• The Koch Bros assault on Electric Vehicles begins today
    54 replies, posted
[media]https://twitter.com/FortuneMagazine/status/706881613225988096[/media][media]https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/700583378328784896[/media][media]https://twitter.com/FortuneMagazine/status/706893768608325632[/media] Article covering the details of the campaign from a little under a month ago: [QUOTE]The oil and gas industry may have thought it had killed the electric car, but sales -- boosted by generous government subsidies -- rose dramatically between 2010 and 2014, and energy giants are worried the thing may have come back to life. Time to kill it again. A new group that's being cobbled together with fossil fuel backing hopes to spend about $10 million dollars per year to boost petroleum-based transportation fuels and attack government subsidies for electric vehicles, according to refining industry sources familiar with the plan. A Koch Industries board member and a veteran Washington energy lobbyist are working quietly to fund and launch the new advocacy outfit. Koch Industries, the nation's second-largest privately held corporation, is an energy and industrial conglomerate with $115 billion in annual revenues that is controlled by the multibillionaire brothers -- and prolific conservative donors -- Charles and David Koch. James Mahoney, a confidante of the brothers and member of their company's board, has teamed up with lobbyist Charlie Drevna, who until last year helmed the American Fuel and Petrochemical Manufacturers, for preliminary talks with several energy giants about funding the new pro-petroleum fuels group. ... Once launched, the new group is expected to use paid and earned media to push its pro-petroleum transportation messages, and do research to bolster the cause. “I think they (are) approaching all the major independent refiners,” added a second industry source, who requested anonymity because he had not been authorized to speak about the private discussions. The group’s broad mission will be to “make the public aware of all the benefits of petroleum-based transportation fuels,” he explained, adding that “the current administration has a bias toward phasing out” these fuels. The source also stressed that the new initiative is partly attributable to “electric vehicles and the subsidies for them." "They’re worried about state and community subsidies," he added. "In 20 years, electric vehicles could have a substantial foothold in the U.S. market.” ... Industry analysts and conservatives familiar with Koch world say the new initiative seems to fit the playbook that advocacy outfits backed by the Koch network have deployed in recent years to fight solar and wind power, battles that are fueled by ideology mixed with bottom line concerns. “The Kochs have invested heavily in a pugnacious defense of fossil fuel consumption,” said one conservative energy analyst. “They’ve done this in the electricity sector, and as the debate shifts to transportation they’re behaving true to form.” Other energy analysts point out that electric vehicle usage is likely to accelerate before long, which could catch a number of energy companies off guard. “Electric vehicle adoption started slowly, but it certainly is going to follow an exponential growth trajectory,” said Varun Sivaram, an energy and environment fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. “Once electric vehicle adoption hits a critical mass, I think it will take refiners, petroleum producers and automakers by surprise.” More broadly, some veteran energy lobbyists note that attacks on electric vehicle subsidies could backfire. [/QUOTE] [URL="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/koch-electric-vehicles_us_56c4d63ce4b0b40245c8cbf6"]Source[/URL]
[QUOTE=Morgen;49888302][media]https://twitter.com/FortuneMagazine/status/706893768608325632[/media] [/QUOTE] I'm dying.
Why are the Koch brothers so awful, why do some men want to watch the world burn so badly?
The Koch brothers talking about paying subsidies to rich people. Holy fuck you can't make this shit up.
[QUOTE=Killer900;49888392]Why are the Koch brothers so awful, why do some men want to watch the world burn so badly?[/QUOTE] They're fucking libertarians that have had silver spoons up their ass ever since their daddy struck oil, and he read them ayan rand as a bed time story.
[QUOTE=Killer900;49888392]Why are the Koch brothers so awful, why do some men want to watch the world burn so badly?[/QUOTE] One is 80 and the other is 75. They don't care what happens to the world past the next 10 years or so.
The irony is going to kill me. [img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cc9kIv5WEAEhkD8.jpg:large[/img]
[QUOTE=Sableye;49888420]They're fucking libertarians that have had silver spoons up their ass ever since their daddy struck oil, and he read them ayan rand as a bed time story.[/QUOTE] To be fair, what else would you read to put someone to sleep?
[QUOTE=Killer900;49888392]Why are the Koch brothers so awful, why do some men want to watch the world burn so badly?[/QUOTE] Koch Sr made his fortune through Adolf Hitler and Stalin. They felt bad about profiting off of nazism and communism and so became neocons. or they're just selfish fucks. Whatever.
[QUOTE=Mingebox;49888436]To be fair, what else would you read to put someone to sleep?[/QUOTE] Well we could start with the US tax code which they've written, maybe read some bills from ALEC which they've written, or listen to the desperate pleas of the poor that they've created [editline]7th March 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Rangergxi;49888451]Koch Sr made his fortune through Adolf Hitler and Stalin. They felt bad about profiting off of nazism and communism and so became neocons. or they're just selfish fucks. Whatever.[/QUOTE] Oh ya I always forget about that, their father had no morals whatsoever, and passed a massive fortune onto his sons whom he raised with no morals either
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;49888425]The irony is going to kill me. [img]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cc9kIv5WEAEhkD8.jpg:large[/img][/QUOTE] apparently the top 20% buys $30,000 cars... [IMG]http://www.nissanusa.com/content/dam/nissan/vehicles/2016/leaf/colors-photos/360/exterior/qab/01.jpg[/IMG]
I really can't wait until these geriatric fucks kick the bucket, have they [I]ever[/I] done an even small amount of good? All I know them for is being the ultimate sociopathic capitalists
this is the latest step... however this may backfire really easily.
At least the comments on Fortune are tearing them apart.
[thumb]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cc9kIv5WEAEhkD8.jpg:large[/thumb] That's like the concept of wage slavery, didn't know the koch brothers were comrades
[QUOTE=Killer900;49888392]Why are the Koch brothers so awful, why do some men want to watch the world burn so badly?[/QUOTE] because oil burns great and they sell oil
[QUOTE=Killer900;49888392]Why are the Koch brothers so awful, why do some men want to watch the world burn so badly?[/QUOTE] As long as it burns petroleum
Their opening salvo: the power wall will never pay for itself. My rebuttle, a diesel backup generator will also never pay for itself.
Instead of them being smart and trying to get a monopoly in electric energy they're spending to stop electric energy?
[QUOTE=Exploders;49889216]Instead of them being smart and trying to get a monopoly in electric energy they're spending to stop electric energy?[/QUOTE] Why compete elsewhere when you don't have to?
[QUOTE=Exploders;49889216]Instead of them being smart and trying to get a monopoly in electric energy they're spending to stop electric energy?[/QUOTE] That's because they're not smart. They're just senile old men who don't understand that it isn't the early 1900's anymore.
[QUOTE=Exploders;49889216]Instead of them being smart and trying to get a monopoly in electric energy they're spending to stop electric energy?[/QUOTE] Sadly the bulk of their fortune comes from refinery equipment, they act as if the electric car is going to make that disappear overnight, they can burn electric cars and not care because they aren't going to even be around in 20 years [editline]7th March 2016[/editline] Well the good news is they will have to fight the big auto lobby which GM, and Ford are bringing 30k electric cars to market this year and factor the federal credits into their marketing. GM's bolt for example has the 200 mile range and is going to debue around 30,000$ so they will fight for it
[QUOTE=Morgen;49888422]One is 80 and the other is 75. They don't care what happens to the world past the next 10 years or so.[/QUOTE] They need to hurry up and die. But they're awful human beings, so of course they'll live to be 90-100 years old. Fate likes to fuck us over that way frequently.
While the irony is hilarious I completely agree that we should not be subsidizing the cost of purchasing a luxury sedan like the Model S regardless of whether or not it's electric. People who can afford that car can afford it just as easily without a few thousand dollars of tax credits. Subsidize the development of an electric vehicle charging infrastructure instead.
Look on the brightside. These guys are scared for the future of oil, this means even they can see electric has a future.
[QUOTE=Sableye;49889307]Sadly the bulk of their fortune comes from refinery equipment, they act as if the electric car is going to make that disappear overnight, they can burn electric cars and not care because they aren't going to even be around in 20 years [editline]7th March 2016[/editline] Well the good news is they will have to fight the big auto lobby which GM, and Ford are bringing 30k electric cars to market this year and factor the federal credits into their marketing. GM's bolt for example has the 200 mile range and is going to debue around 30,000$ so they will fight for it[/QUOTE] Tesla's model 3 starts pre-orders end of march for $35,000ish I think with similar range in base configuration. Nissan Leaf better pick up its game here quick or its going to get blown away.
some men just want to watch the world burn fossil fuels
[QUOTE=Nautsabes;49889945]some men just want to watch the world burn fossil fuels[/QUOTE] I hope someone fracks their graves
[QUOTE=Zeke129;49889492]While the irony is hilarious I completely agree that we should not be subsidizing the cost of purchasing a luxury sedan like the Model S regardless of whether or not it's electric. People who can afford that car can afford it just as easily without a few thousand dollars of tax credits. Subsidize the development of an electric vehicle charging infrastructure instead.[/QUOTE] The US incentive is sort of weak. $7500 federal tax credit is hard to make use of unless you are wealthy. Correct me if I'm wrong but if I remember how US federal tax works you are looking at around $65k annual income required to fully use it. So incentinces are already aimed at the wealthy. Some states do offer a straight up rebate though. The incentives have been shown to have a minimal influence on Model S sales. They should really start aiming more at the middle class with incentives. The people buying the upcoming Model 3 will be influenced more by economics. If you wanted charging related incentives I think it would be better to create incentives for home chargers for both home owners and landlords. Sometimes you hear about someone buying an EV and having a landlord with a prejudice against them and not allowing a charger to be installed. A major benefit to having an EV over an ICE car is home charging. It's not like its complicated or requires a proprietary charger. Just install a dryer outlet near where you park the car and every EV should be able to use it. A regular us socket isn't really viable for charging, will max out at about 6 mph of charge.
[QUOTE=Mingebox;49888436]To be fair, what else would you read to put someone to sleep?[/QUOTE] You joke about this, but some clown seriously suggested I listen to an audio version of "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal" by Rand and that shit was like auditory Benadryl, never failed to put me to sleep within 20 minutes or less. [editline]8th March 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Starlight 456;49888590]I really can't wait until these geriatric fucks kick the bucket, have they [I]ever[/I] done an even small amount of good? All I know them for is being the ultimate sociopathic capitalists[/QUOTE] Would it frighten you to know that the foundation they run also donates regularly to PBS?
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