• Red Arrows pilot injured at RAF Scampton - Unconfirmed reports suggest pilot has been killed.
    32 replies, posted
Would be much appreciated if a mod could change the thread title to "Red Arrows pilot killed in incident at RAF Scampton". Thanks. [img]http://jimenapulse.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/red-arrows-3.jpg[/img] [quote] [B]A Red Arrows pilot has died after being ejected from an aircraft at the aerobatic team's base in Lincolnshire.[/B] The RAF confirmed that the pilot was ejected from a Hawk T1 jet while it was on the ground at RAF Scampton. The Military Aviation Authority is carrying out an independent inquiry to determine the cause of the incident. Gp Capt Simon Blake said: "Our thoughts and prayers are with his family and friends and colleagues at this difficult time." The pilot's family have been told and have asked for a period of grace until his name is released. Gp Capt Blake said: "It would be inappropriate to speculate on the cause of the incident until that inquiry is complete. The investigation will determine the facts." Lincolnshire Police earlier confirmed they were attending an incident at Scampton, but did not comment further. East Midlands Ambulance crews were called to the scene at about 11:09 GMT, along with the Lincolnshire and Nottinghamshire Air Ambulance. [B]'Massive bang'[/B] Eyewitnesses close to RAF Scampton reported seeing one of the Hawk aircraft with a smashed canopy, according to BBC defence correspondent Jonathan Beale. Aircraft designed for low-level flying - such as the Hawk - have ejection seats which fire through the canopy, he said. Chris Boatman, who lives nearby, said he heard a "massive bang". "A few hours ago my children and I heard a massive bang that echoed across from the runway area to our house," he said. "Not long after that an air ambulance flew a few metres over the house." The incident comes a few months after Red Arrows pilot Jon Egging died after his plane crashed after a display near Bournemouth Airport. A post-mortem examination showed the cause of death was multiple injuries. Flt Lt Egging, who grew up in Southam, Warwickshire, joined the RAF in 2000 and served with IV (AC) Squadron, based at RAF Cottesmore, flying the Harrier GR9 in support of coalition forces in Afghanistan. The Red Arrows team was formed in 1965 and have completed more than 4,300 displays in 53 countries. The team completed their final display of the season in September and are currently carrying out their winter training at RAF Scampton. [/quote] [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-15640104]Source[/url] As is the way with a lot of these things, there is a sad irony to one of these guys being killed on the ground rather than in the air. Thoughts are with the pilot's family and friends. RIP. Also, watching the twitter trend now, it seems a lot of people think this will be the end of the red arrows. This event sounds more like a generic technical incident, nothing like a mid-air collision for example. From what I know, the previous event this year was also an incident not related to acrobatics as such. If I'm right, then why should they be decommissioned?
If its true, my condolences to the pilot
Another one? What the hell is going on with the red arrows?
Confirmed dead. So sad to see, especially so soon after Jon Egging's death. It's strange I watched them back in July, now two of those pilots are dead. R.I.P to another fine pilot. I feel so sorry for his family, and not to mention the Red Arrows after losing another guy. I also think this could spell the end of the Hawk T1 aircraft if the investigation proves the aircraft was the problem.
I don't think that this will be the end of the Red Arrows at all. They still need to finish the investigation into the last crash, and this incident is obviously something entirely different.
I always loved to look up and see these guys flying past at airshows from my bedroom window. its sad to know some of them have lost their lives
I hope it isn't the end of the red arrows, despite these two incidents they are still pretty much the best acrobatic groups in the world and are a pleasure to see fly.
The reason they are saying it's the end is because the aircraft are clearly aging and it's causing disaster and deaths so they will most likely have to replace them but in this economy do we really have the money to buy 11 new jets for an aerobatic team?
[QUOTE=Jiro-uk-;33185900]The reason they are saying it's the end is because the aircraft are clearly aging and it's causing disaster and deaths so they will most likely have to replace them but in this economy do we really have the money to buy 11 new jets for an aerobatic team?[/QUOTE] That's what I'm saying. Obviously the Hawks don't seem to be in the best shape anymore, even if this was the pilot's mistake, I still thought before this they needed replacing. But I'm sure the MoD have already planned if not created a new trainer jet.
[QUOTE=Jiro-uk-;33185900]The reason they are saying it's the end is because the aircraft are clearly aging and it's causing disaster and deaths so they will most likely have to replace them but in this economy do we really have the money to buy 11 new jets for an aerobatic team?[/QUOTE] Accidental ejection is not the sign of a failing airframe, its the sign of (with all respect to the pilot) pilot error. If the aircraft's really are that old and need replacing they will be replaced, the Hawk is the RAF trainer jet. [QUOTE=icemaz;33185888]I hope it isn't the end of the red arrows, despite these two incidents they are still pretty much the best acrobatic groups in the world and are a pleasure to see fly.[/QUOTE] Compare the number of major incidents and fatalities (especially during displays) with other countries aerobatic groups, they are defiantly one of if not the safest.
[QUOTE=Jsm;33185971]Accidental ejection is not the sign of a failing airframe, its the sign of (with all respect to the pilot) pilot error. If the aircraft's really are that old and need replacing they will be replaced, the Hawk is the RAF trainer jet. Compare the number of major incidents and fatalities (especially during displays) with other countries aerobatic groups, they are defiantly one of if not the safest.[/QUOTE] Yeah but we still aren't sure if it was accidental, I guess only time will tell.
Not again :sad:
[QUOTE=Jiro-uk-;33186134]Yeah but we still aren't sure if it was accidental, I guess only time will tell.[/QUOTE] Even if it wasn't accidental, the chances are it would be a problem with the ejector seat itself, which is essentially it's own entity and is unlikely to have anything to do with the ageing of the aircraft.
Why the quotes around accidental? You don't really just decide to eject out of a perfectly good, stationary airplane.
[QUOTE=Dacheet;33186986]Why the quotes around accidental? You don't really just decide to eject out of a perfectly good, stationary airplane.[/QUOTE] It's not confirmed, for all I know there could be some kind of malfunction involved. The fact is I don't know and it hasn't been announced, it was just speculation.
[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-15640104[/url] Confirmed dead. RIP dude
[QUOTE=Stockers678;33187285][url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-15640104[/url] Confirmed dead. RIP dude[/QUOTE] Just to clarify, I was talking about the "accidental" ejector seat being non confirmed, not the death being not confirmed, that was confirmed ages ago.
Aw fuck no. Not again. Condolences to the RAF and the team and the family.
[QUOTE=Dacheet;33186986]Why the quotes around accidental? You don't really just decide to eject out of a perfectly good, stationary airplane.[/QUOTE] Ejector seats are quite complex, it is possible that something failed and caused the seat to eject.
[QUOTE=Jsm;33188644]Ejector seats are quite complex, it is possible that something failed and caused the seat to eject.[/QUOTE] Okay, then isn't that an accident? ac·ci·dent/ˈaksidənt/ Noun: An unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and [b]unintentionally[/b], typically resulting in damage or injury.
I may be mistaken but many ejector seats are disarmed when on the ground to prevent this sort of thing. They don't have time to deploy properly below around 150ft.
[QUOTE=Dacheet;33188943]Okay, then isn't that an accident? ac·ci·dent/ˈaksidənt/ Noun: An unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and [b]unintentionally[/b], typically resulting in damage or injury.[/QUOTE] Yes but people are saying accidental in the sense that the pilot commanded it. Either way, unless he REALLY wanted to get out of there very quickly it was an accident. [editline]8th November 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Killoch0;33189667]I may be mistaken but many ejector seats are disarmed when on the ground to prevent this sort of thing. They don't have time to deploy properly below around 150ft.[/QUOTE] Ones that are zero/zero rated (as you would apparently expect in an aircraft doing low level flight) can in [I]theory[/I] be launched while on the ground. As for the disarming, he could have been on his way to / from the air. Just mindless speculation, we won't know for sure for some time.
All western aircraft have zero-zero ejection seats, which means that they can be fired on the ground at zero airspeed and still go high enough for the chute to open, and at an angle that takes the crew away from the aircraft. Seems odd to have the seat firing mechanism malfunction and the parachute malfunction at the same time. My wishes for the pilot and his family, regardless.
Seems the MoD has grounded all planes that use that ejection system that are not essential (I assume this means actively being used). Without speculating too much this seems to me to suggest they think it might be the system that failed.
He was definitely drunk [editline]10th November 2011[/editline] Oh, wait, nevermind. Royal Air Force, not Royal Australian Air Force.
The red arrows are sweet, they need to stop ballsing things up so the children of my childrens children (and so on) go "ooh" and "ahh" at them many times over.
Time to take a serious look at the Hawk, if you ask me. There's no reason for this sensationalist disbanding the squadron bullshit - their aircraft are just in need of some more maintenance it seems. Or this was just another freak accident. Nevertheless, R.I.P to the victim and condolences to his family.
So many stunt plane related deaths, I hope all the best for these men
So he ejected, his shute failed and he hit the floor? I don't know much about this sort of stuff so how exactly did he die?
[QUOTE=- Livewire -;33205940]So he ejected, his shute failed and he hit the floor? I don't know much about this sort of stuff so how exactly did he die?[/QUOTE] His ejector seat deployed while he was on the ground, and the parachute did not do enough to break his fall. He subsequently died of his injuries. It's possible that the ejector seat malfunctioned, which is why all hawks (the aircraft used by the Red Arrows and also to train fast jet pilots) have been grounded.
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