[url=http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40809650/ns/politics/]source[/url]
[quote]WASHINGTON — A new health regulation issued this month offers Medicare recipients voluntary end-of-life planning, which Democrats dropped from the monumental health care overhaul.
The provision allows Medicare to pay for voluntary counseling to help beneficiaries deal with the complex and painful decisions families face when a loved one is approaching death.
But the practice was heavily criticized by former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and some other Republicans who have likened the counseling to "death panels."
The "voluntary advance care planning" is included in a Medicare regulation issued Dec. 3 that covers annual checkups, known as wellness visits. It goes into effect Jan. 1.
The new regulation was first reported by The New York Times.
For years, federal laws and policies have encouraged Americans to think ahead about end-of-life decisions and make their wishes known in advance through living wills and similar legal documents. But when House Democrats proposed last year to pay doctors for end-of-life counseling, it touched off a wave of suspicion and anger.
Opponents said end-of-life planning should be left to families, while proponents said doctors' advice was a basic element of health care.
Prominent Republicans singled it out as a glaring example of government overreach. Palin's use of the phrase "death panels" solidified GOP opposition to the health care bill.
Although advance planning never made it into the bill signed into law in March, few Republicans joined in supporting the health-care overhaul, President Barack Obama's signature domestic legislative achievement.[/quote]
More communist lizardman legislation. I like it.
(get the fuck out Glaber)
But the practice was heavily criticized by former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and some other Republicans who have likened the counseling to "death panels."
lol
We already have death panels, they're called insurance companies.
[QUOTE=Tetracycline;26981651]But the practice was heavily criticized by former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and some other Republicans who have likened the counseling to "death panels."
lol[/QUOTE]
Do social conservatives like to pretend that death doesn't exist? Or what?
[QUOTE=Habsburg;26981778]We already have death panels, they're called insurance companies.[/QUOTE]
If you can get denied for a condition that you had in no way as a "prior" condition for it being "prior" or pre-existing, and die because of it, then I see the insurance companies are worse than any government healthcare program devised yet.
[QUOTE=Habsburg;26981778]We already have death panels, they're called insurance companies.[/QUOTE]
Give this man agrees.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;26982688]If you can get denied for a condition that you had in no way as a "prior" condition for it being "prior" or pre-existing, and die because of it, then I see the insurance companies are worse than any government healthcare program devised yet.[/QUOTE]
Governments are much more trustworthy than companies, especially in socialized medicine, they aren't doing it to gain profit, they're just doing it, they won't fuck you over for profit.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;26982683]Do social conservatives like to pretend that death doesn't exist? Or what?[/QUOTE]
Social conservatives like to pretend the only things that exist are the things they let exist.
[QUOTE=IconWicked;26981302](get the fuck out Glaber)[/QUOTE]
Let him come I say.
[editline]26th December 2010[/editline]
So I can tell him he's wrong.
Oh my god, death panels are back, Sean Hannity will shit bricks.
[QUOTE=Used Car Salesman;26986566]Oh my god, death panels are back, Sean Hannity will shit bricks.[/QUOTE]
I'm afraid these death panels will get mixed in with other types of panels and that I will not be able to tell them apart help me Glenn Beck
where are the life panels
i need to make sure the baby doesn't come out till it's ripe
[QUOTE=thisispain;26991106]where are the life panels
i need to make sure the baby doesn't come out till it's ripe[/QUOTE]
Right next to the solar panels, but don't go too far or else you'll end up at the control panels.
Reality: Government money being used to help people plan for what happens when they die
:foxnews: [highlight]OBAMACARE USED TO MAKE OLD PEOPLE KILL THEMSELVES[/highlight] :foxnews:
Someone call?
Possible Reality: US Government spreads itself out too far trying to be the "Parent" of everyone of every age and winds up not being able to afford all of it's social programs.
[QUOTE=Glaber;26995445]Someone call?
Possible Reality: US Government spreads itself out too far trying to be the "Parent" of everyone of every age and winds up not being able to afford all of it's social programs.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=IconWicked;26981302](get the fuck out Glaber)[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Glaber;26995445]
Possible Reality: US Government spreads itself out too far trying to be the "Parent" of everyone of every age and winds up not being able to afford all of it's social programs.[/QUOTE]
What a socialist society, you even have uniformed officials who are given weaponry and tasked with "parenting" the public!
You even pay for their cars what is this madness
[QUOTE=Glaber;26995445]Someone call?
Possible Reality: US Government spreads itself out too far trying to be the "Parent" of everyone of every age and winds up not being able to afford all of it's social programs.[/QUOTE]
They paid for this bill by closing a tax loophole.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;26998794]What a socialist society, you even have uniformed officials who are given weaponry and tasked with "parenting" the public!
You even pay for their cars what is this madness[/QUOTE]
There's trying to "parent" your country, and Trying to Protect your country. Learn the difference.
[QUOTE=Glaber;27003370]There's trying to "parent" your country, and Trying to Protect your country. Learn the difference.[/QUOTE]
I have a feeling that even you can't define what "parenting" in this context means
You're just tossing buzzwords against the wall and hoping some will stick since you're a conservative and conservatives can't make real arguments
You're still wrong Glaber
[editline]27th December 2010[/editline]
Just wanted to make you aware of that.
you guys couldnt spot a troll if it cock slapped you in the face
[QUOTE=Glaber;26995445]Someone call?
Possible Reality: US Government spreads itself out too far trying to be the "Parent" of everyone of every age and winds up not being able to afford all of it's social programs.[/QUOTE]
I love how Republicans claim to dislike the government being large yet their politicians manipulate the government, making it larger than before to aid corporations and implement things like the TSA to instill fear into the populous to help further their political agendas.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;27003797]I have a feeling that even you can't define what "parenting" in this context means
You're just tossing buzzwords against the wall and hoping some will stick since you're a conservative and conservatives can't make real arguments[/QUOTE]
I wasn't aware other conservatives were using that one yet. Here is what I believe a Parent is suppose to do:
Take care of and protect their child (including feeding, clothing, doctors visits), Teach them right from wrong, and instill values.
A Government trying to do this is seen as intrusive, sort of like when a parent catches their child doing something they aren't suppose to do. Only difference is that the Parent is suppose to do this as the child isn't mature enough until around the 18-20 age range. at that age, the adult is suppose to be able to make their own decisions and no have them made for them by a parent, guardian, or government. However, they still have to follow the law as no one is suppose to be exempt form the laws of the country they're in, even if they dislike the law.
Now what the US government is suppose to do is actually different from what a parent is suppose to do. It's even clearly spelled out in the Constitution. Does it say that the government is suppose to have these social programs? I doubt it and I just checked my pocket copy.
[QUOTE=Glaber;27005197]I wasn't aware other conservatives were using that one yet. Here is what I believe a Parent is suppose to do:
Take care of and protect their child (including feeding, clothing, doctors visits), Teach them right from wrong, and instill values.
A Government trying to do this is seen as intrusive, sort of like when a parent catches their child doing something they aren't suppose to do. Only difference is that the Parent is suppose to do this as the child isn't mature enough until around the 18-20 age range. at that age, the adult is suppose to be able to make their own decisions and no have them made for them by a parent, guardian, or government. However, they still have to follow the law as no one is suppose to be exempt form the laws of the country they're in, even if they dislike the law.
Now what the US government is suppose to do is actually different from what a parent is suppose to do. It's even clearly spelled out in the Constitution. Does it say that the government is suppose to have these social programs? I doubt it and I just checked my pocket copy.[/QUOTE]
If the Constitution doesn't mention it, it's unconstitutional? Is that what you're saying?
[QUOTE=Glaber;27005197]I doubt it and I just checked my pocket copy.[/QUOTE]
you know the people that wrote that thing said to tear it up every 20 years just wanna point that out
[QUOTE=Glaber;27005197]I wasn't aware other conservatives were using that one yet. Here is what I believe a Parent is suppose to do:
Take care of and protect their child (including feeding, clothing, doctors visits), Teach them right from wrong, and instill values.
A Government trying to do this is seen as intrusive, sort of like when a parent catches their child doing something they aren't suppose to do. Only difference is that the Parent is suppose to do this as the child isn't mature enough until around the 18-20 age range. at that age, the adult is suppose to be able to make their own decisions and no have them made for them by a parent, guardian, or government. However, they still have to follow the law as no one is suppose to be exempt form the laws of the country they're in, even if they dislike the law.
Now what the US government is suppose to do is actually different from what a parent is suppose to do. It's even clearly spelled out in the Constitution. Does it say that the government is suppose to have these social programs? I doubt it and I just checked my pocket copy.[/QUOTE]
So basically because the government is providing [b]voluntary[/b] counseling they're somehow intruding and therefore violating the constitution?
Two things wrong with your argument
1- It's voluntary so it isn't intrusive
2- It isn't unconstitutional
[editline]27th December 2010[/editline]
[QUOTE=thisispain;27008397]you know the people that wrote that thing said to tear it up every 20 years just wanna point that out[/QUOTE]
I propose that you guys ban all guns designed after the constitution was signed. After all, the second amendment right to keep and bear arms can't possibly apply to arms that didn't exist yet.
How about that one glaber? Seems like the best interpretation of the constitution to me
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