Holy war over health care law? Obama angers Catholic leaders
50 replies, posted
Holy war over health care law? Obama angers Catholic leaders January 31, 2012
FOX
[release]While President Obama will deliver another speech on the economy Wednesday in Northern Virginia to keep the focus on jobs, Catholic leaders across the country are warning another issue may blow up in his face come November.
Catholics are fired up over new rules implementing Obama's health care reform law forcing Catholic universities, hospitals, and charities to provide insurance for their employees covering contraception -- even though that violates church teachings.
"When you push people of faith and you tell them the government is going to knock down the wall of separation of church and state and overreach like the Obama administration, you've got a war on your hands," Bill Donohue, president of the Catholic League, told Fox News.
In an extraordinary move this past weekend, New York Cardinal-designate Timothy Dolan and other archbishops throughout the nation had their priests read letters denouncing the Obama administration policy from the pulpit at Sunday Mass.
"Never before has the government forced individuals and organizations to go out into the marketplace and buy a product that violates their conscience," Dolan said in a web video that takes the battle online. "This shouldn't happen in a land where free exercise of religion ranks first in the Bill of Rights. How about letting our elected leaders know that we want religious liberty and rights of consciences restored and the administration's mandate rescinded? We can't afford to strike out on this one."
Pressed on the matter at his daily briefing Tuesday, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney repeated several times the administration believes it struck an "appropriate balance" in crafting the policy.
"The administration believes that this proposal strikes the appropriate balance between respecting religious beliefs and increasing access to important preventive services," said Carney. "We will continue to work closely with religious groups during this transitional period to discuss their concerns."
Even some Catholic Democrats are not buying that claim, however, with liberal columnist E.J. Dionne ripping the policy in a Washington Post column. Dionne charged Monday that the president "utterly botched" the issue and "threw his progressive Catholic allies under the bus."
A report last year from the Guttmacher Institute, a nonprofit sexual health research organization, found that 98 percent of sexually active Catholic women have used birth control despite the church's teachings. According to a Reuters report on the study, only 2 percent of Catholic women rely on natural family planning.
Nevertheless, the bishops have noted in their lobbying campaign that contraceptive coverage would include the so-called "morning after pill," opening the door to even more controversy over abortion.
Carney noted the administration still offers "strong support for existing conscience protections, including those relating to health care providers" and the new rules do not change that.
But Catholic leaders have noted that Catholic hospitals can only invoke the "conscience clause" -- and get an exemption on the new rules -- if they turn away patients of other faiths, something that is also anathema to the church.
"That means we can't say what we've been saying for 200 years, 'Are you hungry?'" retired Cardinal Theodore McCarrick told Fox News in an interview Tuesday. "We have to say, 'Are you Catholic?' We don't do that."
Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Fla., a rising star in GOP circles who has been talked up as a potential vice presidential pick, jumped into the fray Tuesday by introducing legislation that would block the White House's move.
Donohue said he's been contacted by Protestants, Mormons, Jews, and others who want to join forces with the Catholic League and the bishops to overturn the new rules.
"I've never seen anything like it," he said. "They are lining up single file. Quite frankly we are going to take the fight to the Obama administration ... to me it's political suicide."
Catholic voters played a pivotal role in Obama election in 2008 and could be important again in November. Based on Fox News exit polling data, Catholics made up 27 percent of the electorate three years ago, which translates into an estimated 35 million voters.
Obama won 54 percent of the Catholic vote in 2008, a nine-point edge over Arizona Republican Sen. John McCain, and White House officials are downplaying any political fallout now.
"We understand that not everyone agrees with it," Carney said of the decision. "All I can tell you is it was made after very careful consideration based on the need to balance ... (religious rights and) the necessity to provide access to preventive services for women was an important consideration."[/release]
Source: [url]http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/01/31/holy-war-over-health-care-law-obama-angers-catholic-leaders/#ixzz1l7XyFtD1[/url]
Something to not forget about:
[quote=U.S. constitution]Amendment 1 - Freedom of Religion, Press, Expression.
[B]Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof[/B]; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.[/quote]
Take out "Under god" and then we'll talk about separation of church and state
hey glaber how come you never use any sources other than fox?
How is this somehow limiting their freedoms? It is giving people who use contraception the option to have it covered by their employer's insurance. If you don't want to use contraception, don't use it. It's not like it is forcing Catholics to use contraception or something.
And this is completely ignoring the fact that condemning the use of contraception is one of the dumbest things that religion forces upon people.
[QUOTE=Pace.;34491514]hey glaber how come you never use any sources other than fox?[/QUOTE]
He is actually a cleverly disguised fox news bot.
Hey glaber your title should be "THIS IS MY BRAIN ON LSD"
this is one of the biggest biases i've ever seen
Lol mixing religion with politics.
Glaber, can you please explain how this violates the First Amendment?
[QUOTE=Glaber;34491489]
Something to not forget about:[/QUOTE]
Look everyone! It's Glaber, the guy who quotes a part of the constitution that doesn't apply here at all!
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;34491661]Look everyone! It's Glaber, the guy who quotes a part of the constitution that doesn't apply here at all![/QUOTE]
When you think about the context of the law, and what the religious organizations are attempting, that section of the constitution does matter. If the organizations deny healthcare that includes the option for birth control they violate the law, but if they allow it they violate their beliefs. However due to this just being a required available [B]option[/B] of the healthcare plan they are required by law to provide if they hire a certain number of workers. It is like complaining to that serves pork and you follow a kosher or halal diet. From a legal standpoint you cannot force them to either not take or take the option, it must be merely available in the plan.
Technically speaking, the first amendment protects this sort of law, as it does not prevent worship or practice of religion and it does not favor or respect religious organizations.
catholics are silly
I like how so many of these groups are probably shouting for prayer in schools and banning homosexuality, then they suddenly turn around and go on about the separation of church and state when they think Obama violates it.
[QUOTE=MisterMooth;34491556]Glaber, can you please explain how this violates the First Amendment?[/QUOTE]
Um you're just an australian so you don't know but the first amendment makes it very clear that insurance can't mandate contraception, it's kind of a big deal and what the first amendment is all about!!
And i thought Glaber couldn't get any worse, then i looked at this Deviant art gallery, Dear god what is wrong with you it's like your whole perspective on life is fucked!
[QUOTE=Source;34492557]And i thought Glaber couldn't get any worse, then i looked at this Deviant art gallery, Dear god what is wrong with you it's like your whole perspective on life is fucked![/QUOTE]
Glaber is basically what is wrong with humanity in general, all mashed up into one person.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;34492231]Um you're just an australian so you don't know but the first amendment makes it very clear that insurance can't mandate contraception, it's kind of a big deal and what the first amendment is all about!![/QUOTE]
The insurence isn't mandating contraception. They are mandated to cover it if you CHOOSE to use contraception. There is a huge difference.
We have to cover the cost of contraceptives =\= YOU MUST USE CONTRACEPTIVES, SORRY NO CHOICE IT'S THE LAW.
It's perfectly constitutional. This is an across the board law that affects all insurance plans. If it specifically allowed Catholics to be excused from insuring contraception it would be unconstitutional as it favors one faith. If it excused any religion from insuring measures that religion opposes, it could potentially lead to nasty loopholes where people could use religion as an excuse to not cover people.
EDIT: [B]1000 POST MILESTONE[/B]
[QUOTE=Zeke129;34492231]Um you're just an australian so you don't know but the first amendment makes it very clear that insurance can't mandate contraception, it's kind of a big deal and what the first amendment is all about!![/QUOTE]
damn you're right
you win this time, glaber
glaber is [I]never [/I]right
[QUOTE=waxrock;34493872]glaber is [I]never [/I]right[/QUOTE]
And if he is, check the earlier rule.
[QUOTE=Source;34492557]And i thought Glaber couldn't get any worse, then i looked at this Deviant art gallery, Dear god what is wrong with you it's like your whole perspective on life is fucked![/QUOTE]
[img]http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/353/2/6/foe_tribute_by_glaber-d4jmf6z.png[/img]
:suicide:
[QUOTE=Garik;34494276][IMG]http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/353/2/6/foe_tribute_by_glaber-d4jmf6z.png[/IMG]
:suicide:[/QUOTE]
It's official, Galber is everything Facepunch hates all rolled in to one package.
The perfect troll.
[quote]But Catholic leaders have noted that Catholic hospitals can only invoke the "conscience clause" -- and get an exemption on the new rules -- if they turn away patients of other faiths, something that is also anathema to the church.[/quote]
This is incredibly fucked up. Basically if they want to utilize their constitutional right to freedom of religion, they have to discriminate against people of different religions.
Glaber has been fucked every which way to the point where we're going after his DA. I blame all of this on him.
Holy crusade number 20
[QUOTE=yawmwen;34499232]This is incredibly fucked up. Basically if they want to utilize their constitutional right to freedom of religion, they have to discriminate against people of different religions.[/QUOTE]
If you're presenting yourself as a hospital you should be required to not refuse any kind of medical service based on religion, under the penalty of losing your ability to be a hospital
[QUOTE=Zeke129;34499395]If you're presenting yourself as a hospital you should be required to not refuse any kind of medical service based on religion, under the penalty of losing your ability to be a hospital[/QUOTE]
But they can refuse medical service based on religion in order to invoke the constitution.
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