I built my own PC for Christmas and had a Windows 7 disc laying around from when my family bought a new computer. When installing I did not have a key so I clicked skip when it asked me to enter one. I am currently running Win7, but the trial runs out in a day so I have some questions.
-Do you think Win8 is worth the upgrade? Why or why not?
-What is "better" and what is "worse"?
-If you think it is worthy, how do I go about upgrading to Win8?
-If Windows 7 is "better", where is a place I can buy a Win7 key?
I know that a lot of it is probably preference as well (hence the quotations around better and worse), but any answers are helpful.
Thanks!
The difference is pretty obvious. Win8 is just a newer version of Win7. It actually has slightly lower hardware requirements. The only real downside I can think of is that some people don't like the new Modern UI, which you can pretty much mod away. That, and some very old games might not be compatible anymore.
I can't think of a single reason not to. You're going to hear a bunch of crap about the "Metro UI" and start menu but really if you stop looking for reasons to complain you'll notice it's faster and easier to use. Windows 8 has a smaller memory footprint and I love every bit of it.
As a long time windows 7 user having used 8.1 for a couple months, there are a couple little new things I like about it personally. The new task manager, builtin disc image mounting, some little improvements to explorer, better multi-monitor support. And it shuts off the monitors after a few seconds when you lock your desktop which is a feature it seems like no one talks about, lol
Sidebar gadgets are gone if you use those. Then there's Metro, which obviously is the first thing any anti-win8 bandwagoner is going to whine about. I don't use it for anything other than pinning things I use all the time like paint, calculator and notepad, though I think most people install a program to replace it with an old style start menu. In 8.1 they added a little menu when you right click the start button for common system tasks like control panel, device manager, command prompt, run, shutdown, etc. And I've kinda changed my habit to opening explorer from the taskbar instead of from the old start menu which I will admit was completely disorienting at first but you get used to it.
I haven't run into any compatibility issues with games, although I haven't tried a ton of them or anything. As far as speed goes, it's kind of a tossup... it feels more responsive in some things and less in others. I noticed that some folders that contain tons of images or videos will take forever to load sometimes. Obviously not a very scientific comparison so take that how you want.
I still haven't decided myself if I'm gonna stick with 8 or go back to 7 next time I reformat... those are just some things for you to consider lol
Since Microsoft stopped retail sales of Windows 7, you can't get it from the Microsoft store anymore. Your only choice is to buy a completely new copy of Windows 7 from Newegg / Amazon and use the product key that comes with the one you buy.
There's no point in getting Windows 8 if you already have everything setup, and in my opinion, it's a terrible OS.
[QUOTE=Darkwater124;43316445]The difference is pretty obvious. Win8 is just a newer version of Win7. It actually has slightly lower hardware requirements.[/QUOTE]
The hardware requirements are the same (1 GHz CPU with PAE/NX/SSE2 support, 1/2 GB of RAM and 16/20 GB of drive space.)
There's also the additional requirement of shitty "Secure Boot" that only lets you boot to Windows 8. If you want to dual boot, you can't use an elegant solution like GRUB; You're forced to use the draconian BCDEdit (or a 3rd party tool to interface with it.) So basically the Windows 8 boot loader then calls the GRUB boot loader, which then loads the other OS you want loaded.
[QUOTE=Darkwater124;43316445]The only real downside I can think of is that some people don't like the new Modern UI, which you can pretty much mod away.[/QUOTE]
Yes, Metro is shit. You can "mod" it away with several third party programs at the cost of system resources (mainly RAM, around 100 MB.)
[QUOTE=Darkwater124;43316445]That, and some very old games might not be compatible anymore.[/QUOTE]
WIN16 games definitely won't work, and "dirty" WIN32 games (32 bit games that use some 16 bit code) won't work. And WIN32 games that rely on really old versions of Direct Draw / Direct X / OpenGL will generally behave badly (graphical glitches or eat tons of CPU time for no reason.)
[QUOTE=TweaK2007;43316776]As a long time windows 7 user having used 8.1 for a couple months, there are a couple little new things I like about it personally. The new task manager, builtin disc image mounting, some little improvements to explorer, better multi-monitor support. And it shuts off the monitors after a few seconds when you lock your desktop which is a feature it seems like no one talks about, lol
Sidebar gadgets are gone if you use those. Then there's Metro, which obviously is the first thing any anti-win8 bandwagoner is going to whine about. I don't use it for anything other than pinning things I use all the time like paint, calculator and notepad, though I think most people install a program to replace it with an old style start menu. In 8.1 they added a little menu when you right click the start button for common system tasks like control panel, device manager, command prompt, run, shutdown, etc. And I've kinda changed my habit to opening explorer from the taskbar instead of from the old start menu which I will admit was completely disorienting at first but you get used to it.
I haven't run into any compatibility issues with games, although I haven't tried a ton of them or anything. As far as speed goes, it's kind of a tossup... it feels more responsive in some things and less in others. I noticed that some folders that contain tons of images or videos will take forever to load sometimes. Obviously not a very scientific comparison so take that how you want.
I still haven't decided myself if I'm gonna stick with 8 or go back to 7 next time I reformat... those are just some things for you to consider lol[/QUOTE]
Seriously awesome reply.
I believe my biggest worry was Metro, as I have used it and I disliked it, but I feel like I would get over it soon enough.
So now that's that out of the way, the worst part for me if I decide to purchase would be the price tag, which seems a bit steep for me. If anyone has any legitimate websites for purchasing a Windows 7 key, I would be grateful.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43316878]Yes, Metro is shit. You can "mod" it away with several third party programs at the cost of system resources (mainly RAM, around 100 MB.)[/QUOTE]
Can you please elaborate on what you mean here? I didn't like Metro in the beginning either but I can't find anything wrong with it anymore.
[QUOTE=Banana Lord.;43316973]Can you please elaborate on what you mean here? I didn't like Metro in the beginning either but I can't find anything wrong with it anymore.[/QUOTE]
Because Metro is a UI that's all about flashy graphics and eye candy and little about functionality. It's like they purposefully went out of the way to make using it a chore and extremely irritating. Also because my PC is not a tablet and shouldn't look like one.
The only people that I've met that like it are children (because of flashy eye candy) and the hipster types (for reasons unknown.)
If you have to buy a new key anyway you might as well get 8.1. Apart from the UI (which I like and you can basically do away with through programs anyway) 7 doesn't really have any upsides comparatively.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43319877]Because Metro is a UI that's all about flashy graphics and eye candy and little about functionality.[/QUOTE]
Why, it does everything your precious start menu does. It just looks different! I'd almost say if it does everything your start menu does, it's just as functional!
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43319877]It's like they purposefully went out of the way to make using it a chore and extremely irritating. Also because my PC is not a tablet and shouldn't look like one.[/quote]
I know a lot of people without tablets that are navigating Windows 8 fine. You are a vocal minority. If you find it irritating to use then I advise you to stop being PEBKAC.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43319877]The only people that I've met that like it are children (because of flashy eye candy) and the hipster types (for reasons unknown.)[/QUOTE]
Yeah, because people who enjoy a technology product are people who can't even afford it and only care about Angry Birds and Candy Crush Saga, or people that you lump into a group under a loaded name because you don't like their taste in things. Nice! It's not like regular people don't like it or anything, only babies and *shudders* [I]hipsters[/I].
You can not like it. But there's a difference between saying "well I don't like it, so you might not like it too" and 'it's objectively shit" when a lot of people clearly don't think so.
OP, Windows 8 is fine. Once I learned how everything worked I love it. I can categorize programs without silly folders or anything and I get like 8 times as much programs to choose from with a single click.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43319877]Because Metro is a UI that's all about flashy graphics and eye candy and little about functionality. It's like they purposefully went out of the way to make using it a chore and extremely irritating. Also because my PC is not a tablet and shouldn't look like one.
[B]The only people that I've met that like it are children (because of flashy eye candy) and the hipster types (for reasons unknown.)[/B][/QUOTE]
...And you completely discredited anything and everything you will ever say on the topic.
OP, disregard the above.
8 is worth it just for the performance improvements. Give metro a shot, the start screen is better than the menu (you can see way more at once) but if you can't get used to it grab StartIsBack.
There's no actual need to use any part the modern UI other than the start screen (which is actually p neat, especially if you use [url=http://apps.microsoft.com/windows/en-gb/app/steam-tile/f17f134c-c72d-470b-9d97-9c9d6d4aae85]Steam Tile[/url] or similar to spam your games in a vaguely functional mosaic) during normal usage, and if you get into the habit of launching your programs via the keyboard (hit the win key and start typing) you won't even need to navigate it.
Well, I prefer using Metro (maybe because I'm a hipster type or something?), but if you don't care for it, you can always download a third party solution - there are a vast array of choice, and I don't think any of them are more than $5. I'd get Windows 8, if for nothing else, it'll be supported for longer, and you'll get all the 8.x updates (as it stands now). There's even rumours that 8.3 will bring back the start menu (as an option), but of course you should be wary of such rumours.
[QUOTE=Banana Lord.;43316652]I can't think of a single reason not to. You're going to hear a bunch of crap about the "Metro UI" and start menu but really if you stop looking for reasons to complain you'll notice it's faster and easier to use. Windows 8 has a smaller memory footprint and I love every bit of it.[/QUOTE]
I agree. It really is faster. People just aren't used to it is all.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43321708]Why, it does everything your precious start menu does. It just looks different! I'd almost say if it does everything your start menu does, it's just as functional![/QUOTE]
It does nothing the start menu does while taking up the entire screen and wasting tons of space on flat colored boxes.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43321708]I know a lot of people without tablets that are navigating Windows 8 fine. You are a vocal minority. If you find it irritating to use then I advise you to stop being PEBKAC.[/QUOTE]
I know a lot of people without tablets that hate Windows 8, you are the vocal minority that like it. I advise you to stop being PEBKAC. See, I can make up nonsensical statistics too.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43321708]people that you lump into a group under a loaded name because you don't like their taste in things. Nice! It's not like regular people don't like it or anything, only babies and *shudders* [I]hipsters[/I].[/QUOTE]
Yes, it's as you say, babies and hipsters. I totally didn't meet them in person or anything and totally didn't get their opinions on it. ..Or not, and you're mad someone insulted your precious operating system.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43321708]You can not like it. But there's a difference between saying "well I don't like it, so you might not like it too" and 'it's objectively shit" when a lot of people clearly don't think so.[/QUOTE]
Yes, yes, people that don't like the same things as you are insignificant and should be ignored.
[QUOTE=waxrock;43321743]...And you completely discredited anything and everything you will ever say on the topic.[/QUOTE]
...And you are completely discredited from everything you say because I say so.
Wait, it doesn't work like that. You're failing at failing.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]Stuff[/QUOTE]
Aww cmon dude. You usually give ok advice, don't lower yourself to shit flinging.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]
Yes, it's as you say, babies and hipsters. I totally didn't meet them in person or anything and totally didn't get their opinions on it. ..Or not, and you're mad someone insulted your precious operating system.[/QUOTE]
So you're saying you interviewed children and hipsters on their opinions on Modern UI - a completely stacked method of surveying - and then you say I'm defending my "precious operating system" when you're operating entirely under defense of your "precious start menu."
Jesus Christ, man, for your own good, pull your head out of your fucking ass.
I never once said Modern UI was perfect, either, just that it isn't complete garbage when you get used to it. Y'know, there's a difference between being okay with something new and humping its leg like a dog would.
Gigabite, you're also objectively wrong on that first point.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43326238]So you're saying you interviewed children and hipsters on their opinions on Modern UI - a completely stacked method of surveying - and then you say I'm defending my "precious operating system" when you're operating entirely under defense of your "precious start menu."[/QUOTE]
I run a computer repair business, I deal with all types of people. Young, old, hipsters, rednecks and everything between. I've asked many of them "Do you like windows 8?" because many of them have Windows 8 PCs, or have used them before. The almost universal answer that come from the 20-90 crowd is "no" for some of the same reasons I hate it. But they often tell me their children or grand children love it. I then sometimes ask their kids when they're around and they usually give some form of the reason I gave above "because of the colors and the touchscreen, angry birds, etc."
So I can make the assumption that many adults hate Windows 8, and children like it.
I also do [I]some[/I] work for the hipster crowd (many of which are assholes, but they pay so I don't care) and ask them the same questions, most of which answer "yes" to "do you like windows 8" (and other things like apple and other really expensive nonsensical things.)
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43326238]Jesus Christ, man, for your own good, pull your head out of your fucking ass.[/QUOTE]
No, you need to stop being a condescending dick, thanks.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43326238]I never once said Modern UI was perfect, either, just that it isn't complete garbage when you get used to it. Y'know, there's a difference between being okay with something new and humping its leg like a dog would.[/QUOTE]
I've tried to give it a chance and have tried using it off and on since it was released. I'm also forced to use it in my repair business because people have machines with it installed. My opinion is it's a piece of shit and it will always be a piece of shit and that's not going to change.
More than half of the installs i work on, people have me install a start menu program because they can't stand metro at all, and I agree with them.
I can use anecdotes too! I work in a software development company and pretty much every developer there - mostly men, a few women, age ranges from 26-50 - like Windows 8.
You're being the condescending asshole if anything. Not even condescending, you're just being an asshole. Let OP decide if he likes Metro or not, instead of this pisspoor excuse of "WELL I DON'T LIKE IT AND I KNOW PEOPLE WHO DON'T LIKE IT SO IT SUCKS"
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43330006]You're being the condescending asshole if anything. Not even condescending, you're just being an asshole. Let OP decide if he likes Metro or not, instead of this pisspoor excuse of "WELL I DON'T LIKE IT AND I KNOW PEOPLE WHO DON'T LIKE IT SO IT SUCKS"[/QUOTE]
Thanks for proving my point for me, can't get any more condescending than this.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43330170]Thanks for proving my point for me, can't get any more condescending than this.[/QUOTE]
You don't even know what condescending means, are you serious? The whole "I work at a computer repair shop and everyone hates it, I hate it, so you should hate it too" is [I]textbook[/I] condescension.
[QUOTE=Protocol7;43330222]You don't even know what condescending means, are you serious? The whole "I work at a computer repair shop and everyone hates it, I hate it, so you should hate it too" is [I]textbook[/I] condescension.[/QUOTE]
Nice strawman you have there.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]It does nothing the start menu does while taking up the entire screen and wasting tons of space on flat colored boxes.[/quote]
I think that Metro can be worked on, we are still in the early stages of this new UI. But you're not giving it the credit it deserves. It does everything the Start Menu does but better. You can much more easily categorize different software, you can have more visible at the same time. I decided to take a quick screenshot of my setup, I added some titles to give it a clear representation.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/xOTJkL6.png[/t]
As you see, I have all the software I need in Metro. Something I couldn't manage with the normal start menu.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]I know a lot of people without tablets that hate Windows 8, you are the vocal minority that like it. I advise you to stop being PEBKAC. See, I can make up nonsensical statistics too.[/quote]
Judging by the posts made here, you're in the vocal minority. Majority of the people here like Windows 8, for good reasons too!
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]Yes, it's as you say, babies and hipsters. I totally didn't meet them in person or anything and totally didn't get their opinions on it. ..Or not, and you're mad someone insulted your precious operating system.[/quote]
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]The only people that I've met that like it are children (because of flashy eye candy) and the hipster types (for reasons unknown.)[/quote]
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]I run a computer repair business, I deal with all types of people. Young, old, hipsters, rednecks and everything between. I've asked many of them "Do you like windows 8?" because many of them have Windows 8 PCs, or have used them before. The almost universal answer that come from the 20-90 crowd is "no" for some of the same reasons I hate it. But they often tell me their children or grand children love it. I then sometimes ask their kids when they're around and they usually give some form of the reason I gave above "because of the colors and the touchscreen, angry birds, etc."
So I can make the assumption that many adults hate Windows 8, and children like it.
I also do some work for the hipster crowd (many of which are assholes, but they pay so I don't care) and ask them the same questions, most of which answer "yes" to "do you like windows 8" (and other things like apple and other really expensive nonsensical things.)[/quote]
Your average joe isn't going to be very tech sawy(C'mon, they're going to a Computer Repair shop!) The people who say they hate Windows 8 have a hard time adapting to change. They won't realize the perks of Windows 8, they most likely got it bundled with their latest HP Laptop and don't really have a choice. Resulting in their opinion of the OS just being the exterior(New Metro UI replacing the Start Menu being the main focus.)
If you infact happen to work at a computer repair shop you should realize that Windows 8 is superior. You should inform your customers of the perks.
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43325156]...And you are completely discredited from everything you say because I say so.
Wait, it doesn't work like that. You're failing at failing.[/quote]
You lumped everyone who likes Windows 8 in to the category "Hipster" or "Baby".
I remember when you used to post informative non-biased posts that wouldn't result in a shitstorm.
[QUOTE=ejonkou;43330536]I think that Metro can be worked on, we are still in the early stages of this new UI. But you're not giving it the credit it deserves. It does everything the Start Menu does but better. You can much more easily categorize different software, you can have more visible at the same time. I decided to take a quick screenshot of my setup, I added some titles to give it a clear representation.
[t]http://i.imgur.com/xOTJkL6.png[/t]
As you see, I have all the software I need in Metro. Something I couldn't manage with the normal start menu.[/QUOTE]
And here's my desktop:
[thumb]http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/4374/uhci.png[/thumb]
I can have my neatly alphabetized list of commonly used programs tucked away in a menu that uses ~3.6% of my workspace, and less than 0.5% when closed. It doesn't obscure my workspace and I can have it open while still being able to see what I'm doing. I can also group applications in whatever order I want and I don't have to use sub-folders either.
Metro on the other hand takes up 100% of the screen and obscures the entire workspace while open. It's also extremely space inefficient. I could fit all of those applications on your metro screen in the same 3.6% of space in my start menu.
[QUOTE=ejonkou;43330536]If you infact happen to work at a computer repair shop you should realize that Windows 8 is superior. You should inform your customers of the perks.[/QUOTE]
Work? No, I own it. And I'm not going force a product down a customers throat just because you said so. If a potential customer comes to me and says "I hate X and want to use Y solution", I'm not going to find reasons to defend X when it wastes both of our time and makes me lose a customer/money.
[QUOTE=ejonkou;43330536]You lumped everyone who likes Windows 8 in to the category "Hipster" or "Baby".
I remember when you used to post informative non-biased posts that wouldn't result in a shitstorm.[/QUOTE]
It's not a problem of me lumping people into one category or another, it's a problem with your eyes and reading things you only want to see.
You turn what I said:
The only people that [B]I've met[/B] that like it are children (because of flashy eye candy) and the hipster types (for reasons unknown.)
Into what you want you want to believe I said:
The only people that like it are children (because of flashy eye candy) and the hipster types (for reasons unknown.)
And I still post informative stuff, you and everyone else are just too caught up on my personal opinions and experiences to know better.
It's extremely important to be able to see your applications when you open more applications, just in case you forgot the name of the app you need to open and need to have it written down in a text file open on your desktop and you happen to have a short term memory that is worse than a goldfish's. That's the only reasonable excuse I can come up with for the Windows 8 Start Menu "interrupting one's workflow." Otherwise, you click it the start menu, click a shortcut, and it disappears back into the aether and you're exactly where you were before. Exactly the way we did since the year 1995.
GiGaBiTe's a rather angry person
[QUOTE=GiGaBiTe;43331242]And here's my desktop:
[thumb]
I can have my neatly alphabetized list of commonly used programs tucked away in a menu that uses ~3.6% of my workspace, and less than 0.5% when closed. It doesn't obscure my workspace and I can have it open while still being able to see what I'm doing. I can also group applications in whatever order I want and I don't have to use sub-folders either.
Metro on the other hand takes up 100% of the screen and obscures the entire workspace while open. It's also extremely space inefficient. I could fit all of those applications on your metro screen in the same 3.6% of space in my start menu.
[/QUOTE]
Space inefficient? The start screen at 1080p can show 126 applications at once, the start menu can only show 22. I don't know what you're doing on Windows but when I use it and want to open an application, I click my start button, click on the app I want to open and use it. I don't open the start menu and go "shit man, look at all of this useless extra screen real estate." You can't do anything with the extra space because you can't interact with other applications while the start menu is open.
Yeah because you really need to be seeing what you're doing all the time when you're working in Hammer and your mouse is elsewhere. Either you have inhuman peripheral vision, or, hell, your screenshot demonstrates the obvious - you aren't the average Windows consumer!
You have 18 visible icons in that 3.6% of your workspace. In my Metro, I have 51 visible icons, with room for 23 more. And no, I don't have my icons all shrinked down. With a single click I have 2.83x more available options with a total potential of 4.11x more available options with my current configuration. So you want to talk about space efficiency, well, it turns out a 2-dimensional grid is more space efficient than a tiny list.
So again, I beg the question. If the classic start menu doesn't break your workflow, then I pose a few questions - if you are working in Hammer as is your example, what are you doing that requires you to A) open an application, and B) maintain focus on Hammer? And if you are maintaining focus on Hammer, then C) How are you navigating the Start menu?
I'm going to go ahead and discredit your personal opinion of Windows UI design based solely on the fact that you are using the classic embossed Windows look. You're definitely in a minority there, and your screenshot - in both it's low color palette and choice of image host - is not the shining example of someone who embraces modern technology. Which is fine, but c'mon, not even using Aero? Does that "break your workflow" too? Are you missing out on precious CPU cycles?
Finally, when you say "The only people that I've met that like it are children (because of flashy eye candy) and the hipster types (for reasons unknown.)," I wonder what the implication you're making is. Because it sure as hell doesn't sound like you're saying something more reasonable like "well, most of the people I meet don't seem to like it, but who knows, maybe some people out there do."
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