From Russia with Love: Former Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili gets a strong feeling of déjà v
14 replies, posted
[quote][B]Antonio Mora:[/B] I’m joined from Kiev via Skype by Mikheil Saakashvili, who served two terms as President of Georgia between 2004 and 2013.
I want to start with asking you: Russia went to war with your country when you were President in 2008 over two breakaway regions, Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Do you think that pattern is repeating itself again, that this time it’s over Crimea, possibly East Ukraine? And do you think Putin was in some way emboldened by what happened in Georgia six years ago?
[B]Mikheil Saakashvili: [/B]Well, first of all, for me it’s a totally feeling of déjà vu because exactly this same thing happened eight years ago — sorry, [in] 2008 — when what happened really was that there was preparation for this whole thing. [At that time], Russia was acting through, first with proxies — there were arming them, they were doing our provocations. Then, later, they came in with the pretext of safeguarding their minorities, which is to say, both in Russia and Ukraine — in Georgia and Ukraine — they are distributing Russian passports to these people so that they could claim that they have title to Russian citizens that were under threat there. In both cases, they had mass-scale military trainings and in both cases they conducted war propaganda.
Although, I have to mention that in both cases they didn’t go only after regions, I think the goal in Georgia was to depose my government, [cause instability, for their position in the region] and I think it’s exactly the same goal in Ukraine. Putin doesn’t really want Crimea or the Eastern regions. He wants to take over or at least generate permanent chaos in Ukraine under the government in Kiev and these are openly proclaimed goals. It’s not just my guess, the Russian government is openly saying that they are there to restore the Yanukovich government to power, which is not a realistic goal, [Skype feed becomes garbled] but in [?] and in [?], deposing existing Ukrainian government in Kiev.
[B]Mora:[/B] You’ve said that, that you think that what he wants is chaos, that he wants to balkanize Ukraine, that he wants to separate it all and the chaos will serve his goals.
[B]Saakashvili: [/B]Yeah, absolutely, except that I think this time he totally overplayed his hand because [Ukraine is] a much bigger country, 10 times bigger entire population-wise than Georgia, and he, I think that he’s emboldened by the fact that there was not much of a punishment that followed his invasion of Georgia or, even more, I mean, there was some Western interests and some Western experts — some, I would say, “useful idiots” to use Lenin’s words, when he called people who they could use inadvertently to their own goals to Communists — but it’s the same concept for Putin’s Russia. That would say, well, ok, Russia was not clean in that, Russia really acted badly, but Georgia was also to be blamed. ... Nobody can whitewash Russia, what Russia wants [is that the victim] also shares the blame.
So, actually, they are trying the same in Ukraine, there are all the people saying, well, maybe they have valid concerns, they’re quoting all kinds of different examples why they should be concerned, the Russians. Some people are starting to say, well, let’s de-escalate the conflict.
Well, it’s not about the escalation now. They occupy big chunk of a sovereign territory of an independent European country. They have it. They occupy it. It’s not about the escalation, escalation’s already there. What they need to do is de-occupy. This is a very important crisis, the gravest crisis in European history, maybe, after Second World War, and actually the further it gets, the longer it lasts, the bigger it will get. And this time, the Western powers will not be able — or some Western politicians will not be able, even if some of them would attempt so — to strike it away. It’s going. It’s right there at their doorsteps. It’s banging loud at their doors and even if they make music louder at home, they still cannot ignore it. It’s going to get into their existence. They have to deal with it, tackle it.[/quote]
[editline]4th March 2014[/editline]
[url]http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/consider-this/Consider-This-blog/2014/3/3/mikheil-saakashviliinterview.html[/url]
[QUOTE]This is a very important crisis, the gravest crisis in European history, maybe, after Second World War, and actually the further it gets, the longer it lasts, the bigger it will get. And this time, the Western powers will not be able — or some Western politicians will not be able, even if some of them would attempt so — to strike it away. It’s going. It’s right there at their doorsteps. It’s banging loud at their doors and even if they make music louder at home, they still cannot ignore it. It’s going to get into their existence. They have to deal with it, tackle it.[/QUOTE]
That was pretty scary to read.. this man certainly has a way with words.
The difference of course is that Georgia started their conflict with Russia, while the Russians are the ones starting this one.
[QUOTE=TheDecryptor;44121203]The difference of course is that Georgia started their conflict with Russia, while the Russians are the ones starting this one.[/QUOTE]
as a citizen of Georgia...yes
[QUOTE=Bradyns;44121174]That was pretty scary to read.. this man certainly has a way with words.[/QUOTE]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZ02MlVRcMA[/media]
[QUOTE=TheDecryptor;44121203]The difference of course is that Georgia started their conflict with Russia, while the Russians are the ones starting this one.[/QUOTE]
Haha, no, we did not start the war, it is a well known stereotype Russians use as a save. Anyways, my country has no future because it is filled with fanatical religious imbeciles.
[QUOTE=Sourceshift;44124855]Haha, no, we did not start the war, it is a well known stereotype Russians use as a save[/QUOTE]
What was the biggest reason it happened again?
[QUOTE=Bradyns;44121174]That was pretty scary to read.. this man certainly has a way with words.[/QUOTE]
That's just so fucking apt, it's unreal.
Maybe I'm wrong, but wasn't one of the main reasons the Georgian/Russian war started was because Georgia bombed south Ossetia and ended up killing Russian peacekeepers? Quite a distinct difference really.
[QUOTE=Bad)-(and;44125223]Maybe I'm wrong, but wasn't one of the main reasons the Georgian/Russian war started was because Georgia bombed south Ossetia and ended up killing Russian peacekeepers? Quite a distinct difference really.[/QUOTE]
Georgians claim that was a false flag op I think.
[QUOTE=Bad)-(and;44125223]Maybe I'm wrong, but wasn't one of the main reasons the Georgian/Russian war started was because Georgia bombed south Ossetia and ended up killing Russian peacekeepers? Quite a distinct difference really.[/QUOTE]
Georgia claims that South Ossetia/Abkhazia are part of their territory and that they were illegally annexed by Russia and then they set up puppet governments in
[QUOTE=Kite_shugo;44124909]What was the biggest reason it happened again?[/QUOTE]
Georgia invaded South Ossetia. There was a premeditated troop build up for months beforehand.
[QUOTE=Explosions;44125289]Georgia invaded South Ossetia. There was a premeditated troop build up for months beforehand.[/QUOTE]
Not really, Russians were the ones bombing South Osetia, they blamed the shit on us to use that as a reason for starting the conflict
[QUOTE=Sourceshift;44125323]Not really, Russians were the ones bombing South Osetia, they blamed the shit on us to use that as a reason for starting the conflict[/QUOTE]
Georgia and the Ossetians shelled each other back and forth for weeks before the Georgian invasion.
[QUOTE=Sourceshift;44125323]Not really, Russians were the ones bombing South Osetia, they blamed the shit on us to use that as a reason for starting the conflict[/QUOTE]
Oh the Russians also started using BM-21 Grad on Tskhinvali then?
How about official EU report confirmed Georgia starting the war?
[url]http://euobserver.com/foreign/28747[/url]
[url]http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2009/10/geor-o02.html[/url]
[url]http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/new-report-on-russia-georgia-war-eu-investigators-debunk-saakashvili-s-lies-a-652512.html[/url]
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