• Obamacare begins to crumble as CLASS act is removed
    39 replies, posted
Sacramento Bee Obama pulls plug on part of health overhaul law Wire Health & Science Tuesday, October 18, 2011 [release]The Obama administration's signature health overhaul law, under relentless assault by Republicans, has suffered its first major casualty - a long-term care insurance plan dogged from the beginning by doubts over its financial solvency. The program became the first casualty in the political and policy wars over the health care law. It had been expected to launch in 2013. Proponents, including many groups that fought to pass the health care law, have vowed a vigorous effort to rescue the program, insisting that Congress gave the administration broad authority to make changes. Long-term care includes not only nursing homes, but such services as home health aides for disabled people.[/release] source: [url]http://www.sacbee.com/2011/10/15/3981874/obama-pulls-plug-on-part-of-health.html[/url] The Hill New healthcare fight is joined as administration's 2010 law implodes 10/17/11 08:20 PM ET [release]Congressional Republicans on Monday called for the immediate repeal of a major component of the 2010 healthcare reform law as the issue blew up in the administration’s face. The seemingly unworkable long-term care benefit contained in the health overhaul has been indefinitely shelved, quickly triggering a new offensive from GOP lawmakers that is expected to put congressional Democrats in a politically awkward position. The administration announced late Friday it did not see a way to make the long-term care CLASS Act, which was crafted by the late Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-Mass.), pay for itself. But perhaps even more damning is how the White House mishandled the controversy; consumer advocates accused the administration of being disingenuous and gutless. Rep. Charles Boustany Jr. (R-La.), the House sponsor of legislation to repeal the program, told The Hill that he is “pushing” Republican leaders “personally” to bring up his bill shortly after the House returns from recess next week. The only Democrat who has co-sponsored Boustany’s legislation is Rep. Daniel Lipinski (Ill.), who voted against healthcare reform last year. The bill’s Senate sponsor, Sen. John Thune (R-S.D.), also took to the floor to urge quick action. “Hopefully we can kill this thing once and for all so it doesn’t become a drain on our children and grandchildren,” Thune said. The growing drumbeat for repeal comes after the White House announced that it is against repeal and remains committed to making the program work. “We do not support repeal,” said White House spokesman Nick Papas. “Repealing the CLASS Act isn’t necessary or productive. What we should be doing is working together to address the long-term care challenges we face in this country.” It’s too late for that, Republicans say. Boustany noted that a letter sent to Congress from Health and Human Services (HHS) Secretary Kathleen Sebelius concluded that she does “not see a viable path forward for CLASS implementation at this time.” “It puts the Democrats in a very difficult position,” he told The Hill. “They have to decide whether they’re going to do the fiscally responsible thing and repeal the program or support something that is fiscally irresponsible.” Some Democrats on Capitol Hill might vote against repeal because they want to keep CLASS alive and to support the White House. But others who are facing challenging reelection races — including Sens. Claire McCaskill (Mo.), Joe Manchin (W.Va.), Jon Tester (Mont.) and Ben Nelson (Neb.) — might not use political capital to save a costly program that might never be implemented. A key hurdle to repealing CLASS was cleared on Monday when the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) said that eradicating the program wouldn’t cost a penny. CBO had scored the long-term care program for people with disabilities as raising $86 billion, or 40 percent of the health law’s $210 billion in deficit reduction over 10 years. In a blog post, CBO Director Douglas Elmendorf clarified that last week’s announcement from the administration means those savings are now moot. “Following longstanding procedures,” Elmendorf wrote, “CBO takes new administrative actions into account when analyzing legislation being considered by the Congress — even if it has not published new baseline projections. Beginning immediately, therefore, legislation to repeal the CLASS provisions in current law would be estimated as having no budgetary impact.” New baseline budget projections due out in January, Elmendorf wrote, “will assume that the program will not be implemented (unless there are changes in law or other actions by the administration that would supersede Friday’s announcement).” The administration’s move on CLASS has caused plenty of consternation among the program’s advocates. AARP, a key ally during the healthcare reform fight, released a statement saying the seniors lobby is “disappointed that the secretary has prematurely stated she does not see a path forward to properly implement CLASS.” Other advocates don’t know what to believe, ripping the administration’s communications strategy. Several said an administration official reached out over the weekend to tell them that ubiquitous media reports about the program’s demise were flat-out wrong. The administration’s message was received with skepticism by the nonprofit Advance CLASS coalition that is tasked with building private-sector support for the program. “I feel like somebody just called me about how to do really good pet care after they shot my dog,” said Advance CLASS CEO Larry Minnix. Advance CLASS Executive Director Connie Garner, a former top health aide to Kennedy, said advocates have been getting “what feels like disingenuous feedback for a while” from the administration. Asked if she believed officials who now say Friday’s announcement was misinterpreted, she paused. “We’re happy if … they think we didn’t hear correctly or whatever they want to say,” Garner said. “We need to hear from the White House that they’re going to move forward on working on this program.” The White House’s lack of clarity and attacks on the media have only fanned the flames, keeping the CLASS story in the news for weeks. Bob Yee, the former CLASS Act actuary who created a firestorm last month when he told colleagues in a widely circulated email that the CLASS Act Office was closing, said he felt vindicated by Friday’s announcement. The administration at the time dismissed Yee’s announcement as a false “rumor.” “I don’t know why they sort of scrambled and said they weren’t shutting down,” he said. “In fact, as is proven now, they’re not working on [CLASS].” Yee added that he shared several options with HHS before he was laid off. He said the program could be made to work. Others agree. “When I look at their decisions,” said Georgetown health policy expert Judy Feder, “it seems to me they have the analysis that says they can continue. They have the authorities. What they seem to be lacking is the guts.”[/release] Source: [url]http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/188073-new-healthcare-fight-as-2010-law-implodes[/url] Wall Street Journal Opinion: [url=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204479504576635200446357240.html?mod=googlenews_wsj]ObamaCare Starts to Unravel OCTOBER 18, 2011[/url]
Hooray! Less people will have health insurance! This is a great day for America. :downs:
Seriously, it is not called compromising when only one side gets its way, both parties should to make sacrifices. But here, it's either Democrats having no backbone, the Republicans being ridiculously unreasonable or both. And I thought that the US government was for grownups. Shame really.
Begins?
[QUOTE=Stockers678;32848877]Seriously, it is not called compromising when only one side gets its way, both parties should to make sacrifices. But here, it's either Democrats having no backbone, the Republicans being ridiculously unreasonable or both. And I thought that the US government was for grownups. Shame really.[/QUOTE] I don't think that either party are ever reasonable. Lets not forget the Wisconsin Senators who abandoned their seats and left the state when they weren't getting their way. Politics in the U.S fucking sucks.
Not that it matters, I have little faith in our healthcare. Iirc we spend more money on Healthcare than on countries that actually cover everyone. Hospitals jack up the prices because they know they'll get paid.
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;32848840]Hooray! Less people will have health insurance! This is a great day for America. :downs:[/QUOTE] I'm a proponent of Universal Health Care and I really had high hopes for the Health Care bill. The abomination we got in it's place needs to be destroyed, though. It's a joke that's increased insurance payments massively and will barely help anyone. There are some great sides of it, such as being covered by your parents insurance until you're 26 (very helpful for my older brother, who has OCD/Depression/Borderline Psychotic/Schizophrenic, and has trouble holding a job), but the majority is riddled with holes and "compromises". [QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;32848943]Not that it matters, I have little faith in our healthcare. Iirc we spend more money on Healthcare than on countries that actually cover everyone. Hospitals jack up the prices because they know they'll get paid.[/QUOTE] That tells only a tiny, inaccurate part of the story, though. Our health care system is the most responsive in the world, and if you CAN afford it, is also by far the most effective. When you blend low quality, low cost clinics in with $400k+ procedures that literally can't be performed anywhere else, you get statistics like the one you're quoting. Hospitals don't jack up the costs on their own, remember that it's a massive chain of companies and organizations. There are unions for doctors and nurses, the companies that provide equipment and research, pharmaceutical companies, etc. and all of them are operating out of self interest. The hospital only plays a small roll, and for their part, they forgive millions upon millions of dollars, every year, in medical bills to those who can't afford them. I know this is anecdotal, but my grandmother fell down the stairs at her house after a night of drinking about 10 years back. She had a stroke, amnesia, dizziness, extreme weakness, etc. for years afterwards. Treatment, tests, physical therapy and beyond cost over $600k, none of which she could afford, and they simply wrote it off. It's all part of the system. What needs to be focused on, in my opinion, is lowering the overall cost of medicine, and that requires a comprehensive understanding of the system. The country doesn't have the attention span for that right now, apparently, and I doubt you could get past the first week before our representatives called it reckless and wasteful.
I wish we could get real healthcare reform in this country. This thing was torn to pieces by conservatives.
[QUOTE=rilez;32849072]I wish we could get real healthcare reform in this country. This thing was torn to pieces by conservatives.[/QUOTE] The only way to implement that kind of 'change' is to have clear majorities in both houses of Congress and Obama on the president's seat next term. Give it time and people will realize how stupid the Tea Party Movement is and will revert back to selecting the (D) side on their ballot tickets next general election
Why can't people just say "The Health Care bill" instead of the hostile "Obamacare"? I echo the words of many. We spend more on medicine than any other country and we are no better off for it than they are. Now, I've done some thinking about that. Could the reason medicine is so cheap in other countries is because people in the U.S. pay such an exorbitant amount? If we payed less, wouldn't everyone else have to pay more? I do not know. What I do know is that medicine has become a business. The problems stem from the fact that it is about the money, not the many.
[QUOTE=Hidole555;32849152]Now, I've done some thinking about that. Could the reason medicine is so cheap in other countries is because people in the U.S. pay such an exorbitant amount? If we payed less, wouldn't everyone else have to pay more? I do not know. What I do know is that medicine has become a business. The problems stem from the fact that it is about the money, not the many.[/QUOTE] Generally, other countries do pay quite a bit more than the cost you see quoted. They pay higher taxes, and a good chunk of those taxes goes into subsidizing healthcare. Cost per capita is higher here than anywhere else, though, and that's because our system is wholly unique in the developing world. It's full of innovation and incredible research, amazing responsiveness, and, for the rich, by far the best in the world. The problem arises when the other 95% of the population needs an expensive procedure. Since companies can charge whatever the market will pay for these procedures (and people will generally choose life over debt), and the government does not regulate it very harshly, costs are insanely high.
[QUOTE=Hidole555;32849152]Why can't people just say "The Health Care bill" instead of the hostile "Obamacare"? I echo the words of many. We spend more on medicine than any other country and we are no better off for it than they are. Now, I've done some thinking about that. Could the reason medicine is so cheap in other countries is because people in the U.S. pay such an exorbitant amount? If we payed less, wouldn't everyone else have to pay more? I do not know. What I do know is that medicine has become a business. The problems stem from the fact that it is about the money, not the many.[/QUOTE] Have you realized the amount of fucking commercials about pills, weight loss supplements, anti-depressants and more pills are on American TV?
[QUOTE=StormHammer;32848903]I don't think that either party are ever reasonable. Lets not forget the Wisconsin Senators who abandoned their seats and left the state [B]when they weren't getting their way[/B]. Politics in the U.S fucking sucks.[/QUOTE] You mean to delay legislation essentially signing away workers rights? Which people clearly didn't want?
[QUOTE=Regulas021;32849228] The problem arises when the other 95% of the population needs an expensive procedure. Since companies can charge whatever the market will pay for these procedures (and people will generally choose life over debt), and the government does not regulate it very harshly, costs are insanely high.[/QUOTE] Exactly. [URL="http://finance.yahoo.com/banking-budgeting/article/109143/top-5-reasons-why-people-go-bankrupt?mod=bb-checking_savings"]It's so bad that the top cause for bankruptcy in America is because of medical expenses.[/URL] [QUOTE=CabooseRvB;32849234]Have you realized the amount of fucking commercials about pills, weight loss supplements, anti-depressants and more pills are on American TV?[/QUOTE] I've been in America all my life, so I don't know what's shown on TV's in other countries.
[QUOTE=MasterG;32849344]- The Democrats try and build a house. - The Republicans agree to help build it. - The Democrats put in a lot of effort building the house. - The Republicans say the house won't be very good and fight to make sure it isn't built. - The Democrats don't get the house built because they didn't have any help building it. - The Republicans prove this is evidence that houses won't work, even if other people live in houses, and proceed to spend all of their house-making-resources on killing people. This is how I see American politics.[/QUOTE] That is pretty damned accurate.
[QUOTE=MasterG;32849344]- The Democrats try and build a house. - The Republicans agree to help build it. - The Democrats put in a lot of effort building the house. - The Republicans say the house won't be very good and fight to make sure it isn't built. - The Democrats don't get the house built because they didn't have any help building it. - The Republicans prove this is evidence that houses won't work, even if other people live in houses, and proceed to spend all of their house-making-resources on killing people. This is how I, as a foreigner to your country, see American politics.[/QUOTE] That's literally spot on.
[QUOTE=Hidole555;32849152]Why can't people just say "The Health Care bill" instead of the hostile "Obamacare"?[/QUOTE] I never understood that either. It's almost like his middle-eastern sounding name is a bad thing.
[QUOTE=Hidole555;32849152]Why can't people just say "The Health Care bill" instead of the hostile "Obamacare"? I echo the words of many. We spend more on medicine than any other country and we are no better off for it than they are. Now, I've done some thinking about that. Could the reason medicine is so cheap in other countries is because people in the U.S. pay such an exorbitant amount? If we payed less, wouldn't everyone else have to pay more? I do not know. What I do know is that medicine has become a business. The problems stem from the fact that it is about the money, not the many.[/QUOTE] Or they could just call it what it is, the Affordable Care Act. Calling it 'Obamacare' is like me calling the PATRIOT Act 'Bushwatch" or the Panama Canal 'Teddybridge'.
[QUOTE=MasterG;32849344]- The Democrats try and build a house. - The Republicans agree to help build it. - The Democrats put in a lot of effort building the house. - The Republicans say the house won't be very good and fight to make sure it isn't built. - The Democrats don't get the house built because they didn't have any help building it. - The Republicans prove this is evidence that houses won't work, even if other people live in houses, and proceed to spend all of their house-making-resources on killing people. This is how I, as a foreigner to your country, see American politics.[/QUOTE] Welp you just summed up all United States news in this section.
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;32848840]Hooray! Less people will have health insurance! This is a great day for America. :downs:[/QUOTE] If we give handouts to the poor they'll never get jobs Dying in the street is incentive to be a useful member of society [editline]18th October 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=MasterG;32849344]- The Democrats try and build a house. - The Republicans agree to help build it. - The Democrats put in a lot of effort building the house. - The Republicans say the house won't be very good and fight to make sure it isn't built. - The Democrats don't get the house built because they didn't have any help building it. - The Republicans prove this is evidence that houses won't work, even if other people live in houses, and proceed to spend all of their house-making-resources on killing people. This is how I, as a foreigner to your country, see American politics.[/QUOTE] You forgot about the part where people with mansions applaud Republicans on the grounds that if you aren't able to have a mansion of your own you don't even deserve a house
[QUOTE=Zeke129;32850222]If we give handouts to the poor they'll never get jobs Dying in the street is incentive to be a useful member of society You forgot about the part where people with mansions cheer on the Republicans on the grounds that if you aren't able to have a mansion of your own you don't even deserve a house[/QUOTE] Gotta have compost for those crops. And they'll go futher because there are no poor people to feed them to. EDIT: Actually, this works with healthcare as well. If you don't let poor people have access to decent healthcare then they'll all die, and then we won't need socialist healthcare because we'll only have rich people and they can pay for it themselves. I should be a right wing politician.
Last i remember, when this law(?) was signed, not a damn thing changed, my stay at the hospital 2 months ago was still $11,500, and our insurance only paid 55%, and our rates got hiked.
[QUOTE=zombini;32850302]Last i remember, when this law(?) was signed, not a damn thing changed, my stay at the hospital 2 months ago was still $11,500, and our insurance only paid 55%, and our rates got hiked.[/QUOTE]This is one reason why I won't trust insurance companies in the first place.
[QUOTE=zombini;32850302]Last i remember, when this law(?) was signed, not a damn thing changed, my stay at the hospital 2 months ago was still $11,500, and our insurance only paid 55%, and our rates got hiked.[/QUOTE] I don't think any facet of the law took effect immediately
My nephew was in the hospital for pneumonia about 5-6 years ago. It was about $110,000. My sister's insurance company was late at paying for it, and they added the full bill on my sister. she wants to sue the fuck out of the hospital because this fucked up her credit reports and they haven't reversed it yet. the insurance company paid for the bill in full though.
I wish the blue states could separate from the red ones. Problem is the red ones would prolly bomb us for being 'euro friendly pinkos'.
[QUOTE=zombini;32850384]It was about $110,000.[/QUOTE] what in the fucking fuck and this is the developed world god damn
$110,000? Did he get like twelve surgeries or something? Holy fuck. [editline]19th October 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Zeke129;32851467]what in the fucking fuck and this is the developed world god damn[/QUOTE] "This is your brain on Rush"
Oh hey look a Glaber thread. disgunbegood.jpg
[QUOTE=Sega Saturn;32852029]Oh hey look a Glaber thread. disgunbegood.jpg[/QUOTE] Already guessed it from Obamacare but meh
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