Australian solders left for dead in Afghanistan by Dutch Apache helicopters - Polidicks

[quote]AUSTRALIAN special forces troops were left for dead by two Dutch attack helicopters during a deadly ambush in Afghanistan. [b]When the smoke cleared, one American was dead and seven SAS soldiers and two sappers lay badly wounded.[/b] A combined Australian, American and Afghan patrol was under ambush from up to 150 enemy fighters when the two attack choppers arrived at a nearby American base. As the troops were pounded by enemy mortar, small arms and rocket-propelled grenades near the village of Khaz Oruzgan, they thought salvation had arrived in the form of the Apache helicopters. The patrol's air strike co-ordinator told the Dutch pilots by radio: "We're in an absolute doozy of a s--- fight. We need your assistance as we're taking casualties." [b]But the pilots refused to drop under their "safe" height of 5000m, despite the fact Apaches are armour-plated and designed to operate under heavy fire at low altitude.[/b] In his book SAS Sniper, to be released next week, former SAS soldier and ex-Royal Marine Rob Maylor reveals intricate details of the ambush and the lack of help from the Dutch. [b]"They wouldn't open up on the Taliban for fear they might draw some fire themselves," said Maylor, who suffered serious shrapnel wounds during the battle. "I honestly thought that we wouldn't get out of there alive. If the bad guys had got any closer it would have been all over for us."[/b] Another SAS soldier marked targets for the choppers using a machine gun to kick up dust clouds close to enemy positions. [b]"They still wouldn't engage. SG (the air strike co-ordinator) had had enough so he told them, 'If you're not going to engage then you might as well f--- off', and they did. Cheers boys."[/b] The book adds weight to the view of soldiers on the front line that they need more firepower - including one whose email appeal for better back-up was revealed by the Herald Sun. One of the specific complaints in the email concerned a lack of helicopter support during another deadly battle that claimed Private Jared Mackinney. Australia asked the departing Dutch to keep five Apaches in Tarin Kowt until mid-November because Australia's Tiger attack choppers wouldn't be ready until mid-2011. Maylor, who retired in January, said yesterday he was surprised the Dutch Apaches refused to fight. "They do have very tight rules of engagement, but we needed all the help we could get," he said. American and when he donned the lid it was full of blood that spilled over his face. Trooper Mark Donaldson won the Victoria Cross for Gallantry during the ambush when he rescued a wounded interpreter from the battlefield.[/quote] source: [url]http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/australian-solders-left-for-dead-in-afghanistan-by-dutch-apache-helicopters/story-e6freon6-1225941994956[/url] Way to go, don't get those Apaches dinged up now! they have to look pretty for the cameras...

what the fucking fuck.

Dear Netherlands: Congratulations. Remind us of this the next time we attempt to save your ass. We'll make sure to reconsider. Sincerely, Canada

So, a retired soldier publishes a book, makes an inflammatory press release about how some Dutch helicopter pilots, in all probability, did what they were trained to do, and an Australian rag writes an even more inflammatory article about it. Despite what they'd have you believe Apache helicopters are not designed to withstand RPGs

RPG-7s are SHITTY anti-air rockets. If anything the Apaches still could of taken some of the heat.

[QUOTE=TH89;25559339]So, a retired soldier publishes a book, makes an inflammatory press release about how some Dutch helicopter pilots, in all probability, did what they were trained to do, and an Australian rag writes an even more inflammatory article about it. Despite what they'd have you believe Apache helicopters are not designed to withstand RPGs[/QUOTE] RPG's aren't designed to take down helicopters either.

Those Apaches should've dropped and raised some more hell. In response to the RPG debate, those rockets are really damned inaccurate. That and Apaches can move pretty darn quick. I know that they can't withstand RPGs, but come on!

[QUOTE=MegaChalupa;25559383]RPG's aren't designed to take down helicopters either.[/QUOTE] Life is not like Modern Warfare, firing an RPG at an extreme angle such as up at a helicopter is a no-no, the back pressure from the exhaust will kill you, they need a curved exhaust tube that the Russians made for the purpose, I doubt every insurgent and his brother has one, so the Apaches would have to be very, very low to the ground.

[QUOTE=TH89;25559339]So, a retired soldier publishes a book, makes an inflammatory press release about how some Dutch helicopter pilots, in all probability, did what they were trained to do, and an Australian rag writes an even more inflammatory article about it. Despite what they'd have you believe Apache helicopters are not designed to withstand RPGs[/QUOTE] That's no reason at all to puss out and leave your allies for (possible) dead in a situation like that.

:australia:

[QUOTE=XxPsychoxX;25559489]Life is not like Modern Warfare, firing an RPG at an extreme angle such as up at a helicopter is a no-no, the back pressure from the exhaust will kill you, they need a curved exhaust tube that the Russians made for the purpose, I doubt every insurgent and his brother has one, so the Apaches would have to be very, very low to the ground.[/QUOTE] Yeah, which is why I said that RPG's aren't designed for taking down helicopters.

[img]http://www.howardelectronics.com/amtech/images/63-37-031.jpg[/img] those poor, poor solders

its probably too hard to control a helicopter when youre wearing clogs

[QUOTE=MegaChalupa;25559383]RPG's aren't designed to take down helicopters either.[/QUOTE] Tell that to the Somalis. [IMG]http://imgur.com/XfsEl.jpg[/IMG]

Yea, they use 'em for anti-air. It's possible, TH. What we're trying to say is that it's impractical and even they know that.

Cowards, nothing more.

Well that's nice of them isn't it.

Bastards, they left men dying down there.

Just realized it said one American dead. That pisses me off more than anything else. We spend so much money sending troops over there, maintaining bases in their country, and sending them their attack choppers. Then, they turn around and screw us when we need help from said helos.

Hitting a moving air target with an RPG-7 is almost impossible. It would be pure luck. The Apaches should have stayed around. At least for intimidation if nothing else.

[QUOTE=Libertas;25559232]Dear Netherlands: Congratulations. Remind us of this the next time we attempt to save your ass. We'll make sure to reconsider. Sincerely, Canada[/QUOTE] Good thing you don't have anything to say about it. Pilots in question were most likely following protocol. [QUOTE=rosar0980;25559983]Just realized it said one American dead. That pisses me off more than anything else. We spend so much money sending troops over there, maintaining bases in their country, and sending them their attack choppers. Then, they turn around and screw us when we need help from said helos.[/QUOTE] Is it something of any countries concern apart from the US that you spend so much money to send troops over there? Also, 'sending' should be changed to 'selling'.

[QUOTE=TH89;25559658]Tell that to the Somalis. [img_thumb]http://imgur.com/XfsEl.jpg[/img_thumb][/QUOTE] Low, slow flying, big ass Blackhawks flying in predictable patrol-support patterns are not the same as narrower, more maneuverable Apaches in an attack pattern. Apaches are designed for ground suppression, they would have had no issues dealing with shitty unguided AT rockets.

[QUOTE=Victis;25560065]Good thing you don't have anything to say about it. Pilots in question were most likely following protocol.[/QUOTE] What's worse, getting yelled at by command, or knowing you left men to die? If they had simply attacked nothing bad would've happened to the pilots.

[QUOTE=Victis;25560065]Good thing you don't have anything to say about it. Pilots in question were most likely following protocol.[/QUOTE] Then it's a problem with the Dutch instead of just these pilots. If your allies being shot at isn't enough to satisfy your rules of engagement then there's something wrong with it.

What a bunch of Dutchbags.

[QUOTE=Sottalytober;25560125]What's worse, getting yelled at by command, or knowing you left men to die? If they had simply attacked nothing bad would've happened to the pilots.[/QUOTE] It's impossible to know the outcome of any similar battle, you people all state that 'they could easily have dodged the rocketfire' or 'they could easily have saved all of those people' or blame them for cowardice. But how do you know this? are you an apache-pilot? do you even serve in the military? You don't know what the situation at the time was, all you have to go on is a article.

This is why Project Reality player's shouldn't join the military.

This isn't the first time the Dutch have been seen as assholes in A-stan. But wow.

It was probably their government issued marijuana rations! :downs:

[QUOTE=JaegerMonster;25560304]This isn't the first time the Dutch have been seen as assholes in A-stan. But wow.[/QUOTE] Not sure, but it might have been due to the dutch being really against going to afghanistan in the first place, all the general populace wanted was to get their boys back from afghanistan, Now rather than Later