their best work of art. Sad, but maybe it is true.
I'm not suggesting we make it so that each piece of art work posted here has to undergo mod review or anything. I just feel like the people who make an [I]entire thread[/I] for one brush raped picture, shouldn't.
Some basic suggestions I have (I am welcome to more):
- Start being more specific in what classifies as '30-second shit'. I think in the rules list there should be examples of brush rape and good art work.
- People who [I]do[/I] post brush rape [I]as a new thread[/I] should be banned for an hour, as a warning. I don't want them to be permabanned, just enough so that they know better. Maybe a PM sent by a mod would be nice, so they know their exact mistake.
- Before posting a thread, make a pop up warning them of these consequences, and linking them to the rules so that they can read them if they didn't before hand.
- STICKY THE 'Creative Work That Doesn't Deserve a Thread' THREAD. I know sometimes it is hard to get good feedback in there, but they can at least get [I]something[/I] telling them where they went wrong.
I'm going to do my part. I'm working on a thread for people new to Photoshop, providing links to tutorials and resources and examples of art, just like I did with Fractals.
I'm open to any suggestions about new rules that can be implemented, and I really hope the mods read this. If you have tried this before/can't do it for some reason, it'd be nice to know.
I just had to talk about this. I'll admit, I used to brush rape. But I saw that people hated it, so instead i started teaching myself how to use photoshop. I just want others to not go the same direction.
Once again, sorry about the rant.
[B]SUGGESTED RATINGS GUIDE:[/B]
Agree - 'I hate brush rape too!'
Disagree- 'I am fine with the brush rape here'
Useful/Tool- 'Make that thread about the photoshop guide!'
Boxes- 'You should not have ranted about this'
The way I see it, the best work and most thread deserving are in the Creative Work/Photography that doesn't deserve a thread threads. It's mostly the newer folks around here that haven't been around CC much that post threads. In the end most people end up going to those threads (after people direct them there), or they just leave forever. I'm not entirely sure what the solution would be. I suppose your suggestions are good ones, but at the same time I am conflicted. On one hand, this is a forum and people are just posting their works (however bad) in threads. On the other hand, large amounts of crap threads overshadow the actual good deserving threads.
I disagree with stickying the creative works threads since stickies clog up the forum view. The best "solution" would probably be stricter rules, but I'm not sure at which point that just becomes detrimental to the community. If new policies end up discouraging people from even trying to display their work (once again, however bad it may be) they will never have the chance to evolve.
You got to remember that 90% of everything is crap.
That's just how it is. But yeah I agree that more people should post their sketches in the thread for creative art that doesn't deserve it's own thread. But again, I don't think brush rape deserves even that.
Put things into context - ultimately this is a forum for a HL2 mod.
That said, we have developed a good, standalone community around art, but if we start holding people to higher standards we'll be even further closed off. I think we need a policy of direction/guidance/encouragement, but with a strict hand. 'Tough love' if you will. We don't appreciate crap, but we'll work to fix it rather than flat out reject it.
I think all social groups experience this kind of thing. Instead of blindly telling people to :frog:, we should help them and point out what they did wrong. Do we want to be popular kids rejecting a new kid, or do we want to be the person that helps him pick up his stuff when it gets knocked out of his hands? [i]Do we want to be the sub-forum that people are too intimidated to post in?[/i]
[im tired so this is kind of a ramble]
[QUOTE=bopie;27306738]Put things into context - ultimately this is a forum for a HL2 mod.
That said, we have developed a good, standalone community around art, but if we start holding people to higher standards we'll be even further closed off. I think we need a policy of direction/guidance/encouragement, but with a strict hand. 'Tough love' if you will. We don't appreciate crap, but we'll work to fix it rather than flat out reject it.
I think all social groups experience this kind of thing. Instead of blindly telling people to :frog:, we should help them and point out what they did wrong. Do we want to be popular kids rejecting a new kid, or do we want to be the person that helps him pick up his stuff when it gets knocked out of his hands? [i]Do we want to be the sub-forum that people are too intimidated to post in?[/i][/QUOTE]
I'm not trying to tell people to get out. But we [I]do[/I] need strict rules. I don't want us to become closed, but I think standards need to be raised so that people try and achieve them. If we let all these people post bad art and get yelled at for it, isn't that also closing them off? Pick your poison.
People got to start somewhere, and to be honest not all of these people want art as a career choice.
This is not a professional forum, and even then this is just a small section of said forum. This area has no reputation it needs to uphold because it does not need one simply because it is an over blown show and tell.
We dont need quality control for something that was not designed for quality in the first place.
[QUOTE=Elements;27306808]I'm not trying to tell people to get out. But we [I]do[/I] need strict rules. I don't want us to become closed, but I think standards need to be raised so that people try and achieve them. If we let all these people post bad art and get yelled at for it, isn't that also closing them off? Pick your poison.[/QUOTE]
It is, but less so. Telling someone their art is shit gives them reason to improve. If someone told me my stuff was shit, I'd want to improve it. Obviously that sentiment isn't representative of the entire human race, but many people will turn to face the challenge. In the end there is no way to please everyone. If we end up just pussyfooting around criticism, people don't get better, but if we are harsh to others there is the risk of alienating them. Once again, I think some new rules might improve the situation, but I'm not sure what those would be.
For me personally, even the slightest approval from others was more than enough incentive to keep myself to a high standard, because I was so impressed by the art that was already here. I became addicted to the growth that this kind of environment encourages. I was trying to fit in with what I saw as gods, and that was a huge motivator. Kind of a capitalism-type competition. I think directly raising standards will put people off. Why tell someone their wrong when you can show them? The creationism corner works the way it is, there's no need to fix it. Sure it has it's problems that flare up from the randoms that come in with their 2 second shit, but is it [i]really[/i] that big of an inconvenience?
[QUOTE=Edthefirst;27306966]It is, but less so. Telling someone their art is shit gives them reason to improve. If someone told me my stuff was shit, I'd want to improve it. Obviously that sentiment isn't representative of the entire human race, but many people will turn to face the challenge. In the end there is no way to please everyone. If we end up just pussyfooting around criticism, people don't get better, but if we are harsh to others there is the risk of alienating them. Once again, I think some new rules might improve the situation, but I'm not sure what those would be.[/QUOTE]
Everything needs to be in balance. Equal parts of people being nice and some people who be hatin. IT works out best this way.
Quality control nazism is not needed it would be discouraging for new potential.
I like newcomers, nothing makes my day warmer than seeing a newcomer who has learned something and is improving.
Even if there is a thread with brush rape, how hard is it to ignore it and move on? Or is is that you get mad or something?
"OH MY GOD HE IS POSTING SHITTY ART, THIS IS MAKING ME SO MAD"
It's little something called fun.
Tough love. I never got it, but then again, I have only posted two of my drawings in here...
I personally think this sounds stupid and quite elitist.
It's just better to tell them that work like that should be posted in Creative Work That Doesn't Deserve a Thread (or not at all).
People should be fully allowed to post shit they deem thread worthy, otherwise we're just taking one step closer to closing this place into a circlejerk where only a select bunch of people should be allowed to post without getting kicked in the balls by all the elitist pricks.
New people are new people, almost anyone that are new, almost regardless of age act stupid in the start because they simply don't know better, that doesn't make them stupid. And where are you supposed to start? And who is to say that this and this is okay and this and this is not? Of course there are certain standards to follow that kinda works like a rule, but when you're new how are you supposed to know? And making a sticky to teach them that would be stupid as well and they would still continue.
No need to change how this section works as it is now if you ask me.
[QUOTE=dgg;27312615]I personally think this sounds stupid and quite elitist.
It's just better to tell them that work like that should be posted in Creative Work That Doesn't Deserve a Thread (or not at all).
People should be fully allowed to post shit they deem thread worthy, otherwise we're just taking one step closer to closing this place into a circlejerk where only a select bunch of people should be allowed to post without getting kicked in the balls by all the elitist pricks.
New people are new people, almost anyone that are new, almost regardless of age act stupid in the start because they simply don't know better, that doesn't make them stupid. And where are you supposed to start? And who is to say that this and this is okay and this and this is not? Of course there are certain standards to follow that kinda works like a rule, but when you're new how are you supposed to know? And making a sticky to teach them that would be stupid as well and they would still continue.
No need to change how this section works as it is now if you ask me.[/QUOTE]
I couldn't agree more with you. You worded this excellently.
[QUOTE=dgg;27312615]
New people are new people, almost anyone that are new, almost regardless of age act stupid in the start because they simply don't know better, that doesn't make them stupid. And where are you supposed to start? And who is to say that this and this is okay and this and this is not? Of course there are certain standards to follow that kinda works like a rule, [b]but when you're new how are you supposed to know?[/b] And making a sticky to teach them that would be stupid as well and they would still continue.
[/QUOTE]
Hmmm that's true. I sometimes forget what it is like to be new. I just want people to be able to understand the standards enough to figure out whether or not to post, but I guess when you are new everything you do seems magical and deserving.
I still stand by my post though, because I still believe there is a way to get the standards set without discouraging anybody.
Thanks for making me think about it from a different perspective though
[QUOTE=Edthefirst;27306300]The way I see it, the best work and most thread deserving are in the Creative Work/Photography that doesn't deserve a thread threads. It's mostly the newer folks around here that haven't been around CC much that post threads.[/QUOTE]
It's the ego in me speaking and abusing from what people have written about me here, but it's because we get higher quality... treshold or something, for me instance, I don't make a thread about anything that dind't take me atleast 2 days to make or isn't a full painting/drawing. I haven't really done anything big for a year now.
Anyway it doens't matter no one ever looks at my threads anyway, so CWTDDAT makes me feel popular and such :unsmith:
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