What can the world teach the US about immigration issues? - Polidicks

[quote]Immigrants founded America hundreds of years ago, coming to the promised land in search of freedom and opportunity, in pursuit of the American dream. Today, many Americans see immigrants as a danger to that dream. They worry that immigrants are taking their jobs, using government services and changing the country's national identity. The average American believes that 39% of the U.S. population was born abroad. The real figure is 13%, still the highest level since 1920. Related: How much do you know about U.S. immigration? Immigration is divisive, a wedge issue in this election year. But most Americans (73%) agree that the government is doing a poor job of managing it. So, how should the U.S. handle immigration? Does anyone else do it better? What can the U.S. learn from successes – and possible mistakes – from other countries? Let’s look at three examples: Japan, Europe and Canada. [quote][h2]JAPAN: A CAUTIONARY TALE[/h2] Japan has one of the strictest immigration policies in the world and has historically been closed off to outsiders. It has a foreign population of less than 2% - six times smaller than the percentage of the U.S. But what are the effects of keeping foreigners out? Japan is facing an alarming labor shortage, says Robert Guest, the business editor of The Economist and author of "Borderless Economics." Japan’s current population is around a 127 million. It’s on pace to be just 90 million by 2050, a drop-off of almost one-third. The nation is also aging. Almost one in four people are 65 or older – making Japan the oldest country on earth. Guest says there’s a solution to the labor shortage: open the borders and invite more immigrants. But that idea has hurdles. “They don't have the idea that you can become Japanese,” says Guest. “And they don't have the idea that you can solve some of the country's chronic labor problems by importing foreign hands.” In its health care sector, for example, Japan is estimated to be short almost 900,000 workers 2025. It started to invite foreign nurses, and since 2008 almost 600 have come to Japan. But only 66 have passed Japan’s notoriously difficult nursing proficiency exam, which requires an expertise in written Japanese. Japan’s health ministry has made the test easier, adding some English translations, but critics say it’s still unreasonable. “It should be good enough that they are able to communicate verbally with people and that they are able to read the words they need to know for the tools of their trade,” says Guest. “It worked perfectly well in other countries.” And it’s not just foreign workers who might run into obstacles. In some cases, it’s immigrants who have been living in Japan for decades. In 1990, facing a labor shortage, Japan gave ethnic Japanese from South America long-term residence status, filling gaps in its workforce. Japanese-Brazilians filled manufacturing jobs and became the third largest minority in Japan. But in 2009, with unemployment running high, Japan actually offered money to them to leave the country – $3,000 for each worker to cover travel expenses. And the flight was essentially a one-way ticket – anyone who took the offer couldn’t come back to Japan with the residence status they once had. The government says it was only trying to help unemployed Japanese-Brazilians. They’ve stopped offering the deal and are reconsidering the residence status of those who took the money. So if Japan won’t let in immigrants, what is it doing about its labor shortage? It’s encouraging families to have more children, giving them $165 a month for each child. But that hasn’t been enough to inspire a growth spurt.[/quote] [quote][h2]EUROPEAN UNION: WORK IN PROGRESS[/h2] Europe faces a similar demographic crisis as Japan, but it’s trying a more open approach to immigration. It’s easy to forget that the European Union itself is one of the most ambitious migration experiments in history. Half a billion people are allowed to roam freely within the EU’s borders. Many predicted that swarms of people from poorer nations like Poland and Romania would move to rich countries like Germany and France. That never happened – only 3% of working-age EU citizens live in a different EU country. But the EU has not dealt well with immigrants from outside its borders. There’s been a nasty political backlash – with anti-immigrant parties thriving in Greece, the Netherlands and France. Rather than rejecting these extremists, Europe’s mainstream politicians have pandered to them. Former French President Nicholas Sarkozy, British Prime Minister David Cameron and Chancellor Angela Merkel of Germany have all declared that multiculturalism in their countries is a failure. “They all agree multiculturalism is dead,” says Chem Ozdemir, born in Germany to Turkish migrant workers. “It's amazing that they agree on that, but they do not agree when it comes to euro and on other issues.” Ozdemir, now head of Germany’s left-leaning Green Party, became the first ethnic-Turkish member of Parliament at age 28. Now, he helps his nation to answer a very basic question: What does it mean to be German? “Can you be a German and have a head scarf at the same time? Can you be a German and practice Islam at the same time?” Ozdemir says. Jonathan Laurence, author of “The Emancipation of Europe’s Muslims,” is hopeful on Islam’s place in Europe. In a GPS guest post this week, Laurence writes: [quote]The key development is that as the proportion of Muslims of foreign nationality residing in Europe decreases – because the number of native-born Muslims is growing – Europe’s democratic political institutions are increasingly kicking in. For decades, the absence of integration policy allowed foreign governments and transnational movements to capture the religious and political interests of this new minority. This wasn’t multiculturalism so much as indifference. The series of terrorist attacks against Western capitals from 2001-2005, however, in combination with high unemployment and educational under-performance, ended Europeans’ hands-off approach. After leaving them outside domestic institutions for decades, governments gradually took ownership of their Muslim populations. Authorities began to treat Islam as a domestic religion and encouraged Muslims to embrace national citizenship.[/quote] In Germany, for example, the government has met with Muslim leaders at an annual German Islam conference since 2006, in an effort to better integrate Muslims with the rest of the population. Germany and others are certainly making strides, but throughout Europe, there are still obstacles to immigrants’ inclusion. So, is there any nation that’s getting immigration right?[/quote] [quote][h2]CANADA: GETTING IT RIGHT[/h2] If Japan’s strict immigration policy serves as a cautionary tale and Europe’s experiment is still a work in progress, then take a look at Canada – a nation with more foreign-born per capita than the United States. Canada may not have the cache the U.S. does – but it holds great appeal for would-be immigrants, says The Economist’s Guest. “Canada offers many of the same things that America does – a very high standard of living, the rule of law, peace, safety,” he says. To determine whom it should let in to live and work, Canada uses a point system. You don't even need a job or employer, just skills. Applicants are awarded points for proficiency in education, languages and job experience. Just why is Canada so ready to accept immigrants with open arms? Because it has to be. The nation is sparsely populated, has a low birth rate, and needs immigrants for population growth – and economic growth. In Canada, almost two-thirds of permanent visas last year were given for economic needs – Canada's economic needs, that is. The country brings in the majority of foreigners to fill labor holes. Only 22% of its immigration was for family reasons: reuniting mothers with children, brothers with sisters, grandparents with grandchildren. In the U.S., the opposite is true. Only 13% of green cards last year were doled out for economic reasons, while two-thirds were for family reunions. When Nahed Nenshi became the first Muslim mayor of a major Canadian city in 2010, he shattered Calgary's "redneck" stereotype. “When I was running for office, it was only people who were not from here who said ‘Whoa, is Calgary ready for a mayor like that?’” he says. “The people in Calgary just said, ‘Ah, it's a kid from the East End. We know him.’"Canada’s real challenge, says Nenshi, is ensuring the economic and social integration of immigrants once they are living in the country. “It's not about burkas and kirpans. It's about saying to an engineer who was trained in Iran or China, how can we get you working as an engineer instead of a janitor as quickly as possible?” he says. “These are very serious challenges. And we haven't got it right. But I would much prefer we focus our energies there rather than on these meaningless culture war discussions that occasionally crop up ... because those don't make a difference in people's lives.” The public and Parliament in Canada generally support continued immigration. “Immigration is unambiguously good for the economy. We know that those folks come, they invest here, they create jobs, they work here,” says Nenshi. “There's not much of a policy debate on that in Canada." While the prime minister of Great Britain, the former president of France and the chancellor of Germany have all declared that in their context multiculturalism has failed, that's not so in Canada, says Nenshi. “I'm not here to question their reality. It's their reality,” he says. “But I think it's important for us Canadians, and particularly for Calgarians, to really tell a story loudly and proudly about a place where it works, where diversity works, where multiculturalism works, where pluralism works. It ain’t rocket science.” [/quote] [h2]FUTURE IN THE U.S.[/h2] Canada and also Australia now have smart immigration policies that take in talented foreigners who have skills the country needs and determination and drive to succeed. As a result, they have transformed themselves into immigrant countries, with a foreign-born population that is higher than the United States. Australia, which only 15 years ago had strong strains of nativism and xenophobia dominating its political culture, now has more than a quarter of its population as foreign born – double America’s share – and is thriving because of the economic growth and cultural diversity. Canada's foreign-born population is almost 20%; the U.S. is 13%, just a little higher than Great Britain's. Related: Why American needs immigration The United States is not the world's only – nor the largest – immigrant society anymore. And that will have consequences economically, culturally and in other ways, says Fareed Zakaria: [quote]It's a sad state, because the U.S. remains a model for the world. It is the global melting pot, the place where a universal nation is being created. We may not do immigration better than everyone else anymore, but we do assimilation better than anyone else. People from all over the world come to this country and, almost magically, become Americans. They - I should say we - come to the country with drive and dedication and over time develop a fierce love for America. This infusion of talent, hard work and patriotism has kept the country vital for the past two centuries. And if we can renew it, it will keep America vital in the 21st century as well.[/quote][/quote] Source: [url]http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2012/06/10/immigration-lessons-for-the-u-s-from-around-the-world/?hpt=hp_c1[/url]

It's that hopeful dream that keeps me in this country. And honestly, it's not that bad compared to other places anyway.

None of these are really that applicable, the USA has an extremely unique case. Land border with a failing state, and a backwards trade issue are not similar to say, the Japanese and their xenophobia or France and the Algerians.

[QUOTE=Zambies!;36279980]None of these are really that applicable, the USA has an extremely unique case. Land border with a failing state, and a backwards trade issue are not similar to say, the Japanese and their xenophobia or France and the Algerians.[/QUOTE] This.

Multiculturalism is a failure in europe and should be stopped as it's for all the wrong reasons. The european union is one huge failure and a joke and the cause for so much upset with the mass-amounts of immigration from third world countries. I vote UKIP to get out of the EU and shut the uk's borders for 5 years so we can sort out all these issues. America should so the same because of the huge tide of illegal immigrants they have.

[QUOTE=BloodRayne;36280083]Multiculturalism is a failure in europe and should be stopped as it's for all the wrong reasons. The european union is one huge failure and a joke and the cause for so much upset with the mass-amounts of immigration from third world countries. I vote UKIP to get out of the EU and shut the uk's borders for 5 years so we can sort out all these issues. America should so the same because of the huge tide of illegal immigrants they have.[/QUOTE] Do you have any reasons for this, other than a speech from the UKiP handbook? Multiculturalism hasn't failed. Indians, Pakistanis and black communities have fully integrated into British society. The recent influx of Polish, albanians, etc, will be forgotten about in a few decades, just as the oppression of black groups has (Mostly) disappeared in most cases.

The Japanese are an island nation who isn't producing enough babies to offset their xenophobia. when you make multiculturalism an actual goal, it's not surprising at all that people don't integrate into the native culture. I've heard that Canada takes a whole lot of political refugees as well, but nothing to say bout them really. Like Zambies said, the 'hot-button issue' for America is [i]illegal[/i] immigration.

[QUOTE=Zambies!;36279980]None of these are really that applicable, the USA has an extremely unique case. Land border with a failing state, and a backwards trade issue are not similar to say, the Japanese and their xenophobia or France and the Algerians.[/QUOTE]It also does not help that any time immigration is brought up it always is about the illegal side of things and never about the legal side. If we talked about it from the standpoint of improving legal immigration the debate would be much more mature. Basically all immigration arguments in the US come down to: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=768h3Tz4Qik[/media]

[QUOTE=BloodRayne;36280083]Multiculturalism is a failure in europe and should be stopped as it's for all the wrong reasons. The european union is one huge failure and a joke and the cause for so much upset with the mass-amounts of immigration from third world countries. I vote UKIP to get out of the EU and shut the uk's borders for 5 years so we can sort out all these issues. America should so the same because of the huge tide of illegal immigrants they have.[/QUOTE] wrong

[QUOTE=BloodRayne;36280083]Multiculturalism is a failure in europe[/QUOTE] there have been multiple cultures in Europe since neolithic europe so unless you can pinpoint exactly the time it became a failure, i'd be very careful. and as for the european union being a failure, where's your evidence to suggest that Europe would have been better off without the EU?

[quote]Just why is Canada so ready to accept immigrants with open arms? Because it has to be. The nation is sparsely populated, has a low birth rate, and needs immigrants for population growth – and economic growth. In Canada, almost two-thirds of permanent visas last year were given for economic needs – Canada's economic needs, that is.[/quote] The US doesn't have those problems as far as I know, we don't have a need for immigrants to come work here in large numbers like Canada does. In the past we thrived because of massive scale immigration, but that doesn't seem to be as needed anymore. Not to say we should completely halt it, that'd be silly.

[QUOTE=Political Gamer;36280514]It also does not help that any time immigration is brought up it always is about the illegal side of things and never about the legal side. If we talked about it from the standpoint of improving legal immigration the debate would be much more mature. Basically all immigration arguments in the US come down to: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=768h3Tz4Qik[/media][/QUOTE] It really doesn't; many educated border state citizens have a different problem with the immigration (illegal to say) It's simply that they won't integrate. They don't subscribe to that "rich american culture". They're not immigrating, they're transforming. Some areas of the south west might as well be mexico with how similar the two are. When all of our forefathers immigrated they kept their national identity; but they integrated. They learned English, they paid their bills, they did everything they could to live that American dream. The illegals simply don't do that. (At the very least the majority. I don't doubt there are illegals who hopped in desperation to actually live the american dream)

[QUOTE=Sottalytober;36282280]It really doesn't; many educated border state citizens have a different problem with the immigration (illegal to say) It's simply that they won't integrate. They don't subscribe to that "rich american culture". They're not immigrating, they're transforming. Some areas of the south west might as well be mexico with how similar the two are. When all of our forefathers immigrated they kept their national identity; but they integrated. They learned English, they paid their bills, they did everything they could to live that American dream. The illegals simply don't do that. (At the very least the majority. I don't doubt there are illegals who hopped in desperation to actually live the american dream)[/QUOTE] They all do sooner or later. The same complaints have been made about every influx of immigrants. In the town that I moved to, there are still a few old signs and posters in Swedish. Hell, the town's icon is a giant teacup water tower reading: "Valkommen till Lindstrom," and local businesses there still celebrate someone named Karl Oskar. The only thing unique about immigrants today is that there are more of them that are illegal. We are handling our immigration problem in the most ass backwards way possible. I married a woman from Guatemala and it took me $4000 just to get her a green card [I]after[/I] marrying her, even though we've been dating for years and she speaks perfect English and is more "with it" than I am most of the time. We make it almost impossible for anyone in a normal third world situation to come here legally, and people coming here legally means that they pay taxes, potentially create businesses and join our work force and military. On top of that, we don't attack the people who hire illegal immigrants, even though that would pretty much eliminate any reason for them to come here.

Europe is the birthplace of Western civilization, so I'm concerned about immigrants eroding the West and morphing Europe into something different. Canada does seem to have a smart system. They only let the immigrants that meet their needs to come in. It seems better to have immigrants that offer something rather than just be a welfare leeches.

[QUOTE=cqbcat;36282918]Europe is the birthplace of Western civilization, so I'm concerned about immigrants eroding the West and morphing Europe into something different. Canada does seem to have a smart system. They only let the immigrants that meet their needs to come in. It seems better to have immigrants that offer something rather than just be a welfare leeches.[/QUOTE] But surely letting any immigrant in 'morphs Europe into something different', as successful immigrants bring their families and culture with them.

[QUOTE=cqbcat;36282918] Canada does seem to have a smart system. They only let the immigrants that meet their needs to come in. It seems better to have immigrants that offer something rather than just be a welfare leeches.[/QUOTE] Canada doesn't have massive droves of people quite literally swimming across rivers to into their country every day whether anyone else thinks it's okay or not. I think immigration is quite fine but when people make no attempt to at least try to learn a major language of the area they live in it's going to upset people when they come into the country.

[QUOTE] Canada and also Australia now have smart immigration policies that take in talented foreigners who have skills the country needs and determination and drive to succeed. [/QUOTE] "smart" Yeah okay. Australia's smart immigration policy is put all immigrants in detention for an indefinite period, usually offshore until they can be sorted. Indefinite has lasted from two months to several years.

The UK uses a point system as well, I believe, although how well that works I don't know. Migrants from outside the EU are a boon to the country though - they have no recourse to public funds, but still have to pay tax.

Migrants from outside the eu: Not the same culture as resident place. Tend to send most of their money home to their country (Shrinking ours and giving to theirs essentially) Typically seen as cheap labour due to lack of experience\qualifications\language barrier.

[QUOTE=BloodRayne;36283937] Tend to send most of their money home to their country (Shrinking ours and giving to theirs essentially) [/QUOTE] that's not how economics work.

[QUOTE=MrEndangered;36280133]Do you have any reasons for this, other than a speech from the UKiP handbook? Multiculturalism hasn't failed. Indians, Pakistanis and black communities have fully integrated into British society. The recent influx of Polish, albanians, etc, will be forgotten about in a few decades, just as the oppression of black groups has (Mostly) disappeared in most cases.[/QUOTE] TBH I can't imagine a British corner shop [I]not[/I] being run by an indian, to me it just feels so [I]un[/I]-british :v:

The only problem I have with immigrants is when they move here and immediately take offence to the way we dress, beliefs, daily conduct, and so on. I don't wish to pick out a specific group but the recent Muslim immigrants to Canada are terrible. I was walking with my girlfriend down the street and they started throwing things at us for her dressing with shorts and it's a common thing to happen in my town. It's not rare to see them getting arrested down town because a woman talked back to them in a bar and they slapped her and so forth, but if we actually write about it they claim racism and hate. They deny you service at a restaurant if women aren't covered up enough and I've even seen signs that say "Sharia Law Zone" in a few neighbourhoods. It's fine to bring your beliefs and a bit of your heritage to Canada, we're okay with it. But if you want to make my country just like the one you left get the fuck out and go home.