Israeli IDF official claims, without proof, that Assad is using chemical weapons; Russia warns world
23 replies, posted
[quote](CNN) -- Are Syrian forces using chemical weapons in their years-long fight to hold on to power?
That's what the head of the Israel Defense Forces intelligence research and analysis division said Tuesday, becoming the latest to allege that Damascus was employing weapons banned under international law against its own people.
The claim further stoked the debate about the international community's role in Syria, where the United Nations estimated this month that 70,000 people have been killed since the conflict flared in March 2011. U.S. President Barack Obama, for one, has said the Syrian government's use of chemical weapons against its own people would be a "game changer" in how his and other nations address the crisis.
On Tuesday, his nation's top diplomat said Tuesday that the United States does not know definitively that such chemical weapons had been deployed. In fact, U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry said, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu also did not confirm the use of such weapons when the two spoke by phone earlier in the day.
"The information that I have at this point does not confirm it to me (in a manner) that I would feel comfortable commenting on it as a fact," Kerry said.
[B]Israeli Brig. Gen. Itai Brun, though not offering any direct evidence, stated firmly on Tuesday the belief that Syrian forces have increasingly used "ground-to-ground missiles, rockets and chemical weapons."
He specified that sarin gas -- an odorless nerve agent that can quickly kill thousands by causing convulsions, paralysis and respiratory failure -- was most likely used, as were "neutralizing and nonlethal chemical weapons." Brun pointed to one episode on March 19 in which, he said, "victims suffered from shrunken pupils, foaming from the mouth and other symptoms which indicate the use of deadly chemical weapons."[/B]
"According to our professional assessment, the regime has used deadly chemical weapons against armed rebels on a number of occasions in the past few months," said Brun, according to quotes provided by the IDF.
Before the Israeli official's announcement Tuesday, a United Nations-led investigation was already looking into accusations of chemical weapons use by the Syrian government.
[B]Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov warned Tuesday against jumping to conclusions by repeating the "Iraqi scenario" in which claims that Saddam Hussein's government possessed so-called weapons of mass destruction were the basis of the U.S.-led invasion.[/B]
Lavrov accused other nations of "politicizing the issue." Further, he criticized how international investigators looking into an alleged use of chemical investigators in Aleppo had demanded access to to all facilities in Syria and to have the right to interview any Syrian.[/quote]
[url]http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/23/world/meast/syria-civil-war/index.html?hpt=wo_c2[/url]
[B]tl;dr:[/B]
-Israeli general says Assad regime is using sarin gas
-Israeli government does not confirm or deny the claim; hasn't made it an official "statement" of the government
-Use of chemical weapons crosses the "red line" Obama has outlined in Syria
-Russian official warns not to jump the gun on baseless accusations
-NPR earlier today theorized this is an attempt by Israel to get the US to participate more in Syria
Watch Israel start a fucking war
No evidence is credible evidence.
[QUOTE=sYnced;40395829]No evidence is credible evidence.[/QUOTE]
Maybe Israel is being run by CNN
i wouldnt doubt that assad would us it in small bits. but i wont believe it until there is video/chemical analysis confirmation.
Israel's trying to make shit up to see if they'll be given an excuse to hit Syria, their old enemies.
didn't the rebels claim that Assads been using chemical weapons for some time?
but then all of a sudden Israel mentions it, everybody jumps the gun, waves their arms and says, "ITS AN EXCUSE!!!"
Maybe Isreal is using detectives from Reddit to figure out if Syria is using chemical weapons or not.
[QUOTE=Laferio;40396810]didn't the rebels claim that Assads been using chemical weapons for some time?
but then all of a sudden Israel mentions it, everybody jumps the gun, waves their arms and says, "ITS AN EXCUSE!!!"[/QUOTE]
The trouble is that there's still been no proof - Which is weird, considering how easily proof in photos or even samples could be obtained and taken past Syria's borders.
For once I find myself agreeing with the Russian government.
The irony isn't lost on me
Right now, there's a UN investigation going on to determine if they've been used or not. Hopefully the conclude it soon and tell the world what happened.
Keep in mind that, while this IDF official has made this public claim, [I]the government of Israel has not;[/i] so if the UN report says nothing was used, Israel did not technically or officially "lie" to get to the US to invade or whatever.
[QUOTE=Laferio;40396810]didn't the rebels claim that Assads been using chemical weapons for some time?
but then all of a sudden Israel mentions it, everybody jumps the gun, waves their arms and says, "ITS AN EXCUSE!!!"[/QUOTE]
And it's not even an official statement of trying to start shit, just pointing to a few incidents that look like chemical weapons attacks and pointing out that Assad has even admitted to having chemical weapons.
It really boggles the mind how people can support helping out Syria, but whenever Israel gets involved in the slightest way it's supposedly just them being evil.
[QUOTE=archangel125;40396838]The trouble is that there's still been no proof - Which is weird, considering how easily proof in photos or even samples could be obtained and taken past Syria's borders.[/QUOTE]
One official making a claim that's not even a proper statement of the government isn't their casus belli and releasing that kind of info on unofficial channels would be strange anyway. This isn't their big plot to start a war, it's one statement and acting like they're already mobilising troops is idiocy.
Bullshit. This oppressive nation cannot be trusted with such explosive claims.
[editline]24th April 2013[/editline]
Why should I take Israel's claims as fact when the United States remains unconvinced?
It's weird seeing russia be the one who tells everyone to calm their tits for once.
[QUOTE=Laferio;40396810]didn't the rebels claim that Assads been using chemical weapons for some time?
but then all of a sudden Israel mentions it, everybody jumps the gun, waves their arms and says, "ITS AN EXCUSE!!!"[/QUOTE]
They've been saying that, and the government has been saying the Rebels have been using them as well. (Which, considering some of the Rebel groups, I could see it being possible.) We, and I say we as most of the western nations, don't exactly know, and no one has any solid proof, and keeps going off of hearsay.
It's clearly in Russia's interest to keep Assad in power.
[QUOTE=Truckasaurus1;40397478]It's clearly in Russia's interest to keep Assad in power.[/QUOTE]
Well obviously when the rebels aren't really that noble either
[QUOTE=smeismastger;40397682]Well obviously when the rebels aren't really that noble either[/QUOTE]
I agree. But if either side wins the outcomes are bad, maybe this constant stalemate will eventually push them into some sort of solution.
[QUOTE=smeismastger;40397682]Well obviously when the rebels aren't really that noble either[/QUOTE]
Rebels aren't knights in shining armour, no, but Russia really, really, [I]really[/I] wants Assad to stay in power, because he's an important ally to Russia; and Syria hosts the only Russian naval base in the Mediterranean sea.
[editline]24th April 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Radley;40397408]It's weird seeing russia be the one who tells everyone to calm their tits for once.[/QUOTE]
Russia's been quite into tit-calming for a while, now. They did it with Korea and pretty much every Arab Spring revolution, too.
[QUOTE=Riller;40398853]Russia's been quite into tit-calming for a while, now. They did it with Korea and pretty much every Arab Spring revolution, too.[/QUOTE]Mainly because Russia had business interests with some of the former regimes. (The Korean situation is something nobody wants to touch with a barge pole, really) If Saudi Arabia was going through what Libya did and Syria is now, it'd be the US telling everyone not to jump the gun.
Are we finally to the point that enough people have figured out the Iraq war was a scam to make "Iraq Scenario" a thing?
This entire thing has been overblown by the media, the general was giving his personal opinion, not an official statement, there is no evidence to back up his "accusation".
[QUOTE] Steven Simon, a former senior director of the National Security Council who specialized in Middle East and North African affairs, told Situation Report he thinks Brun's comments may not be as significant as they had been cast by yesterday's reports. The fact of the matter, he said, is that there is no incontrovertible evidence that the Syrians have used chemical weapons on any large scale.
"There isn't dispositive evidence of the use of chemical weapons by the Syrian regime," said Simon, who left the White House at the end of last year. Simon said he knows Brun and views him as "smart and disciplined." But, he said, "my interpretation is that I don¹t think he quite understood the implications of his statement. I think he thought he was being asked for his opinion, I don't think he was envisaging headlines." [/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Disotrtion;40400872]This entire thing has been overblown by the media, [B]the general was giving his personal opinion, not an official statement[/B], there is no evidence to back up his "accusation".[/QUOTE]
I said that in the tl;dr part of the OP, but I think only you really paid attention to that.
Wasn't it known that Britam was using counter intel such as this gas incident and work for US higher ups towards Syria
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