[IMG]http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/71114000/jpg/_71114609_71114603.jpg[/IMG]
[QUOTE]Something strange is happening in the Middle East.
The Russians, once vilified in some Arab countries as godless communists, their crumbling economy mocked, their dated weaponry shunned by the rich Gulf states, are now sweeping back into favour as US influence wanes.
Thursday's visit to Egypt by a high-level Russian delegation, with the prospect of a $2bn arms deal, is only the latest sign of a trend that has been gathering pace since the Arab Spring unrest kicked off in early 2011.
The fact that Moscow is supporting a regime - Syria's - ostracised by most of the Arab League is being quietly overlooked as Russian delegations and arms salesmen beat a path to Arab doors.
Twenty-two years after the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russian clout in the Middle East is the highest it has been in a generation.
In the clear blue skies above the Dubai Air Show the Russian MiG-29 fighter performed a stunt that held the watching crowd below quite breathless.
With a fiery thrust of the twin engines the ace pilot powered the large jet vertically up into the air then stopped it in mid-air, rotated it into a horizontal position, and then flew it slowly backwards.
It seemed to defy gravity and all the laws of physics. Despite the applause, the air show's Emirati hosts ended up awarding their $6bn jet fighter contract that year, 1999, to the Americans, opting to buy the F16 instead.
But Russia, like France, the UK, China and other countries, has never given up on the lucrative Middle East market and today, amidst the shifting uncertainties of the post-Arab Spring, its delegations are given a warm welcome.
According to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (SIPRI), Russian arms exports accounted for 27% of the total for the Middle East and North Africa in the period 2008-2012.
But the upheavals of the Arab Spring have helped bring about a revival in Russian fortunes. After years of looking to the West for their defence contracts, the really big Arab spenders, Saudi Arabia and the Gulf states, are now keen to diversify.
This is as much for political as technical reasons.
Shaken but not toppled by the revolutions of 2011, Gulf Arab rulers have been angered by the speed with which the West abandoned its former partner, President Hosni Mubarak of Egypt.
They also bristle at being "lectured" by Western governments and the media on human rights and democracy, hinting that the alternative to their often autocratic rule is chaos and the rise of Islamic extremism.
Much as they disapprove of Moscow's support for Syria's President Bashar Al-Assad, Arab rulers have noticed that unlike the West's indecisive approach, Russian policy has been unwavering from the beginning. They like that.
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[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-24944325[/url]
Hah, Yes i suppose now that america is collapsing, theres room for another superpower to take its place.
[QUOTE=Sprockethead;42870005]Hah, Yes i suppose now that america is collapsing, theres room for another superpower to take its place.[/QUOTE]
you wanna go a few rounds denmark
How the hell is America 'collapsing'?
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LCYlrfH_5o&t=1m1s](Return of the Bear) It is
(Return of the Bear) Come on
(Return of the Bear) Oh my God
(You knew that I'll be back) Here I am
(Return of the Bear) Once again
(Return of the Bear) Pump up the world
(Return of the Bear) Watch my flow
(You knew that I'll be back) Here I go[/url]
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;42870071]How the hell is America 'collapsing'?[/QUOTE]
Yeah, lets see.
Multi-trillion dollar deficit,
Complete democratic failure,
Subvertion of the state by corporate intrests,
Locked in indefinite, expensive wars,
want me to go on?
[QUOTE=Sprockethead;42870087]Yeah, lets see.
Multi-trillion dollar deficit,
Complete democratic failure,
Subvertion of the state by corporate intrests,
Locked in indefinite, expensive wars,
want me to go on?[/QUOTE]
Those are endemic problems, yes. But the country isn't collapsing. It's really quite easy to have a look at what's happened to the world in the past few years to see a number of great examples of countries collapsing. What America is going through, I wouldn't consider it collapsing. Rotting, perhaps.
[QUOTE=AtomicWaffle;42870134]Those are endemic problems, yes. But the country isn't collapsing. It's really quite easy to have a look at what's happened to the world in the past few years to see a number of great examples of countries collapsing. What America is going through, I wouldn't consider it collapsing. Rotting, perhaps.[/QUOTE]
Id wager my love of mammal flesh, and 25 cents, that the US will be a systemically bankrupt third world nation in a few decades.
[QUOTE=Sprockethead;42870146]Id wager my love of mammal flesh, and 25 cents, that the US will be a systemically bankrupt third world nation in a few decades.[/QUOTE]
Then you underestimate the capacity of her citizens.
[QUOTE=AtomicWaffle;42870134]Those are endemic problems, yes. But the country isn't collapsing. It's really quite easy to have a look at what's happened to the world in the past few years to see a number of great examples of countries collapsing. What America is going through, I wouldn't consider it collapsing. Rotting, perhaps.[/QUOTE]
And what does rotting lead to?
[QUOTE=Sprockethead;42870087]Yeah, lets see.
Multi-trillion dollar deficit,
Complete democratic failure,
Subvertion of the state by corporate intrests,
Locked in indefinite, expensive wars,
want me to go on?[/QUOTE]
'Multi-trillion dollar deficit,'? Our deficit is 680bn in 2013 and projected to be 744bn in 2014, followed by 577bn in 2015. Our deficit did exceed 1 trillion for several years but never past 1.4 trillion.
'Complete democratic failure' and 'Subvertion of the state by corporate interests' I agree with whole heartedly.
'Locked in indefenite, expensive wars' - The only armed conflict we're in is Afghanistan and we have a deadline to withdraw all but a few thousand men(to train Afghan soldiers) by the end of 2014.
I'm not saying that we're not in trouble, but we're hardly 'collapsing'.
[QUOTE=Gordy H.;42870196]'Multi-trillion dollar deficit,'? Our deficit is 680bn in 2013 and projected to be 744bn in 2014, followed by 577bn in 1015. Our deficit did exceed 1 trillion for several years but never past 1.4 trillion.
'Complete democratic failure' and 'Subvertion of the state by corporate interests' I agree with whole heartedly.
'Locked in indefenite, expensive wars' - The only armed conflict we're in is Afghanistan and we have a deadline to withdraw all but a few thousand men(to train Afghan soldiers) by the end of 2014.
I'm not saying that we're not in trouble, but we're hardly 'collapsing'.[/QUOTE]
I don't think 1015 follows 2014.
[QUOTE=laserguided;42870201]I don't think 1015 follows 2014.[/QUOTE]
That's the American education system for you.
[QUOTE=Sprockethead;42870146]Id wager my love of mammal flesh, and 25 cents, that the US will be a systemically bankrupt third world nation in a few decades.[/QUOTE]
Is this post a joke? America is going to be a "third world nation" in a few decades? They're an economic power house home to major international corporations. They're not going to be third-world any time soon.
[QUOTE=Sprockethead;42870005]Hah, Yes i suppose now that america is collapsing, theres room for another superpower to take its place.[/QUOTE]
The US may be going to shit but Russia is in no way doing any better. How can you possibly say a shithole like Russia is to take anyone's place.
[QUOTE=Medevila;42870563]No clue why Facepunch always loves to jack off to the idea of the US going down the shitter[/QUOTE]
Because Facepunch has a majority composed of disaffected westerners, and members of 'third-party' western nations.
The disaffected scorn America because it acts as an easy strawman for things they hate. Regardless of the political spectrum, since America's right-of-center attitude means there's a lot of room left and right to fit both nazis and hippies.
The members of the 'third-party' are folks like our Danish delegate who for various reasons have geopolitical angst that would be most easily curmudgeoned out upon America's woes. They also often lack a fine understanding the intricacies that make a nation so large as America tick, and certainly for a nation where 600Bn$ is quite literally twice their GDP, such a figure of debt sounds outrageous. It's more reasonable for a nation who's GDP is 15.68Tr$, for perspective.
If you wanna see a "collapsing country" just look at Greece. The US may have its problems, but holy shit we are far from collapsing as a country.
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