[quote][url=http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/28/us-un-assembly-islam-idUSBRE88R1JI20120928](Reuters)[/url] - Muslim leaders were in unison at the United Nations this week arguing that the West was hiding behind its defense of freedom of speech and ignoring cultural sensitivities in the aftermath of anti-Islam slurs that have raised fears of a widening East-West cultural divide.
A video made in California depicting the Prophet Mohammad as a fool sparked the storming of U.S. and other Western embassies in many Islamic countries and a deadly suicide bombing in Afghanistan this month. The crisis deepened when a French magazine published caricatures of the Prophet.
Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said it was time to put an end to the protection of Islamophobia masquerading as the freedom to speak freely.
"Unfortunately, Islamophobia has also become a new form of racism like anti-Semitism. It can no longer be tolerated under the guise of freedom of expression. Freedom does not mean anarchy," he told the 193-nation U.N. General Assembly on Friday.
Egypt's newly elected Islamist president, Mohamed Mursi, voiced similar sentiments in his speech on Wednesday.
"Egypt respects freedom of expression, freedom of expression that is not used to incite hatred against anyone," he said. "We expect from others, as they expect from us, that they respect our cultural specifics and religious references, and not impose concepts or cultures that are unacceptable to us."
Mursi was one of the first leaders to be democratically elected after Arab Spring revolutions that led to changes in the governments of Tunisia, Egypt, Libya and Yemen last year.
Western states that backed the uprisings have urged these countries to quickly foster democratic reforms and adhere stringently to human rights principles and basic freedoms.
They fear a more austere version of Islam could hijack the protest movements. Most Western speakers at the United Nation defended freedom of speech, but shied away from calls by Muslim leaders for an international ban on blasphemy.
While repeating his condemnations of the video, U.S. President Barack Obama staunchly defended free speech, riling some of those leaders.
"The strongest weapon against hateful speech is not repression, it is more speech - the voices of tolerance that rally against bigotry and blasphemy," Obama said in a 30-minute speech dominated by this theme.
'CLASH OF CIVILIZATIONS'
Speaking after Obama, President Asif Ali Zardari of Pakistan, where more than a dozen people were killed in protests against the anti-Islam film, demanded insults to religion be criminalized.
"The international community must not become silent observers and should criminalize such acts that destroy the peace of the world and endanger world security by misusing freedom of expression," he said.
Highlighting the anger of some, about 150 protesters demanded "justice" and chanted "there is no god but Allah" outside the U.N. building on Thursday. One placard read: "Blaspheming my Prophet must be made a crime at the U.N."
Foreign ministers from the 57-member Organization of Islamic Cooperation met on Friday. The film topped the agenda.
"This incident demonstrates the serious consequences of abusing the principle of freedom of expression on one side and the freedom of demonstration on the other side," OIC Secretary-General Ekmeleddin Ihsanoglu told reporters.
Human Rights First and Muslim Public Affairs Council, two U.S.-based advocacy groups, warned of the risks of regulating such freedoms.
"Countless incidents show that when governments or religious movements seek to punish offences in the name of combating religious bigotry, violence then ensues and real violations of human rights are perpetrated against targeted individuals," they said in a joint statement.
The 47-member U.N. Human Rights Council, dominated by developing states, has passed non-binding resolutions against defamation of religion for over a decade. Similar ones were endorsed in the U.N. General Assembly.
European countries, the United States and several Latin American nations in the council opposed the resolutions, arguing that while individual people have human rights, religions do not, and that existing U.N. pacts - if enforced - were sufficient to curb incitement to hatred and violence.
German Foreign Minister Guido Westerwelle attempted to dampen talk of a clash of civilizations on Thursday.
"Some would have us believe that the burning embassy buildings are proof of a clash of civilizations," Westerwelle said in his U.N. address. "We must not allow ourselves to be deluded by such arguments. This is not a clash of civilizations. It is a clash within civilizations. It is also a struggle for the soul of the movement for change in the Arab world."[/quote]
[quote]...but shied away from calls by Muslim leaders for an international ban on blasphemy.[/quote]
Ya don't say?
I am so sick of the term "Islamophobia" being tossed around like this.
Here's an idea, as oppossed to expecting the world to bend to your sensitivities, why not educate the peoples of typically muslim middle eastern nations so they don't storm fucking embassies and bomb shit because someone made your prophet look like an asshat in a terribly made fucking B-movie?
But yeah sure just ban fucking blasphemy instead cause fighting thought crimes and vaguely insensitive religious discussion cause as a collective the entire middle eastern region has sand wedged firmly in its arsehole.
[QUOTE=Pierrewithahat;37840455]Here's an idea, as oppossed to expecting the world to bend to your sensitivities, why not educate the peoples of typically muslim middle eastern nations so they don't storm fucking embassies and bomb shit because someone made your prophet look like an asshat in a terribly made fucking B-movie?
But yeah sure just ban fucking blasphemy instead cause fighting thought crimes and vaguely insensitive religious discussion cause as a collective the entire middle eastern region has sand wedged firmly in its arsehole.[/QUOTE]
because they're run by tyrants and have no idea of western ideals and the amount of freedom of speech we have, also most of them are uneducated
[QUOTE=Mio Akiyama;37840466]because they're run by tyrants and have no idea of western ideals and the amount of freedom of speech we have, also most of them are uneducated[/QUOTE]
Except quite a few of them are democratically elected officials from officially secular or progressive states (Egypt and Turkey, for example.)
Huh, Muslims speak of anti-Semitism, right.
Fuck them. They're the ones keeping their societies in Bronze age, and they're the ones to answer for every incident that happens even if it really is caused by us "abusing" our freedom of speech.
"cultural sensitivity" is the exact opposite of the function and consequences of freedom of speech.
The Middle East in general is really behind on some major political and social ideas, because religion in general has such a deep root in their politics and policy.
[QUOTE=Mio Akiyama;37840466]because they're run by tyrants and have no idea of western ideals and the amount of freedom of speech we have, [b]also most of them are uneducated[/b][/QUOTE]
Yeah that's kinda why I said educate the masses, and while religion may be a major part of those countries, the majority are not theocratic dictatorships.
Fuck your sensitivities.
Islamophobia exists and is dumb
so is anti-Blasphemy law
we can say both of those things at the same time
[QUOTE=Pierrewithahat;37840525]Yeah that's kinda why I said educate the masses, and while religion may be a major part of those countries, the majority are not theocratic dictatorships.[/QUOTE]
except said tyrants won't allow for the education of the masses and would rather keep the people in the dark and sheltered from the rest of the world.
[QUOTE=Mio Akiyama;37840962]except said tyrants won't allow for the education of the masses and would rather keep the people in the dark and sheltered from the rest of the world.[/QUOTE]
Except those nations are a tiny minority, and most muslim nations are actually fairly democratic.
[QUOTE=gudman;37840492]Huh, Muslims speak of anti-Semitism, right.
Fuck them. They're the ones keeping their societies in Bronze age, and they're the ones to answer for every incident that happens even if it really is caused by us "abusing" our freedom of speech.[/QUOTE]
For your information, arabs themselves are semites. So they can't be anti-semitic, unless they hate themselves.
Now would be a good time to remember that 95% of most people no matter what just want to live in peace.
It is the minority of all countries that go out on the streets for dumb reasons all the time. Nobody is not guilty of it.
Calling Islam or all Muslims dumb is an act of bigotry and
muhammud was a dumb
come at me asif
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;37840481]Except quite a few of them are democratically elected officials from officially secular or progressive states (Egypt and Turkey, for example.)[/QUOTE]
More like a handful, when most of the "democratic" countries over there have an election, the favorite party wins by 99%.
[QUOTE=aydin690;37840970]For your information, arabs themselves are semites. So they can't be anti-semitic, unless they hate themselves.[/QUOTE]
So apparently Turks are Arabs. Take your information and shove it.
I don't get why they would care so much. I mean, if I draw a stupid picture of their prophet then it's [I]I[/I] who will go to hell and not them (according to the religion). Why should they care if I go to hell?
[QUOTE=Fear_Fox;37841737]I don't get why they would care so much. I mean, if I draw a stupid picture of their prophet then it's [I]I[/I] who will go to hell and not them (according to the religion). Why should they care if I go to hell?[/QUOTE]
They're still living in the 1100's for the most part, there's no point in trying to change their ways, just like you can't comprehend their method of thinking they can't comprehend ours and the world is worse off because of it.
[QUOTE=DamagePoint;37841750]They're still living in the 1100's for the most part, there's no point in trying to change their ways, just like you can't comprehend their method of thinking they can't comprehend ours and the world is worse off because of it.[/QUOTE]Actually, it'd probably be better if they were living in the time we typically call the dark ages. Given how at that time they were basically at the forefront of knowledge what with making major strides in mathematics, astronomy, and many other fields. Along with being highly developed societies for the time and being social, cultural, and economical beacons that were ultimately very good places to live regardless of who you were.
Freedom of Speech is just as sacred to us as their prophet is to them.
Almost all of the issues people find now with Islam are the result of people like Mohammed Al Wahab who were basically the 18th century Islamic equivalent to the Westboro Baptist Church. Hell, even in his own time people didn't like him, and his views were all but dead until near the middle of the 1900s.
Fuck them and their religion.
[QUOTE=zugu;37841812]Fuck them and their religion.[/QUOTE]
Fuck you and your religion.
Feuds of religion in a nutshell.
[QUOTE=zugu;37841812]Fuck them and their religion.[/QUOTE]Fuck your ignorance.
[QUOTE=gudman;37840492]Huh, Muslims speak of anti-Semitism, right.
Fuck them. They're the ones keeping their societies in Bronze age, and they're the ones to answer for every incident that happens even if it really is caused by us "abusing" our freedom of speech.[/QUOTE]
Good point gudman, society is in the Bronze age and it's all those dirty muzzies fault.
The reason why the Muslim world is reacting so negatively towards this resurgence of anti-Islamic media is because it is purposefully made to provoke and anger people, not to attempt to debate the merits or dogma of Islam on any nuanced level. If such media had attempted the latter, we probably wouldn't see nearly the reaction we're seeing today among Muslims.
At this point I don't even think the anger has much to do with religion anymore, it's just the way that most people would normally react if someone pretty much outright insulted their identity, which - for a lot of people - Islam evidently serves as.
I think whether or not certain segments of the Muslim world are overreacting is irrelevant, and that we in the West should instead focus on denouncing media that serves no purpose other than to piss people off, before going over to their countries and telling [I]them[/I] how to live when we have our own problems to fix.
[QUOTE=God's Pimp Hand;37842015]The reason why the Muslim world is reacting so negatively towards this resurgence of anti-Islamic media is because it is purposefully made to provoke and anger people, not to attempt to debate the merits or dogma of Islam on any nuanced level. If such media had attempted the latter, we probably wouldn't see nearly the reaction we're seeing today among Muslims.
At this point I don't even think the anger has much to do with religion anymore, it's just the way that most people would normally react if someone pretty much outright insulted their identity, which - for a lot of people - Islam evidently serves as.
I think whether or not certain segments of the Muslim world are overreacting is irrelevant, and that we in the West should instead focus on denouncing media that serves no purpose other than to piss people off, before going over to their countries and telling [I]them[/I] how to live when we have our own problems to fix.[/QUOTE]
Fuck that, there's media made specifically to piss off all kinds of people but you don't see everyone storming fucking embassies over it, they bitch about it for like 5 minutes then fuck off and carry on with their day.
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