George Zimmerman, Killer of Trayvon Martin Probably Won't be Charged
118 replies, posted
Source: [url]http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/20/opinion/toobin-trayvon-martin/index.html?hpt=hp_c1[/url]
[quote]
Trayvon Martin went out to buy some Skittles -- and was shot dead before he made it home. The case is horrifying, maddening, grotesque. And -- perhaps worst of all -- there may be nothing Florida law enforcement can do about it.
As the world now knows, the 17-year-old Martin walked to a store in Orlando to buy some snacks on the night of February 26. George Zimmerman, a volunteer Neighborhood Watch captain, thought the boy looked suspicious and called 911. The 911 operator told Zimmerman to keep his distance -- police would be sent -- but there was a confrontation between Zimmerman and Martin. Martin was killed with a single shot to the chest. Florida authorities have not arrested Zimmerman, and federal authorities recently joined the investigation.
The legal question at the heart of the case involves Florida's so-called "stand your ground" law, which the legislature passed, at the behest of the National Rifle Association, in 2005. Before that time, Florida law resembled that of most other states; during confrontations, individuals had a duty to retreat rather than to respond to provocations. Under the new law, a person is allowed to use deadly force if he is in a place he has a right to be and feels reasonably threatened with serious harm.
In this case, then, the question is whether Zimmerman was in such a place and felt reasonably threatened. The 911 operator told Zimmerman to keep his distance from Martin, but Zimmerman had a right to be on the street. That's where neighborhood watch volunteers work.
Clearly, the question at the heart of the case is whether Zimmerman reasonably felt threatened. On this issue, the evidence currently seems murky. There appears to have been some sort of confrontation between Zimmerman and Martin. Police found Zimmerman with an injury to his head. Most important -- and most tragic -- the police will hear only one side of the story about this confrontation. Trayvon is not around to tell his story. The continuing investigation will surely focus on finding other witnesses.
The facts of this case show why the "stand your ground" law is so important. The law focuses on the subjective understanding of the shooter. Was his understanding of the situation "reasonable"? Ultimately, that would be a question for the jury to decide, but it still gives a lot of deference to the perpetrator of a violent act. The new law even allows a disproportionate response; if someone comes at you with a fist, you can reply with a gun.
In light of the shift in the law, it's not surprising that since the law went into effect, reports of justifiable homicides have tripled, according to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.
Another case under litigation in Florida highlights the effect of the law. In September 2010, David James was playing basketball with his 8-year-old daughter on an outdoor court in Valrico. A boy was skateboarding on the court at the same time, and Trevor Dooley, a man who lived in the area, told the boy he shouldn't be skateboarding there. James stood up for the boy, and he and Dooley had a confrontation.
Dooley was carrying a gun and wound up shooting James dead. Dooley asserted that he felt threatened by James, and has asked that the case be dismissed before trial under the "stand your ground" law. (The judge will soon make a ruling.)
In both of these cases -- in the deaths of both James and Martin -- the legal defense for the shooters appears to rely almost completely on the "stand your ground" law. In the death of David James, prosecutors are doing their best against tough odds. In the death of Trayvon Martin, it's prosecutors who are taking the heat for failing, thus far, to bring any charges against George Zimmerman.
But this outrage, understandable though it is, might be directed somewhere else as well. The Florida legislators who voted for the "stand your ground" law -- and Gov. Jeb Bush, who signed it -- have something to answer for as well.
[/quote]
So, murder is legal now I guess. Not sure how this guy is getting away with it when he never even saw a gun or knife. If he did, well then we have some shitty reporting on our hands.
Fucking idiots.
"Wow, you look suspicious" *pop*
What is up with people these days.
I smell a riot.
It's fine just shoot him and say you're neighbourhood watch and that you're sure he's on drugs.
I can't help but feel there is bias in this case
Come on the guy went out of his way to follow the kid because he was black.
Fucking bastards. He's nothing but a mentally unstable nutjob who looks out of his front window every 5 minutes to report completely normal activity. What happened here is a result of his paranoid hypervigilant behaviour. There is absolutely no reason not to charge him.
[QUOTE=Vasili;35232537]I can't help but feel there is bias in this case
Come on the guy went out of his way to follow the kid because he was black.[/QUOTE]
My thoughts exactly.
I hope the NRA is fucking proud of themselves now that racist, paranoid assholes can shoot defenseless black 17-year-olds in cold blood and get away with it.
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;35232585]I hope the NRA is fucking proud of themselves now that racist, paranoid assholes can shoot defenseless black 17-year-olds in cold blood and get away with it.[/QUOTE]
This has nothing to do with the NRA.
Go to Florida
Find George Zimmerman outside on a street
Say hi
He says "Hi, who are you" or something like that, if not something more confrontational
Shoot him in the face
Get off scott free because he was threatening you and you have the right to be in Florida
Is this a horrid thing to do? Yes.
But, if you're using Zimmerman's and the courts' logic, is it okay? Yes.
That's how fucking stupid this is.
[QUOTE=Last or First;35232593]Go to Florida
Find George Zimmerman outside on a street
Say hi
He says "Hi, who are you" or something like that, if not something more confrontational
Shoot him in the face
Get off scott free because he was threatening you and you have the right to be in Florida
Is this a horrid thing to do? Yes.
But, if you're using Zimmerman's and the courts' logic, is it okay? Yes.
That's how fucking stupid this is.[/QUOTE]
Go Drive-style on him and kick his face into mush.
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;35232585]I hope the NRA is fucking proud of themselves now that racist, paranoid assholes can shoot defenseless black 17-year-olds in cold blood and get away with it.[/QUOTE]
Because the NRA wrote the constitution and built a giant laser that turns people into idiots right
Why?!?!?!?!
What the fuck!??!??!?!!
You could hear Trayvon scream for help and plead for mercy in the 911 call.
Zimmerman is some sadistic psychopath and the court is letting him go.
What the fuck?
how the fuck is that even legally possible ? If you shoot someone and that it's obviously not legitimate self defense, how can you ever get away scott free ?
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;35232585]I hope the NRA is fucking proud of themselves now that racist, paranoid assholes can shoot defenseless black 17-year-olds in cold blood and get away with it.[/QUOTE]
Good job bringing in the NRA when they had absolutely nothing to do with this.
Now, we kill Zimmerman.
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;35232970]how the fuck is that even legally possible ? If you shoot someone and that it's obviously not legitimate self defense, how can you ever get away scott free ?[/QUOTE]
The "Stand your ground" law allows lethal force to be used if someone feels that they are threatened.
It's bullshit either way, the kid didn't pose any threat to the guy and he was crying and begging for mercy for almost a full minute before he got shot and killed. Last I checked, people who are begging for mercy aren't anywhere near being a threat, the exact opposite is in effect where the person begging is being threatened.
this isn't going to end well
That stand your ground law is absolutely retarded...'Reasonably threatened' is entirely down to a person's perspective.
Its basically saying that if you get into a physical fight with someone its legal for you to kill them because they are posing a threat to you, even if its just a little bit of a scuffle.
Also that Dooley case is another example of a complete joke in terms of the law. Multiple eyewitness accounts from neighbors and even the kid that was skateboarding were consistent in showing that he started the confrontation by cursing at them then walking over the road and pulling a gun out for no reason, then when the other guy tried to defend himself from having a gun pointed at him, he ended up getting shot in the heart with his 8 year old daughter watching. Now hes trying to get off from that by saying it was self defense.
Justice system works yet again.
/sarcasm
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;35232585]I hope the NRA is fucking proud of themselves now that racist, paranoid assholes can shoot defenseless black 17-year-olds in cold blood and get away with it.[/QUOTE]
The NRA refused to change their city in response to the Columbine shooting. They look at cases like this and see it simply as a real American defending his rights, not because of race but because they're all paranoid gun nuts.
[QUOTE=Omali;35233227]The NRA refused to change their city in response to the Columbine shooting. They look at cases like this and see it simply as a real American defending his rights, not because of race but because they're all paranoid gun nuts.[/QUOTE]
NRA are not all paranoid gun nuts. I am a lifetime NRA member, and avid shooter. I attend tons of NRA meetings, gun club events, etc and have never met a "paranoid gun nut." Cut out the leftist propaganda attitude.
This is an opinion piece, not a statement of any actual fact.
Stand your ground laws don't cover things you provoke. Indeed:
[URL="http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57401619-504083/author-of-stand-your-ground-law-george-zimmerman-should-probably-be-arrested-for-killing-trayvon-martin/"](CBS/AP) SANFORD, Fla. - The authors of Florida's controversial "stand your ground" self-defense law say George Zimmerman should probably be arrested for shooting Trayvon Martin, reports the Miami Herald.[/URL]
[QUOTE]"He has no protection under my law," former Sen. Durell Peaden told the newspaper.
Florida's law, called "stand your ground" by supporters and "shoot first" by critics, was passed in 2005 and permits residents to use deadly force if they "reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony."
Traditionally, self-defense laws did not typically extend beyond a person's home, but the Florida law, and at least 20 more passed across the country since them, allows a resident to "meet force with force" almost anywhere, including the street or a bar.
Zimmerman, 28, reportedly admitted to police that he shot 17-year-old Trayvon Martin on the evening of February 26. He was released without being charged after claiming he killed the boy in self-defense. But 911 recordings released over the weekend suggest that Zimmerman, who has a concealed weapons permit and volunteered in an apparently informal neighborhood watch program, pursued Martin, despite being told police were on their way.
It is the fact that Zimmerman ignored the 911 operator's advice not to follow Martin that former Sen. Peaden says disqualifies him from claiming self-defense under the law.
[B]"The guy lost his defense right then," Peaden told the Miami Herald. "When he said 'I'm following him,' he lost his defense."[/B]
[B]Rep. Dennis Baxley, Peaden's co-sponsor in the Florida House, agrees with his former colleague, telling the newspaper that the law does not license neighborhood watch or others who feel "like they have the authority to pursue and confront people. That is aggravating an incident right there."[/B]
Both co-sponsors told the newspaper, however, that they did not think the law needed to be re-examined.
"If you want to pass something, pass something that limits their ability to pursue and confront people," Baxley said. "It's about crime watch," he said. "What are the limitations of crime watch? Are you allowed to jump out and follow people and confront them? What do you think is going to happen? That's where it starts."
But during the town hall meeting in Sanford, Florida Rep. Geraldine Thompson promised the law's repeal would be a top priority for the state legislature's black caucus.
"If vigilante justice becomes the norm, will visitors feel comfortable coming to our state?," she asked.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;35232585]I hope the NRA is fucking proud of themselves now that racist, paranoid assholes can shoot defenseless black 17-year-olds in cold blood and get away with it.[/QUOTE]
Well, other than the fact that the stand your ground laws they lobby for allow people to defend themselves rather than magically be expected to run away when somebody's attempting to rape them, but don't let that get in the way of your agenda!
That is completely terrible to hear... Also, I don't like whoever wrote the story, they were trying to be clever I guess and use, "The heart of the story" knowing the kid got shot in the chest, but what's worse is they used that phrase multiple times. Come up with a new transition, holy crap.
[QUOTE=Squad;35233363]That is completely terrible to hear... Also, I don't like whoever wrote the story, they were trying to be clever I guess and use, "The heart of the story" knowing the kid got shot in the chest, but what's worse is they used that phrase multiple times. Come up with a new transition, holy crap.[/QUOTE]A pun about human death? Whoa what else is old.
[QUOTE=V12US;35232455]I smell a riot.[/QUOTE]
Maybe a riot would force lawmakers and enforcers to use some common sense for once.
Do the same to him. Confront him and kill him when he tries to shoot you.
America.
It would be like the LA riots if he got off scot free and they know it.
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