• Bloods and Crips uniting in Baltimore to help rebuild the community.
    49 replies, posted
[T]http://www.independent.co.uk/img/rO0ABXQAZGZ7aHR0cDovL3d3dy5pbmRlcGVuZGVudC5jby51ay9pbmNvbWluZy9hcnRpY2xlMTAyMDk2MzYuZWNlL2FsdGVybmF0ZXMvdzYyMC92Mi1jcmlwczIuanBnfWY3Nzc3ZjMyMHQ=.jpg[/T] [QUOTE="Independent"]Gang rivals from the Bloods and the Crips stand side-by-side against police brutality in Baltimore this week, determined to unite for a "common good". Several photos purportedly showing members of the usually warring gangs posing together have been shared on social media, in an alliance apparently brokered by the Nation of Islam activists in honour of Freddie Gray, who died of a spinal injury while in police custody and whose funeral served as the catalyst for the riots.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE] "We can unite and stop killing one another," he added to The Daily Beast, "and the Bloods and the Crips can help rebuild their community."[/QUOTE] [B]SOURCE:[/B] [url]http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/the-bloods-and-the-crips-unite-in-baltimore-to-stop-killing-one-another-and-rebuild-the-community-10209635.html[/url] So how long do you think the truce will hold? [B]Edit[/B] Mods please change Crisp to Crips. Thanks
So why don't they all turn themselves in and dismantle their criminal infrastructure? Surely that would be more useful to the community than two gangs saying they don't approve of police methods.
[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47617790]So why don't they all turn themselves in and dismantle their criminal infrastructure? Surely that would be more useful to the community than two gangs saying they don't approve of police methods.[/QUOTE] I feel like you don't understand the conditions under which gangs/organized crime forms. Gangs don't form in neighborhoods where people feel like the police are on their side and can call 911 without worrying who the cops will shoot when they show up. Gangs/organized crime form in areas where the official law enforcement doesn't make people feel safe anymore. You join a gang because you don't want to get jumped on the way home from school. If there was an effective police presence, you wouldn't feel in danger of that and you wouldn't join a gang. Now, this is how it begins. Once it forms, without any meaningful oversight it basically evolves into a money/power grab because of the people involved and the aforementioned lack of oversight. Edit: The post I'm replying to asks "why?". If you wanna rate me dumb and provide a better explanation then please you're welcome to do so.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;47617810]I feel like you don't understand the conditions under which gangs/organized crime forms. Gangs don't form in neighborhoods where people feel like the police are on their side and can call 911 without worrying who the cops will shoot when they show up. Gangs/organized crime form in areas where the official law enforcement doesn't make people feel safe. You join a gang because you don't want to get jumped on the way home from school. If there was an effective police presence, you wouldn't feel in danger of that and you wouldn't join a gang.[/QUOTE] So you join with the jump-ees? Yeah that's not a good excuse, sorry. "I don't wanna get jumped so I instead jump other people!"
[QUOTE=Chronische;47617820]So you join with the jump-ees? Yeah that's not a good excuse, sorry. "I don't wanna get jumped so I instead jump other people!"[/QUOTE]Well.. If you can't beat them then join them. But it's still an idiotic reason.
The title says Crisp. I was very confused.
Was worried about blood soaked crisps. A gross image, nevermind.
Too bad they're not going to do anything productive and most likely just fucking destroy things. If you believe otherwise you're a fucking moron or the most unbelievable optimist.
Imo they're probably doing this so that they're respected in the region and as a result more people join them.
[QUOTE=Chronische;47617820]So you join with the jump-ees? Yeah that's not a good excuse, sorry. "I don't wanna get jumped so I instead jump other people!"[/QUOTE] Excuse? This has nothing to do with excuses. Human beings have certain behavior patterns because of our evolutionary history. This is one of them. If the system is set up in a way that doesn't work well with how people behave in these kinds of situations, then the system is fucked. No, it doesn't mean that the people involved aren't responsible, but from a pragmatic, "fix the problem" position, it helps to understand why something is happening if you want to fix it instead of just trying to justify why you're so much better then "those kind of people". And yeah, you join with the jumpees because you don't have the outside perspective to know any better, and in the short term it is obviously better then getting your ass kicked.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;47617838]Excuse? This has nothing to do with excuses. Human beings have certain behavior patterns because of our evolutionary history. This is one of them. If the system is set up in a way that doesn't work well with how people behave in these kinds of situations, then the system is fucked. No, it doesn't mean that the people involved aren't responsible, but from a pragmatic, "fix the problem" position, it helps to understand why something is happening if you want to fix it instead of just trying to justify why you're so much better then "those kind of people". And yeah, you join with the jumpees because you don't have the outside perspective to know any better, and in the short term it is obviously better then getting your ass kicked.[/QUOTE] "You don't know any better to not beat other people up" What? That's pretty fucking common sense to know that beating the shit out of someone isn't a good thing. I do get what you are saying, gang culture forms where endemic poverty and no visible means of escape. That doesn't mean that if these gangs actually WANT to help the community they should stop their criminal activities, otherwise they are being incredible hypocrites. "Police brutality!" they say while, as you have said, jumping locals on a regular basis.
What is hilarious is these are the two groups that are contribution to the black on black violence. They killed more black people then the cops have. These groups are major part of the problem as to why communities are in such fucking shambles. All they're doing is gonna partner up to kill cops. [quote]WASHINGTON — The Baltimore Police Department says they have received a credible threat that numerous gangs have entered into a partnership to “take-out” law enforcement officers. According to the department, they have received credible information that various gangs including the Black Guerilla Family, Bloods and Crips have entered into the partnership. “Law enforcement agencies should take appropriate precautions to ensure the safety of their officers,” the departments says in a press release.[/quote]
[QUOTE=meharryp;47617828]The title says Crisp. I was very confused.[/QUOTE] Gang warfare tension is high between the Crisps and the Chips
Bloods and Crips working together? Heh, this is just like [OBSCURE VIDEO GAME REFERENCE] [IMG]http://www.elisoftware.org/images/thumb/7/7c/45445-11406.jpg/250px-45445-11406.jpg[/IMG]
Are these the same Bloods and Crips that the police called a credible threat yesterday? [url]http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2015/04/27/police-baltimore-gangs-threaten-to-take-out-officers/[/url]
[QUOTE=Rapscallion92;47617790]So why don't they all turn themselves in and dismantle their criminal infrastructure? Surely that would be more useful to the community than two gangs saying they don't approve of police methods.[/QUOTE] That's a pretty naive solution. "Why are there prisons if every criminal could just [I]not commit crimes?[/I]" Clearly there's more complex reasons why criminality exists, either gang-related or individually.
The good old strategy of gangs trying to look good to the community so that they get more members. Fucking typical...
[QUOTE=Chronische;47617884]"You don't know any better to not beat other people up" What? That's pretty fucking common sense to know that beating the shit out of someone isn't a good thing.[/QUOTE] Its common sense? Really? What the fuck does common sense mean? Yeah its common sense to you or me. But like, looking back at the last 2000 years of human history, does that really seem like common sense or just the fact that we were lucky enough to be born in a time, culture, and place where that kind of stuff is no longer common. These people were not. The people who end up as suicide bombers in the middle east were not. Child soldiers were not. Maybe common sense isn't exactly the clearest argument you could be making so please explain again how people born into these systems are supposed to magically know better? [QUOTE=Chronische;47617884] I do get what you are saying, gang culture forms where endemic poverty and no visible means of escape. That doesn't mean that if these gangs actually WANT to help the community they should stop their criminal activities, otherwise they are being incredible hypocrites. "Police brutality!" they say while, as you have said, jumping locals on a regular basis.[/QUOTE] Like I said, the gangs form that way, but that was decades ago. At this point, the gangs exist as self perpetuating social memes, and jumping locals turns out to be one of the most effective ways of doing so. I don't think that it is contradictory for gangs to want to help the community and not disband. It's only contradictory from our perspective because we have the outside perspective on what the negative effects of gangs are. From the inside its a lot less black and white. This is entirely disconnected from the fact that police brutality is an issue that is faced by people of low socio-economic standing. It also stands to reason that gang members have a lot of experience with police and might see all the times it happens to people who actually weren't doing anything wrong too.
Are people in Baltimore still rioting? Because if these two rivals joined forces I'm pretty sure it's either to take on the police force or for less than substantial reasons
The riots and curfews are interfering with their business, of course they want things to go back to normal.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;47617948]Its common sense? Really? What the fuck does common sense mean? Yeah its common sense to you or me. But like, looking back at the last 2000 years of human history, does that really seem like common sense or just the fact that we were lucky enough to be born in a time, culture, and place where that kind of stuff is no longer common. These people were not. The people who end up as suicide bombers in the middle east were not. Child soldiers were not. Maybe common sense isn't exactly the clearest argument you could be making so please explain again how people born into these systems are supposed to magically know better? Like I said, the gangs form that way, but that was decades ago. At this point, the gangs exist as self perpetuating social memes, and jumping locals turns out to be one of the most effective ways of doing so. I don't think that it is contradictory for gangs to want to help the community and not disband. It's only contradictory from our perspective because we have the outside perspective on what the negative effects of gangs are. From the inside its a lot less black and white. This is entirely disconnected from the fact that police brutality is an issue that is faced by people of low socio-economic standing. It also stands to reason that gang members have a lot of experience with police and might see all the times it happens to people who actually weren't doing anything wrong too.[/QUOTE] Common sense in that you don't beat people up. Even ancient cultures realized that it wasn't nice. Barring religious warfare or whatever, but that's a whole other deal. The suicide bombers are acting on religious warfare, they don't spend time beating each other on the streets (unless you are a different religion/culture but again, different case). Child soldiers don't have a choice about fighting like gang members do about not joining a gang. I'm not saying it's not difficult to stay out of gangs but that's a totally different situation. "Knowing better" is part of modern western culture that permeates even into places like Baltimore or Detroit, it's in huge quantities of media that are omnipresent. Yes, there is media that is the opposite (thug music, things like that) but it is not the majority. I also don't really advocate for gangs dissolving, they do form a useful gathering point for people. I just think they should cease criminal activity and instead turn to more things like this (protests, charities, ect) because they are being huge fucking hypocrites when they decry police brutality when they engage in their own on a regular basis.
[QUOTE=Chronische;47618010]Common sense in that you don't beat people up.[/QUOTE] Ok this is just you repeating yourself. [QUOTE=Chronische;47618010]Even ancient cultures realized that it wasn't nice. Barring religious warfare or whatever, but that's a whole other deal.[/QUOTE] No, tribal warfare between otherwise similar cultures existed even in the 20th century and still does to this day. How many wars in Europe have broken out over the last 2000 years? Between religions, the crusades? Even Romeo & Juliet was based on a feud between two families in a city. Same shit. [QUOTE=Chronische;47618010]The suicide bombers are acting on religious warfare, they don't spend time beating each other on the streets (unless you are a different religion/culture but again, different case).[/QUOTE] Different culture, different gang, different, whatever. We're wired to be tribal. Its the same shit. [QUOTE=Chronische;47618010]Child soldiers don't have a choice about fighting like gang members do about not joining a gang. I'm not saying it's not difficult to stay out of gangs but that's a totally different situation.[/QUOTE] "totally different situation" isn't that a little bit of a hyperbole? How much of a choice is it between getting your ass beat every day by yourself compared to having a group of people who have your back? Also, gangs recruit teenagers. [url]http://www.ojjdp.gov/pubs/96natyouthgangsrvy/surv_6a.html[/url] [QUOTE=Chronische;47618010]"Knowing better" is part of modern western culture that permeates even into places like Baltimore or Detroit, it's in huge quantities of media that are omnipresent. Yes, there is media that is the opposite (thug music, things like that) [B]but it is not the majority[/B].[/QUOTE] How exactly does one measure what the majority of consumed media is for a demographic? Because I'm pretty sure you're pulling this out of your ass. [QUOTE=Chronische;47618010] I also don't really advocate for gangs dissolving, they do form a useful gathering point for people. I just think they should cease criminal activity and instead turn to more things like this (protests, charities, ect) because they are being huge fucking hypocrites when they decry police brutality when they engage in their own on a regular basis.[/QUOTE] I agree with you, but its naive as all hell.
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[QUOTE=Kybalt;47617810]I feel like you don't understand the conditions under which gangs/organized crime forms. Gangs don't form in neighborhoods where people feel like the police are on their side and can call 911 without worrying who the cops will shoot when they show up. Gangs/organized crime form in areas where the official law enforcement doesn't make people feel safe anymore. You join a gang because you don't want to get jumped on the way home from school. If there was an effective police presence, you wouldn't feel in danger of that and you wouldn't join a gang. Now, this is how it begins. Once it forms, without any meaningful oversight it basically evolves into a money/power grab because of the people involved and the aforementioned lack of oversight. Edit: The post I'm replying to asks "why?". If you wanna rate me dumb and provide a better explanation then please you're welcome to do so.[/QUOTE] You're absolutely right. There's also the economic aspect to it. Gangs provide security and income, they give you something to do and a way to support yourself and your family. In economically shitty areas, crime always increases, and gangs form out of necessity to find support when the state fails to do so. Black inner-city areas have always had economic issues because of white flight, systemic racism, and discrimination (taxes, insurance, real estate, etc). They're often socially and economically isolated. They're not called ghettos for no reason. Gangs provide remedies for these issues.
[QUOTE=MR-X;47617886]What is hilarious is these are the two groups that are contribution to the black on black violence. They killed more black people then the cops have. These groups are major part of the problem as to why communities are in such fucking shambles.[/QUOTE] Blaming these groups as the reason for why their communities are in such a condition is ridiculous. These gangs don't create this condition but are simply a reaction to it. Go ahead and look at the origins of some of these gangs and you can see that. A lot of them were formed as movements to unite youths in general or even sprung form political causes, like the Black Guerrilla Family coming form the Black Liberation Army which could easily be related to the Black Panthers. Apart from this you also have these gangs formed as a way to create a route out of the terrible conditions realized in these communities. So sure, these groups may help explain some of the violence in the community, but they don't why the communities are in conditions where that violence is necessary. If you want the answer to that you have to dig deeper and not blame the reaction to the problem as the source of the problem.
Someone call?
[QUOTE=Kybalt;47617810]Gangs don't form in neighborhoods where people feel like the police are on their side and can call 911 without worrying who the cops will shoot when they show up. Gangs/organized crime form in areas where the official law enforcement doesn't make people feel safe anymore. You join a gang because you don't want to get jumped on the way home from school.[/QUOTE] I feel like you're romanticizing this a little bit. Normal people getting jumped isn't that much of a common occurrence, maybe if they think you're in another gang, which could be true for some people - but for others it's just so obvious you aren't in a gang that people don't bother you. Unless they're totally unhinged they probably won't just fuck with random people, either. I grew up around a lot of gang members, and I can say a lot of them have just had sad lives and that's just how you end up being brought up a certain way. Poverty and location certainly play into it, if they were rich and generally apathetic they probably would find some other outlet, but joining a gang because you're worried about another gang is just an excuse people use, most of the time. Joining a gang, it is known by everyone who lives in neighborhoods like this trust me, will only bring to you more violence. They aren't retarded.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;47617810]I feel like you don't understand the conditions under which gangs/organized crime forms. Gangs don't form in neighborhoods where people feel like the police are on their side and can call 911 without worrying who the cops will shoot when they show up. Gangs/organized crime form in areas where the official law enforcement doesn't make people feel safe anymore. You join a gang because you don't want to get jumped on the way home from school. If there was an effective police presence, you wouldn't feel in danger of that and you wouldn't join a gang. Now, this is how it begins. Once it forms, without any meaningful oversight it basically evolves into a money/power grab because of the people involved and the aforementioned lack of oversight. Edit: The post I'm replying to asks "why?". If you wanna rate me dumb and provide a better explanation then please you're welcome to do so.[/QUOTE] Theres more to it than this, but definitely a part to it. Gangs act like a neighborhood police. They know everything and anything that goes on and dishes out their own punishments. Gangs have evolved so much over time that its hard to track.
[QUOTE=Octavius;47618311]Blaming these groups as the reason for why their communities are in such a condition is ridiculous. These gangs don't create this condition but are simply a reaction to it. Go ahead and look at the origins of some of these gangs and you can see that. A lot of them were formed as movements to unite youths in general or even sprung form political causes, like the Black Guerrilla Family coming form the Black Liberation Army which could easily be related to the Black Panthers. Apart from this you also have these gangs formed as a way to create a route out of the terrible conditions realized in these communities. So sure, these groups may help explain some of the violence in the community, but they don't why the communities are in conditions where that violence is necessary. If you want the answer to that you have to dig deeper and not blame the reaction to the problem as the source of the problem.[/QUOTE] How is it ridiculous? We know the factors that promoted their growth, but gangs do not help or improve conditions. They just add more issues to an already complicated situation. Also if you read my.post, I didn't blame them for all problems. I sad they contribute towards the very violence that ironically theyre taking a stand against. Here is an idea, let's stop the lame ass blame game and start doing shit other then resorting to crime. No one will stand beside any of these communities unless they stop the bullshit their pulling. All these rioters and gang members are doing is using this shit to promote themselves. They don't give a fuck about the communities because if they did they would use their man power to make places better not worse.
this is like that episode of southpark where the alquiada saves the US from New Jersey..... bizarre times we live in [editline]28th April 2015[/editline] also these guys are sort of to blame for the large amount of crime that the police cite for evidence so... they're not really the innocent party here
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