Trump Education Nominee Supports Guns In Schools to Defend From Grizzly Bear Attacks
37 replies, posted
[quote]Washington (CNN)Betsy DeVos, President-elect Donald Trump's education secretary nominee, said it should be up to states whether guns are allowed in schools, citing grizzly bear protection as part of her answer. [/quote]
[url]http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/17/politics/betsy-devos-grizzly-bears-donald-trump-guns/index.html[/url]
I... um...
What the bloody fuck?
Edit:
I like guns and I'm pretty pro-gun, but where the fuck are these stories of bears attacking schools, I want to read this.
Speaking as someone who supports guns in schools; what a dumb answer.
[url]https://facepunch.com/member.php?u=314128[/url]
He does seem like a bit of a nutter, but I doubt he'll actually go shoot up a school
lel this sounds like an incredibly stupid idea.Guns in schools is a spell for disaster.
[QUOTE=Sgt.Kickass;51689541]lel this sounds like an incredibly stupid idea.Guns in schools is a spell for disaster.[/QUOTE]
It's been going fine in Utah and presumably other states. Ideally security would be handled by resource officers but not every district can afford those for every school, in which case properly trained and license teachers are the next line of defense. It's certainly better than the current defense against school shootings which has routinely failed over and over to protect students and faculty.
Ok sounds reasonable,i guess.Better something than nothing.
Trump chooses only the best people.
And by best, he means those who pay $200 million to the GOP.
[QUOTE=Sgt.Kickass;51689541]lel this sounds like an incredibly stupid idea.Guns in schools is a spell for disaster.[/QUOTE]
How? School resource officers here in the states carry sidearms. As long as the person carrying the weapon is properly trained and using a retention holster, what's the problem?
My grade 8 teacher worked at a super rural primary school in British Columbia for a while. Once during recess a cougar came onto school grounds and was inches away from snatching up a 5 year old and dragging them away into the bush. In that context I can see a firearm being useful :v:
I live in a state where such an event is the most possible. My city sits at the base of a mountain and occasionally bears do wander about near the foot of the mountain but they don't go much further than the few houses at the very base of said mountain. Bears don't go wandering into town to maul school children. They also can't open doors and schools have some pretty beefy metal doors so uhh? Maybe just don't leave doors wide open/close the door? Raccoons or stray dogs/cats are more of a threat to school children than fucking bears. Cougars maybe idk, but bears aren't as keen to roll into town.
Wouldn't handguns just piss the bear off? From what I've heard, you would need a shotgun or a really high caliber pistol to kill the bear.
[QUOTE=Sgt.Kickass;51689559]Ok sounds reasonable,i guess.Better something than nothing.[/QUOTE]
It's a fair enough assumption to make, that just giving teachers guns would be a recipe with disaster. I wasn't on board for it at first. But now after a few places have had it for a couple years without incident I think it's a good idea.
[QUOTE=Svinnik;51689589]Wouldn't handguns just piss the bear off? From what I've heard, you would need a shotgun or a really high caliber pistol to kill the bear.[/QUOTE]
Unless you're throwing a 3 1/2" slug out of a 12ga, it's probably not a wise idea. A pistol would be an even worse idea.
There used to be a time in my town where you could walk through a high school parking lot and see all of the kids guns on gun racks in their back windows, and no one said anything other than "Timmy, did you shoot a deer this mornin'?"
When my father was in school, him and his buddies would go there with their rifles, drop them off at the principle's office, pick them up after school was over then go into the woods right next to it and go hunting.
And this was in Pennsylvania, not some hick southern state before anyone guesses otherwise.
[QUOTE=Svinnik;51689589]Wouldn't handguns just piss the bear off? From what I've heard, you would need a shotgun or a really high caliber pistol to kill the bear.[/QUOTE]
Depends on the specific ammunition used as well as the caliber.
An S&W .500 Magnum would do the trick, but those things are impractical for anything other than open carry while hiking. They're also painful to shoot.
A .357 might work, but you'd want to look for heavy, cast-projectile ammunition.
If you don't want a revolver, a Glock 20 or 29 might be your best bet.
[QUOTE=Svinnik;51689589]Wouldn't handguns just piss the bear off? From what I've heard, you would need a shotgun or a really high caliber pistol to kill the bear.[/QUOTE]
Black bears would probably be scared of the sound of a 22 and scamper off because you can wave your arms and yell at black bears and they'll fuck off unless they have cubs to protect. Grizzly bears are more spine and will fuck you up if you try that. But if a grizzly is massacring a school you've got a much larger issue than the average 9mm or occasional 45 acp that security would carry can handle yeah. Mostly because even grizzly bears don't just go blood thirsty killer mode so far into towns, but also because they're fucking bears and they're not easy to kill. There's stories of bear skulls stopping bullets because of their shape and toughness, so take it for what you will.
[QUOTE=Revenge282;51689626]Unless you're throwing a 3 1/2" slug out of a 12ga, it's probably not a wise idea. A pistol would be an even worse idea.
There used to be a time in my town where you could walk through a high school parking lot and see all of the kids guns on gun racks in their back windows, and no one said anything other than "Timmy, did you shoot a deer this mornin'?"[/QUOTE]
Hell, didn't even stop my highschool when the ban started. Kids just left their rifles under the back seat. Everyone knew they had them, nobody cared.
What a headline
This woman sounds unbearable.
i watched the hearing and shes a total dunce. she refused to commit to anything, things like not privitising public schools or upholding recipients of public funding to federal standards, pretty much every one of her answers was some variation of "well i look forward to working with you on it". its painfully obvious shes only there because her famly donated a ton of money to the republican party and shes just there to do whatever the administration tells her to do, which is gut public education from the sounds of it
[editline]18th January 2017[/editline]
i really recommend you guys watch the clip where she answers this question its hilarius in a cringey kinda way
[QUOTE=Nautsabes;51689778]i watched the hearing and shes a total dunce. she refused to commit to anything, things like not privitising public schools or upholding recipients of public funding to federal standards, pretty much every one of her answers was some variation of "well i look forward to working with you on it". its painfully obvious shes only there because her famly donated a ton of money to the republican party and shes just there to do whatever the administration tells her to do, which is gut public education from the sounds of it
[editline]18th January 2017[/editline]
i really recommend you guys watch the clip where she answers this question its hilarius in a cringey kinda way[/QUOTE]
I was thinking the same thing. Sanders was the only one that asked a vaguely difficult question. The rest were just lobbed softballs that she just kept whiffing.
Not every school is in an urban area.
Fuck, mine were and there were two instances of bears showing up, actually :v:
Imagine a school in literal middle of nowhere, Montana. Not many animal control officers around, possibly for hours. A bear starts rooting through the trash at the end of the day, and needs tovbe scared away. Is it really a big deal if a teacher or whatever keeping his 10mm glock in his truck or a safe or similar gets it first before he goes to spook it off, just in case?
[QUOTE=Svinnik;51689589]Wouldn't handguns just piss the bear off? From what I've heard, you would need a shotgun or a really high caliber pistol to kill the bear.[/QUOTE]
It really depends on the type of bear. A .45 would be effective against black bear for example but for a large grizzly you'd probably want something more like a .44
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;51689634]When my father was in school, him and his buddies would go there with their rifles, drop them off at the principle's office, pick them up after school was over then go into the woods right next to it and go hunting.
And this was in Pennsylvania, not some hick southern state before anyone guesses otherwise.[/QUOTE]
Pennsylvania is basically a hick southern state outside of its major cities
[QUOTE=evilweazel;51690000]Not every school is in an urban area.
Fuck, mine were and there were two instances of bears showing up, actually :v:
Imagine a school in literal middle of nowhere, Montana. Not many animal control officers around, possibly for hours. A bear starts rooting through the trash at the end of the day, and needs tovbe scared away. Is it really a big deal if a teacher or whatever keeping his 10mm glock in his truck or a safe or similar gets it first before he goes to spook it off, just in case?[/QUOTE]
Are bear attacks such a problem that schools need to be armed to fight them? If a bear started rooting through the trash would it not be better to stay inside and contact specialists or wait for it to leave instead of going out and unloading into it?
In other news, this woman has some mixed opinions about the state of the current US public education system.
[URL="https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/answer-sheet/wp/2016/12/21/to-trumps-education-pick-the-u-s-public-school-system-is-a-dead-end/?utm_term=.144a63657334"]She does agree that the public education system needs a rework, but also that privatized institutions ought to be more prevalent.[/URL]
[URL="https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/23/us/politics/betsy-devos-trumps-education-pick-has-steered-money-from-public-schools.html?_r=0"]She also supports school vouchers which would allow students to attend private institutions instead of public alternatives. However this was deployed in Michigan and more was done on building more schools instead of improving existing ones.[/URL]
She seem well intentioned, but her past actions and interviews have made her out to treating the US education system as a business instead of a standardized civic system.
[QUOTE=RainbowStalin;51690057]Are bear attacks such a problem that schools need to be armed to fight them? If a bear started rooting through the trash would it not be better to stay inside and contact specialists or wait for it to leave instead of going out and unloading into it?[/QUOTE]
Stop trying to be reasonable, this is America damnit. we need to increase our firepower.
[sp] in all seriousness i thought most schools already had cops with guns in them? in my high school (oregon) there was an armed officer on campus basically all day. i think giving teachers guns is a pretty fucking stupid idea but i dont see anything wrong with having an officer on campus.[/sp]
[QUOTE=RainbowStalin;51690057]Are bear attacks such a problem that schools need to be armed to fight them? If a bear started rooting through the trash would it not be better to stay inside and contact specialists or wait for it to leave instead of going out and unloading into it?[/QUOTE]
In sufficiently rural areas where bears might come into contact with humans often I could see allowing someone in the faculty being armed, especially if it's a smaller school far away from law enforcement or animal control.
Again though I think it was a ridiculous response. Guns shouldn't be in schools to protect against bears, they should be in schools to protect against people who ignored the Gun Free Zone sign.
[editline]18th January 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=sweetbro;51690101]Stop trying to be reasonable, this is America damnit. we need to increase our firepower.
[sp] in all seriousness i thought most schools already had cops with guns in them? in my high school (oregon) there was an armed officer on campus basically all day. i think giving teachers guns is a pretty fucking stupid idea but i dont see anything wrong with having an officer on campus.[/sp][/QUOTE]
I thought it was pretty stupid too but AFAIK there haven't been any accidents or incidents involving improper use of a firearm by faculty. CCL owners in general tend to be extremely safe gun owners.
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