Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK) blow up a bus in eastern Turkey, killing 14 police officers; Prime Min - Polidicks

[quote]At least 14 police officers have been killed and several others wounded in a bomb attack on a Turkish police minibus in the country's east. Turkish officials blamed fighters from the Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) for Tuesday's attack, which targeted a bus carrying police working in the Igdir region, at the Dilucu border gate marking the border with Azerbaijan. Turkey's security forces launched an operation against Kurdish fighters after the attack, the Anatolia state news agency reported. The attack came two days after at least 16 Turkish troops were killed in an attack on a convoy of armoured vehicles in the southeastern province of Hakkari. [img]http://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/imagecache/mbdxxlarge/mritems/Images/2015/9/8/62599db05da3400dac249ff7670c3e97_18.jpg[/img] [/quote] [url]http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/09/police-officers-killed-bus-attack-turkey-east-150908071619413.html[/url] [quote]Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu has vowed to "wipe out" Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) fighters from their mountain strongholds after 16 soldiers were killed in a rebel attack. [B]"These terrorists must be wiped out from the mountains; whatever happens they must be wiped out," he said in televised comments in Ankara. "The mountains of this country must not be handed over to terrorists. Every effort will be undertaken," he said.[/B] The army said earlier that 16 Turkish soldiers were killed in a roadside bomb attack on Sunday on two military vehicles in southeast Turkey. It was the deadliest attack by the outlawed PKK in years. [B]"If someone wants to push Turkey into a ring of fire, let it be known that the greatest strength is our unity around the security of our nation."[/B] Davutoglu said the soldiers had been carrying out mine-clearing operations.[/quote] [url]http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/09/turkey-pm-vows-wipe-pkk-fighters-attack-150908013152166.html[/url] [quote]An angry crowd has attacked the Ankara headquarters of Turkey's main pro-Kurdish party, in a night of nationalist violence across the country. The demonstrations on Tuesday came after several deadly attacks - attributed to the Kurdish armed group PKK - against Turkish soldiers and police officers. Dozens of nationalist protesters marched on the headquarters of the pro-Kurdish Peoples' Democratic Party (HDP) in Ankara on Tuesday evening, throwing stones and ripping down the sign outside, witnesses said. [B]"Our headquarters in under attack but the police is not performing its duties," the party said on its official Twitter feed.[/B] [B]Smoke was seen coming from the building[/B], an AFP news agency photographer said, although police eventually dispersed the demonstrators. Pictures posted on social media suggested the interior of the building had been badly damaged in the attack with some offices completely gutted by fire. [B]Nationalists accuse the HDP of being the political wing of the armed group Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK)[/B], which has carried out a series of deadly attacks that have killed dozens of members of the security forces in recent days. The HDP denies this is the case. In the southern resort city of Alanya, the local HDP headquarters was set on fire, sending yellow flames into the night sky, CNN-Turk reported. [B]Reports said 2,000 people carrying the Turkish flag had marched on the building, with the fire eventually doused by the fire brigade.[/B] [img]http://www.aljazeera.com/mritems/Images/2015/9/8/8ec57a06997e400d95296f367cf5edff_18.jpg[/img] [/quote] [url]http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/09/turkish-nationalists-attack-pro-kurdish-party-hq-150908224917378.html[/url]

[quote]Dozens of nationalist protesters marched on the headquarters of the pro-Kurdish Peoples' Democratic Party[/quote] Racist fucks. Get upset with the PKK for this (Not that I'm too torn up about it), not the HDP for essentially sharing nationality and at best, somewhat-similar political leanings.

[QUOTE=soccerskyman;48643712]Racist fucks. Get upset with the PKK for this ([B]Not that I'm too torn up about it[/B]), not the HDP for essentially sharing nationality and at best, somewhat-similar political leanings.[/QUOTE] You're not upset that 16 people were killed in a terror attack?

[QUOTE=Broguts;48643772]You're not upset that 16 people were killed in a terror attack?[/QUOTE] Are you upset about any death happening in half across the world?

Oh good. Now it's, what, a 4-way conflict? Everyone has their own agenda, and it seems they're prepared to fuck the Middle East permanently to achieve it...

[QUOTE=soccerskyman;48643712]Racist fucks. Get upset with the PKK for this (Not that I'm too torn up about it), not the HDP for essentially sharing nationality and at best, somewhat-similar political leanings.[/QUOTE]Really? So do you hate Turks or something? Here's why this is bad: A: it's a terrorist attack, I shouldn't have to explain to you why 14 innocent people getting killed is a bad thing. If you need that explained to you commit yourself. B: any chance of a peaceful transition into a Kurdish nation in Syria and/or Iraq is [i]completely fucked over[/i] by these socialist cunts.

[QUOTE=soccerskyman;48643712]Racist fucks. Get upset with the PKK for this (Not that I'm too torn up about it), not the HDP for essentially sharing nationality and at best, somewhat-similar political leanings.[/QUOTE] HDP is PKK's political wing so. Still, they should have protested peacefully rather than burning down the building since chaos and civil unrest is what PKK wants.

Turks just want the PKK gone, regardless if it's under their jurisdiction or not.

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;48644242]Really? So do you hate Turks or something? Here's why this is bad: A: it's a terrorist attack, I shouldn't have to explain to you why 14 innocent people getting killed is a bad thing. If you need that explained to you commit yourself. B: any chance of a peaceful transition into a Kurdish nation in Syria and/or Iraq is [i]completely fucked over[/i] by these socialist cunts.[/QUOTE] They were police which Erdogan use to opress the kurd's in turkey,turkey has done what amounts to declaring war on their kurdish minority several times during the last 50 years. Erdogan is cracking down especially hard on them now, if you view this from the pkk's side the police are enemy combatants in a conflict against the kurdish state so that would make them a fair target.

the pkk are terrorists. they want people deadeded deaded

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;48644242]Really? So do you hate Turks or something? Here's why this is bad: A: it's a terrorist attack, I shouldn't have to explain to you why 14 innocent people getting killed is a bad thing. If you need that explained to you commit yourself. B: any chance of a peaceful transition into a Kurdish nation in Syria and/or Iraq is [i]completely fucked over[/i] by these socialist cunts.[/QUOTE] A. Cops are not innocent civilians. They are agents of the state, one representing primarily non-Kurds. B. Its fucked over by Turkish nationalism/integralism and Western blessing for it. It is fucked over long before any of this, when Kurdistan's future is based on the whim and consent of ruling powers. This is the reason why Kurds became marxist revolutionaries in the first place and sought international socialist aid, because the ruling states and the political center weren't giving them jack, and they still aren't. Turkey should just be partitioned, along with Iraq. [Img]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a0/TreatyOfSevres_(corrected).PNG[/IMG] [Img]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/53/Turkish_presidential_election_2014.png[/img]

[QUOTE=AhoyMate;48644331]HDP is PKK's political wing so. Still, they should have protested peacefully rather than burning down the building since chaos and civil unrest is what PKK wants.[/QUOTE] Doesn't the HDP explicitly distance itself from the violence the PKK commits?

[QUOTE=Clavus;48645592]Doesn't the HDP explicitly distance itself from the violence the PKK commits?[/QUOTE] Not really, they haven't condemned any of pkk's terror acts yet. Plus their leader's brother is an active member of pkk.

[QUOTE=Conscript;48645563]A. Cops are not innocent civilians. They are agents of the state, one representing primarily non-Kurds. [/QUOTE] Cops are not soldiers, either. The are not hired with the chance of being killed by a bomb in mind. The purpose of the police is to apprehend criminals and at times prevent crime, not fight on battlefields with the chance of death looming over always. Not saying that being a police officer is risk free, but to throw them in as "not civilians" is retarded.

[QUOTE=Conscript;48645563]A. Cops are not innocent civilians. They are agents of the state, one representing primarily non-Kurds.[/QUOTE] Would you consider anyone who participates in the political process an agent of the state as well?

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;48646128]Cops are not soldiers, either. The are not hired with the chance of being killed by a bomb in mind. The purpose of the police is to apprehend criminals and at times prevent crime, not fight on battlefields with the chance of death looming over always. Not saying that being a police officer is risk free, but to throw them in as "not civilians" is retarded.[/QUOTE] Would you argue the same about Gestapo or KGB or Mossad? Turkish police doesn't have much of an international fame but that doesn't mean police can't be used for state sanctioned discrimination and oppression.

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;48646269]Would you argue the same about Gestapo or KGB or Mossad? Turkish police doesn't have much of an international fame but that doesn't mean police can be used for state sanctioned discrimination and oppression.[/QUOTE] For one thing, Mossad isn't a police institute, it's an intelligence service. For another, no, I clearly would not say the same about the Gestapo or KGB but these Turkish police officers were [I]not[/I] a secret police force. [editline]9th September 2015[/editline] All of that is beside my point anyway - police are not soldiers and should not be cast aside as "non civilian" like so.

It's all matter of perspective. Would have the policemen engaged the PKK members with lethal force if they just simply ran into them and found out who they are? They undoubtedly would have. For the PKK members they aren't noncombatants aka civilians.

[QUOTE=Awesomecaek;48646269]Would you argue the same about Gestapo or KGB or Mossad? Turkish police doesn't have much of an international fame but that doesn't mean police can't be used for state sanctioned discrimination and oppression.[/QUOTE] Holy shit, the Turkish police are not a paramilitary organization used for ethnic cleansing or a secret police used for thought control. The Turkish police are police, the cigar is a cigar. How can you even invoke Godwin against the VICTIMS of a terror attack? And another thing: How can most of you want a Kurdistan so badly when I notice many of you are also anti-zionists? Carving a Kurdistan out of Turkey will have a similar effect that carving Israel out of Palestine did, only worse.

[QUOTE=Broguts;48646778]Holy shit, the Turkish police are not a paramilitary organization used for ethnic cleansing or a secret police used for thought control. The Turkish police are police, the cigar is a cigar. How can you even invoke Godwin against the VICTIMS of a terror attack? And another thing: How can most of you want a Kurdistan so badly when I notice many of you are also anti-zionists? Carving a Kurdistan out of Turkey will have a similar effect that carving Israel out of Palestine did, only worse.[/QUOTE] To be fair, the Kurds there are descendants of Kurds that have lived there for hundreds of years. Before 1900, the number of Jews living in Palestine was less than 1% of the entire population. Overwhelming number of Jews living there today are descendants of those who immigrated there.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;48646908]To be fair, the Kurds there are descendants of Kurds that have lived there for hundreds of years. Before 1900, the number of Jews living in Palestine was less than 1% of the entire population. Overwhelming number of Jews living there today are descendants of those who immigrated there.[/QUOTE] So because they're descendants of a people who lived in the area that makes terror attacks ok? Should Moravians bomb the Czechs and Slovaks until they get a Moravia? Should the First Nations Peoples bomb Canada and the U.S. until all their land is restored?

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;48646908]To be fair, the Kurds there are descendants of Kurds that have lived there for hundreds of years. Before 1900, the number of Jews living in Palestine was less than 1% of the entire population. Overwhelming number of Jews living there today are descendants of those who immigrated there.[/QUOTE] Well technically they're descendants of the original Hebrews who migrated into Europe after the Romans genocided them in 70 ad. But then again, we're all descendants of East African apes from a few hundred thousand years ago.

[QUOTE=Explosions;48647034]Well technically they're descendants of the original Hebrews who migrated into Europe after the Romans genocided them in 70 ad. But then again, [B]we're all descendants of East African apes from a few hundred thousand years ago[/B].[/QUOTE] Exactly. We don't need a new nation for every single ethnicity.

[QUOTE=Broguts;48647004]So because they're descendants of a people who lived in the area that makes terror attacks ok? Should Moravians bomb the Czechs and Slovaks until they get a Moravia? Should the First Nations Peoples bomb Canada and the U.S. until all their land is restored?[/QUOTE] I didn't say it was okay in any way shape or form, don't put words in my mouth. I was explaining to you the difference between supporting a Kurdish state while at the same time not supporting Jewish Israel and how it's not a conflict in reasoning. [editline]9th September 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=Explosions;48647034]Well technically they're descendants of the original Hebrews who migrated into Europe after the Romans genocided them in 70 ad. But then again, we're all descendants of East African apes from a few hundred thousand years ago.[/QUOTE] And that's the excuse they used during the 1948 War and prior to that.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;48647145]I didn't say it was okay in any way shape or form, don't put words in my mouth. [B]I was explaining to you the difference between supporting a Kurdish state while at the same time not supporting Jewish Israel and how it's not a conflict in reasoning.[/B] [editline]9th September 2015[/editline] And that's the excuse they used during the 1948 War and prior to that.[/QUOTE] I'm not debating whether they have a right to a country, I'm debating that the outcome will be the same. We will have two adjacent countries that hate each other and want to wipe eachother off the map, only this time one of them is one of the largest powers in the area and the other one would be a a few kilometers in the east.

The Kurds are a very diverse people. If a Kurdish state were formed out of, for example, Northern Iraq, I have much more hopes for it being peaceful than one formed out of Turkey. I can give almost guaranteed certainty that any future Kurdish state will [I]not[/I] be ruled by the PKK.

These guys are dumbasses. Now is not the time to be doing this sort of thing. With the struggle against ISIS going on in that region [i]everyone[/i] is attacking whoever they want. This is as close to a no fucks are given war as you can get. So it would be smart to keep a low profile right now, disappear into the background if you can. No one is going to say anything now against Turkey no matter what they do. We need Turkey's help in Syria. The last thing they needed to do was take an action that screams "Did you forget about us?"

[QUOTE=Broguts;48647004]So because they're descendants of a people who lived in the area that makes terror attacks ok? Should Moravians bomb the Czechs and Slovaks until they get a Moravia? Should the First Nations Peoples bomb Canada and the U.S. until all their land is restored?[/QUOTE] The difference is that if Moravians built up enough local support among the public to secede and split off, the rest of Czech Republic would let them because unlike turkey, we aren't holding them connected by sheer force and domination.

[QUOTE=Broguts;48643772]You're not upset that 16 people were killed in a terror attack?[/QUOTE] The Turkish state's police force used to commit all sorts of atrocious acts against the Kurds and opposing political forces? No, not particularly.

The HDP made major gains in the last Turkish elections and derailed Erdogan's plans to turn Turkey into a presidential republic. Now a second election has been called and it's unclear what impact all this will have on the outcome