US anti-Trump protesters facing decades behind bars - Polidicks

[URL="http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2017/05/anti-trump-protesters-facing-decades-bars-170522063956218.html"]Source[/URL] [QUOTE]When Olivia Alsip travelled to the capital to protest against the inauguration of right-wing US President Donald Trump, she didn't imagine she would end the day behind bars and later face up to 80 years in prison. Thousands of people journeyed from across the US to Washington, DC, to protest on the first day of Trump's presidency, January 20. During the swearing-in, Alsip was among the more than 230 protesters arrested when officers from the Metropolitan Police Department (MPD) blocked off a large area and hauled off nearly everyone. "I am wondering if my 24th birthday next week will be my last as a free person," she says by telephone from Chicago. "I've never in my life had such a painful and stressful experience. There are no words to convey the severity of this." "Our experience in police custody [that day] was totally dehumanising. We were kettled, treated like animals and denied basic human rights and dignity," she recollects. "People were forced to urinate on the streets and denied water and food." The arrests came after Black Bloc anarchists and anti-fascists clashed with police. Officers fired rubber bullets and tear gas at protesters Anti-Trump chants were occasionally drowned out by the thuds of sound grenades and smoke bombs. Left behind was broken glass from the windows of cafes, restaurants and banks. Declarations of resistance marked the walls and pavements: "Make racists afraid again," and "F*ck Trump". Images of a limousine in flames later made it onto television screens and the front pages of news websites around the world. On January 21, most of the 230 protesters and bystanders arrested the day before were charged with felony rioting, which carries a maximum prison sentence of 10 years and a $25,000 fine. But on April 27, the Superior Court of the District of Columbia returned a superseding indictment which added additional charges for some 212 defendants, three of whom had not previously been charged. With new felony charges including urging to riot, conspiracy to riot and destruction of property, many of the defendants are facing up to 80 years in prison. Many other defendants, among them journalists, are facing more than 70 years[/QUOTE]

Well that seems quite fucked. Hell I fucking hate the morons that spraypaint shit and break windows but even property damage aint worth seventy to eighty years in like... Any circumstances. Don't most murderers get less than that? [editline]3rd June 2017[/editline] Not to mention it sounds like a lot of people who just happened to be [I]there[/I] got caught up in a lot of those charges...

[QUOTE=froztshock;52310005]Not to mention it sounds like a lot of people who just happened to be [I]there[/I] got caught up in a lot of those charges...[/QUOTE] Hey, how about that right to peaceful protest? Remember how important that is? Under this administration, I feel you Americans are [I]actually[/I] going to have to defend it. Under past presidents, even Bush and the post-9/11 erosion of liberties, I'd consider anyone saying this as just being hyperbolic, but this time, I believe and mean it.

If peaceful protestors are getting charged with 80 year prison sentences that's fucked. That's seriously fucked. If it's a rioter getting that time that's still pretty fucking shitty. Again, criminals who hurt people physically get less time.

Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.

While the massively politicized charges (and the egregious potential sentences) leveled against those arrested is nuts (and quite blatantly obvious to see as a method of quashing public resistance), the police tactics used by MPD on Inauguration Day aren't new or quite surprising. These types of more-or-less indiscriminate and inhumane policing tactics have been in use as far back as the Occupy protests in 2010-2011 timeframe, and even earlier in some cases (albeit smaller scale prior to Occupy). Police in major US cities are likely under extreme pressure from the government to maintain the [I]status quo[/I] during these politically charged times, and often are allowed to violate the rights of individuals and groups to do so as long as it keeps business going as usual for those in power. EDIT: Also, to those quipping "don't do the crime if you don't want to do the time"- innocent BEFORE [B][U]PROVEN[/U][/B] guilty. Not only that, but it sounds like many innocents were caught up in the kettling and cordoning-off and are still being charged to try and create a chilling effect on future protesters.

[QUOTE=Code3Response;52310075]Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.[/QUOTE] Yeah we should hand out 80 year sentences for car thieves too right?

[QUOTE=Code3Response;52310075]Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.[/QUOTE] 80 fucking years is absolutely an insane amount

[QUOTE=Code3Response;52310075]Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.[/QUOTE] 80 fucking years? That isn't reasonable at all

[QUOTE=Code3Response;52310075]Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.[/QUOTE] I'd love to see proof that every last one of those arrested and charged (that did not take a plea deal like some did to avoid financial/emotional/legal stress) [I]actually[/I] caused property damage and were 'rioting'. It's quite for those in power who might be threatened by popular protest to reclassify it as a riot to squash any potential stain on their record quickly (you see it all the time in more totalitarian countries like, I dunno, [B][I]Russia[/I][/B]).

[QUOTE=Code3Response;52310075]Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.[/QUOTE] Whoops, forgot about the guilt-by-existing-in-the-same-general-geographic-area part of the law. I better not be near a store when it gets robbed or on the same block as someone who gets shot.

[QUOTE=Intoxicated Spy;52310097]80 fucking years? That isn't reasonable at all[/QUOTE] The maximum penalty is 80 years. They're not going to get that. That's not how things work. Especially if they opt for a box of 12.

This sounds to me like the administration taking advantage of a lot of it's supporters love of only drawing straight line conclusions and never looking to the side or at surrounding circumstances with any nuance. People being stupid ---> People get punished. End of. But in my opinion this is more insidious than that. We've seen this administration's lack of respect for protest, all they ever seem to do is call it whining and there were even bills attempted against it, like that one about no protests being alllowed near the sidewalks of the White House etc. This seems like a scare tactic against protesters in general. If someone is being a violent or disruptive idiot at a protest, that's obviously a problem. If someone is going around smashing storefronts they should be charged with destruction of property, if someone is swinging a baseball bat in a crowd they should probably be charged with attempted murder because that's fucked. But this isn't that, this is putting a special invisible "protest tax" on peoples charges to make them as long and ridiculous as possible. It's like they know they can't directly legislate against protest due to that pesky constitution, so they will take every chance they get to tangentially affect protests disproportionately and make people afraid to even partake in them at all.

Obviously breaking shit and lighting shit on fire should land you some not-light jail time if you were found guilty but 80 years is absolutely absurd.

[QUOTE=elixwhitetail;52310042]Hey, how about that right to peaceful protest? Remember how important that is? Under this administration, I feel you Americans are [I]actually[/I] going to have to defend it. Under past presidents, even Bush and the post-9/11 erosion of liberties, I'd consider anyone saying this as just being hyperbolic, but this time, I believe and mean it.[/QUOTE] They might just need to actively fight it, in such vast numbers that it would be impossible to imprison every single protester. Sure, they could could arrest hundreds, maybe even thousands, but somehow I doubt they'd be able to put away MILLIONS. There's just not enough prison space on the planet to imprison literal millions of innocent men and women, right?

[QUOTE=ironman17;52310158]They might just need to actively fight it, in such vast numbers that it would be impossible to imprison every single protester. Sure, they could could arrest hundreds, maybe even thousands, but somehow I doubt they'd be able to put away MILLIONS. There's just not enough prison space on the planet to imprison literal millions of innocent men and women, right?[/QUOTE] Well, given how we've got the largest prison system in the world, a massive private prison+security industry, and the world's largest incarcerated population, I'd not put it past good 'ol 'murica to try...

[QUOTE=ironman17;52310158]They might just need to actively fight it, in such vast numbers that it would be impossible to imprison every single protester. Sure, they could could arrest hundreds, maybe even thousands, but somehow I doubt they'd be able to put away MILLIONS. There's just not enough prison space on the planet to imprison literal millions of innocent men and women, right?[/QUOTE] Time to revamp Alcatraz Island into an anti-Trump protester prison. They'll put Hillary in Al Capone's old suite.

[QUOTE=Code3Response;52310075]Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.[/QUOTE] What do you want people to do, sit around and quietly hold up signs in designated areas? They're fighting for a cause, as tacky as that may sound. When peaceful protest fails, you have to fight. Of course, throwing bricks through the nearest Starbucks doesn't deliver much of a message at all, but the point still stands.

[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;52310281]What do you want people to do, sit around and quietly hold up signs in designated areas? They're fighting for a cause, as tacky as that may sound. When peaceful protest fails, you have to fight. Of course, throwing bricks through the nearest Starbucks doesn't deliver much of a message at all, but the point still stands.[/QUOTE] of course we have to "fight," but we dont use the term "fight" as in causing riots and problems for unrelated people

[QUOTE=Code3Response;52310075]Love the victim mentality of that article. If you don't want to face the responsibility for your actions, don't go rioting.[/QUOTE] ya, journalists shouldn't be out documenting police and protestor actions!

[QUOTE=ironman17;52310158]They might just need to actively fight it, in such vast numbers that it would be impossible to imprison every single protester. Sure, they could could arrest hundreds, maybe even thousands, but somehow I doubt they'd be able to put away MILLIONS. There's just not enough prison space on the planet to imprison literal millions of innocent men and women, right?[/QUOTE] You know what really happens under fascists when there isnt enough room in the prisons, right?

I would like to hear what the minimum sentence is or hear somebody like the NYT say that the sentences mentioned are even remotely realistic before flipping out. This is pretty absurd.

People in this thread going crazy have zero idea how the system works. The 80 years is a combination of all the maximum sentences for all the crimes they committed. There's no way in hell they are going to get anywhere close to that. The article is sensationalist trash.

[QUOTE=sgman91;52310473]People in this thread going crazy have zero idea how the system works. The 80 years is a combination of all the maximum sentences for all the crimes they committed. There's no way in hell they are going to get anywhere close to that. The article is sensationalist trash.[/QUOTE] Pleas bargin

[QUOTE=sgman91;52310473]People in this thread going crazy have zero idea how the system works. The 80 years is a combination of all the maximum sentences for all the crimes they committed. There's no way in hell they are going to get anywhere close to that. The article is sensationalist trash.[/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure everyone in this thread knows how sentencing works. It's more about the alleged idea that even being around the activity could get you jailed even if you did nothing. The idea that there has been a massive anti-protest boner from the right leading up to this point. The idea that these maximum sentences are WAY harsher than the traditional expected maximum for the exact same crimes had they happened literally anywhere except at or around a protest, that sets off some "we are punishing protesters in the only somewhat legal way we can find" alarm bells.

[QUOTE=Xion21;52310563]I'm pretty sure everyone in this thread knows how sentencing works. It's more about the alleged idea that even being around the activity could get you jailed even if you did nothing. The idea that there has been a massive anti-protest boner from the right leading up to this point. The idea that these maximum sentences are WAY harsher than the traditional expected maximum for the exact same crimes had they happened literally anywhere except at or around a protest, that sets off some "we are punishing protesters in the only somewhat legal way we can find" alarm bells.[/QUOTE] Its also should be a lesson on why violence isn't a good option for change. Yeah they laying the hammer down on folks. Guess that what happens when folks dont fight smarter.

[QUOTE=Guriosity;52310586]Its also should be a lesson on why violence isn't a good option for change. Yeah they laying the hammer down on folks. Guess that what happens when folks dont fight smarter.[/QUOTE] Those journalists sure should've fought smarter while they did their jobs and happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

[QUOTE=Guriosity;52310586]Its also should be a lesson on why violence isn't a good option for change. Yeah they laying the hammer down on folks. Guess that what happens when folks dont fight smarter.[/QUOTE] Violent protest spoils it for everyone, it gives people that think protesters are spoiled, whiny punks or whatever a reason to lump everyone together and ignore them. It helps no one, but it also shouldn't be used as a legal weapon to shut down actual protest and scare tactic legitimate ones from trying to change things.

[QUOTE=Xion21;52310595]Violent protest spoils it for everyone, it gives people that think protesters are spoiled, whiny punks or whatever a reason to lump everyone together and ignore them. It helps no one, but it also shouldn't be used as a legal weapon to shut down actual protest and scare tactic legitimate ones from trying to change things.[/QUOTE] Violence is a solution but in america it is a bad idea. Verrry bad and sure way to lose. The problem with racism in America is an intellectual one. As the video shows, what the left offers is not working. Actually it claims to solves it but its ideas creates worse fascism. By finding alternative solutions to bigotry outside of social justice is a way to prevent things regressing further.

[QUOTE=Xion21;52310563]I'm pretty sure everyone in this thread knows how sentencing works. It's more about the alleged idea that even being around the activity could get you jailed even if you did nothing. The idea that there has been a massive anti-protest boner from the right leading up to this point. The idea that these maximum sentences are WAY harsher than the traditional expected maximum for the exact same crimes had they happened literally anywhere except at or around a protest, that sets off some "we are punishing protesters in the only somewhat legal way we can find" alarm bells.[/QUOTE] As far as I can tell, no one got arrested for peacefully protesting in a legal way. There's no evidence presented in the article about it, anyway. I also don't see any evidence presented about people being charged with the rioting offenses while having no part of it.