Palestinians butcher praying Jews with axes in Jerusalem terror attack
32 replies, posted
Or as BBC puts it: "Four killed in Jerusalem synagogue attack".
[URL="http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-30092720"]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-30092720[/URL]
[QUOTE]At least four Israelis have been killed and eight injured in what police say was a "terrorist attack" at a West Jerusalem synagogue.
Two men armed with a pistol, axes and knives carried out the attack in the Har Nof neighbourhood during prayers.
The attackers - Palestinians from East Jerusalem - were shot dead, police say.
Jerusalem has seen tensions between Israelis and Palestinians soar, with a string of deadly attacks and clashes over a disputed holy site.
Israeli media reports suggest there was a shoot-out between the attackers and police who arrived on the scene.
The attacks happened at a religious seminary site on Harav Shimon Agassi Street.[/QUOTE]
[URL="https://twitter.com/LTCPeterLerner/status/534595902673915906"]https://twitter.com/LTCPeterLerner/status/534595902673915906[/URL]
raze gaza
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Shitposting" - Megafan))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=lilgrill;46516715]raze gaza[/QUOTE]
That is barbaric on a completely different level. I honestly don't know if you're being serious.
This whole situation is awful but Netanyahu is completely wrong. A "heavy handed" response is the wrong approach and he knows it.
Things like this are why Palestine still has some ways to go before becoming a state. Attacks like these (and the groups that perform them) need to be condemned by moderate Palestinians.
[QUOTE=lilgrill;46516715]raze gaza[/QUOTE]
Continue that bloody cycle of violence mmm yeah
This bodes well...
There will only be peace when the people of Palestine and Israel condemn and punish all attacks, regardless of who did it and for what reason.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;46517129]Heard this in morning news, as breaking
The thing is, [B]we shouldn't let marginal groups[/B] of both sides undermine peace efforts. Don't retailate by being worse than them. Then peace may not be impossible.
Jail the fuckers for a thousand years or execute them and be don with it.[/QUOTE]
The issue is Hamas hasn't condemned it - they done the opposite and praised it.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;46517129]Heard this in morning news, as breaking
The thing is, we shouldn't let marginal groups of both sides undermine peace efforts. Don't retailate by being worse than them. Then peace may not be impossible.
Jail the fuckers for a thousand years or execute them and be don with it.[/QUOTE]
Like Jonzky said, [URL="http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Hamas-Jerusalem-synagogue-attack-in-response-to-death-of-Palestinian-bus-driver-found-hanged-382106"]Hamas has already claimed responsibility[/URL] for this attack, and while [URL="http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Abbas-condemns-deadly-attack-on-Jewish-worshipers-in-Jerusalem-synagogue-382117"]Abbas condemned this one[/URL] (while still accusing it on Jews entering the Temple Mount) he has already sent letters to the families of the previous attackers [URL="http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Liberman-slams-Abbas-as-a-partner-for-terror-380592"]praising them as martyrs[/URL].
And this is while both Fatah and Hamas [URL="http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Abbas-and-Fatah-show-their-true-colors-in-Arabic-382071"]continue inciting the Palestinian public into fighting Israel[/URL] with every means possible over Jerusalem.
So no, these are not marginal groups. These are Palestinians doing exactly what their leaders want them to.
"Or as the BBC puts it"
You mean they don't over dramatize it? It's not like the fuckers walked in with axes and said I AM THE DEVIL AND I'M HERE TO DO THE DEVILS WORK. MYEGHHHH.
But hey, What's Israel without a persecution complex?
[QUOTE=ZakkShock;46517418]"Or as the BBC puts it"
You mean they don't over dramatize it? It's not like the fuckers walked in with axes and said I AM THE DEVIL AND I'M HERE TO DO THE DEVILS WORK. MYEGHHHH.
But hey, What's Israel without a persecution complex?[/QUOTE]
Generally when someone kills someone else with an axe or a butcher knife without provocation the victim is considered "murdered" and not just "killed".
But it could be my persecution complex talking.
I am Israel, after all.
that's fucked up
Is this the beginning of the third intifada?
[QUOTE=Saigon;46516815]Attacks like these (and the groups that perform them) need to be condemned by moderate Palestinians.[/QUOTE]
will never happen
The 4 killed all held dual-citizenship - 3 were from the US and one from the UK.
[QUOTE=Jonzky;46518322]The 4 killed all held dual-citizenship - 3 were from the US and one from the UK.[/QUOTE]
I'm not doubting your statement, but do you have a source?
[QUOTE=Saigon;46518411]I'm not doubting your statement, but do you have a source?[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Yeshiva-head-named-as-one-of-four-victims-in-Jerusalem-synagogue-attack-382120"]http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Yeshiva-head-named-as-one-of-four-victims-in-Jerusalem-synagogue-attack-382120[/URL]
[QUOTE]Rabbi Aryeh Kopinsky, 43, Rabbi Avraham Shmuel Goldberg, 68, and Rabbi Calman Levine, 55, all from the Har Nof neighborhood were identified along with Rabbi Moshe Twersky, 59, as victims murdered by two Palestinian terrorists.
Kopinsky, Levine and Twersky held dual US-Israeli citizenship after making aliya from America. Goldberg, a British-Israeli national, immigrated to Israel from Britain. [/QUOTE]
Edit:
I don't know why google keeps giving me Jpost as the first result in every search.
Here's another source:
[URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/18/us-mideast-palestinians-israel-idUSKCN0J20E220141118"]http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/18/us-mideast-palestinians-israel-idUSKCN0J20E220141118[/URL]
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;46518754]Hamas =/= Palestinian people's leadership in my book. Abbas is. Both sides needs to compromise and sacrifice some stuff, but no one does that, and as Israel is the strong one they get whatever they want, except peace.
I also don't think Fatah supports attacking Jews in general, e.g. civilians. They may be inciting people to fight Israel, I'd believe that, but they wouldn't support a fucking synagogue attack with axes.[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately "your book" and reality are at odds here. Hamas is the de-facto leadership of two million Gazan Palestinians. Additionally since the Palestinians declared a union government slightly ahead of the last Gaza war Hamas is officially a part of the Palestinian government, which is why the PA negotiated for the Gaza truce and the reconstruction of Gaza.
Finally, it has more support in the Palestinian street than Fatah and is poised to take over the West Bank by elections or by force if Israel and the world stop backing Abbas' regime there.
Anyway, you're ignoring [URL="http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Liberman-slams-Abbas-as-a-partner-for-terror-380592"]Abbas's letter to the family of the "hero"[/URL] that attempted to execute a Jewish civilian just a couple of weeks ago, as well as [URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/18/us-mideast-palestinians-israel-idUSKCN0J20E220141118"]this[/URL]:
[QUOTE][B]Palestinian radio described the attackers as "martyrs"[/B] and the Islamist group Hamas praised the attack. Loudspeakers at mosques in Gaza called out congratulations and youngsters handed out candy in the streets.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;46518905]Im not ignoring anything, I am not simply aware of them, I don't know much. This is why "In my book" or "I think". Also I thought Hamas won Gaza in a war against Fatah, or am I wrong? You know, I know there was an election, but IIRC it was after Hamas got de facto control, am I wrong? If so, how can we know it wasn't rigged? Rigging elections shouldn't be something new for people who slaughter innocent civilians with cleavers.
Still, again I think, both countries need new and better governments. Some governments that will compromise. Not one, but both are shit now.[/QUOTE]
It's actually really complicated.
IIRC Hamas took over Gaza by force after it won the elections to the parliament in the Palestinian Authority (back then both the West Bank and Gaza strip) and Fatah refused to hand over the keys.
Since then Hamas has been controlling Gaza and Fatah the West Bank, and neither side had elections since.
Now, Hamas and Gaza fear and hate each other, with Hamas abusing Fatah members in Gaza and plotting to take over the West Bank, and Fatah cooperating with Israel to root out Hamas operations there.
But shortly before the Gaza war, in a bid to strengthen their international position and because the Hamas was being starved of resources and support from Egypt, Fatah and Hamas declared a reunion.
Hamas was hoping Fatah would help covering all their paychecks, while Hamas hoped to be let into Gaza. Neither happened as Fatah was only willing to pay Gaza administration employees and not Hamas members, and Hamas wasn't letting the PA into Gaza.
Still, officially the PA still speaks for both Fatah and Hamas, which is why the Palestinian delegations to Egypt to negotiate a truce during the war had both PA and Hamas members.
Basic human psychology would seem to indicate the Palestinians are screwed because of this:
When you invest everything on a bet, in this case eliminating Israel, you are like the guy who just bet his paycheck and lost in poker. Now you can't pay your rent, buy food, etc. So you have to beg, borrow, steal and bet AGAIN. You double down because you can't walk away with nothing. You get caught in a cycle where the more you lose the more you bet in a desperate attempt to cancel out the previous losses.
I see the Palestinian people stuck in this. Their leaders, moderate or hardline, can't bring themselves to tell their people the truth- we need to get along with Israel. This means admitting all the suffering, all the deaths, all the wasted decades in poverty were for nothing. They can't do it.
[QUOTE=ScumBunny;46518731][URL="http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Yeshiva-head-named-as-one-of-four-victims-in-Jerusalem-synagogue-attack-382120"]http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Yeshiva-head-named-as-one-of-four-victims-in-Jerusalem-synagogue-attack-382120[/URL]
Edit:
I don't know why google keeps giving me Jpost as the first result in every search.
Here's another source:
[URL="http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/18/us-mideast-palestinians-israel-idUSKCN0J20E220141118"]http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/11/18/us-mideast-palestinians-israel-idUSKCN0J20E220141118[/URL][/QUOTE]I'm glad you cited another source, picking stuff up from JP is a bit bias, not saying what happened was right just like to have all the facts.
Goddammit this isn't going to end well.
They aren't even trying to find a peaceful solution. They'd rather make an alliance to then stab them in the back.
[QUOTE=SebiWarrior;46521113]They aren't even trying to find a peaceful solution. They'd rather make an alliance to then stab them in the back.[/QUOTE]If people were that willing to search for a peaceful solution-- we'd probably have one by now.
[QUOTE=Saigon;46516815]Things like this are why Palestine still has some ways to go before becoming a state. Attacks like these (and the groups that perform them) need to be condemned by moderate Palestinians.[/QUOTE]
[quote]Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas also issued a condemnation of "the attack on Jewish worshippers in their place of prayer and [of] the killing of civilians no matter who is doing it".
Mr Netanyahu said this was not enough.[/quote]
Netanyahu is promising a '[URL="http://hosted2.ap.org/APDEFAULT/3d281c11a96b4ad082fe88aa0db04305/Article_2014-11-18-ML--Israel-Palestinians/id-eabe3b3952904531a596d36916c3c6a7"]harsh response'[/URL]. What is tantamount to punishing the collective Palestinian populace for the act of a few condemned lone wolves. That is state-sanctioned terrorism, but we ignore that to try to dig roots to see if we can try to claim that any attack was supported by the PA leadership.
Okay, well, how about Hamas then?
At the very least Hamas is actively promoting and praising those attacks:
[URL="http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4593063,00.html"]http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4593063,00.html[/URL]
Is Israel allowed to act against Hamas?
Also, even if you don't accept Hamas and Fatah having any hand in all those "lone wolves" murdering over 8 people in Jerusalem this month alone, are they really lone wolves when the [URL="http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-30092720"]Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine has claimed responsibility[/URL] for the attack? They're a militant group that operates in Gaza.
Can Israel act against them?
Oh, hey, remember who runs Gaza? [URL="http://abcnews.go.com/International/hamas-praises-jerusalem-terror-attack/story?id=26709425"]Hmmm...[/URL]
[QUOTE=ScumBunny;46524234]Okay, well, how about Hamas then?
At the very least Hamas is actively promoting and praising those attacks:
[URL="http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4593063,00.html"]http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4593063,00.html[/URL]
Is Israel allowed to act against Hamas?
Also, even if you don't accept Hamas and Fatah having any hand in all those "lone wolves" murdering over 8 people in Jerusalem this month alone, are they really lone wolves when the [URL="http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-30092720"]Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine has claimed responsibility[/URL] for the attack? They're a militant group that operates in Gaza.
Can Israel act against them?
Oh, hey, remember who runs Gaza? [URL="http://abcnews.go.com/International/hamas-praises-jerusalem-terror-attack/story?id=26709425"]Hmmm...[/URL][/QUOTE]
Don't worry, I'm sure that Hamas security forces will [url=http://bigstory.ap.org/article/hamas-kills-suspected-collaborators-israel]take a break from executing civilians and dragging their corpses through the streets[/url], in order to bring the PFLP to justice.
[QUOTE=Starpluck;46523831]a few condemned lone wolves.[/QUOTE]
I'll stop you right there because Hamas has claimed responsibilty for the attacks and/or praised the men who carried them out, referring to them as the "Heroes" of Agassi.
While I will not support an Israeli attack, acting like Palestine is 100% innocent and Israel deserved this is ignorant at best and downright idiotic at worst.
[QUOTE=Starpluck;46523831]What is tantamount to punishing the collective Palestinian populace for the act of a few condemned lone wolves.[/QUOTE]Condemned? I'm not sure if you're entirely uneducated on the Israeli-Hamas Conflict, or if you're just trolling.
Hamas not only isn't condemning them-- they're praising jihadists as heroes and martyrs. In some cases, the martyr's family receives financial reward for their husband's jihad. There's nothing 'condemned' about this, hell, this can easily be summed up as Hamas sending "not-soldiers" to fight.
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