This just came in my twitter feed. Authorities say a man and a woman shot dead, and they are after the suspect.
[url]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33478581?ns_mchannel=social&ns_campaign=bbc_breaking&ns_source=twitter&ns_linkname=news_central[/url]
[editline]10th July 2015[/editline]
Suspect got arrested. That was fast.
[editline]10th July 2015[/editline]
Also, victims was a 84 year old woman related to the suspect, and a cyclist
The title got me very worried. Thought it might've been a terrorist attack.
Several killed? I mean, any death is bad enough, but two isn't several.
[QUOTE=MatheusMCardoso;48163375]The title got me very worried. Thought it might've been a terrorist attack.
Several killed? I mean, any death is bad enough, but two isn't several.[/QUOTE]
Gun violence in Germany is quite rare afaik, especially if it's on the street and with multiple targets like here.
It's likely the headline is a bit more sensational than usual due to this.
(It's also probably translated from "mehrere", which in German usually does mean two or more without weight towards more than two.
[editline]edit[/editline] Yes, the German publications all seem to use "zwei" or the more clickbaity "mehrere".)
[del][editline]edit[/editline] I just saw BBC uses "two". In that case I assume Ignhelper wanted to enhance click-through rates too :v:[/del]
[editline]edit[/editline] See below.
What leaves me a bit puzzled is this part: [quote][...]
The local Nuernberger Zeitung newspaper said he was captured by workers at the gas station, after threatening them with a gun.
They then tied him up and contacted the police.
[...][/quote]
It's a good outcome, sure, but I wonder why/how they did that.
[QUOTE=Tamschi;48163658][del]Gun violence in Germany is quite rare afaik, especially if it's on the street and with multiple targets like here.
It's likely the headline is a bit more sensational than usual due to this.
(It's also probably translated from "mehrere", which in German usually does mean two or more without weight towards more than two.
[editline]edit[/editline] Yes, the German publications all seem to use "zwei" or more clickbaity "mehrere".)[/del]
[editline]edit[/editline] I just saw BBC uses "two". In that case I assume Ignhelper wanted to enhance click-through rates too :v:
What leaves me a bit puzzled is this part:
It's a good outcome, sure, but I wonder why/how they did that.[/QUOTE]
Thread title came from the same article before it was edited. So at that time, they reported 'several', I just copied it.
[QUOTE=Ignhelper;48163775]Thread title came from the same article before it was edited. So at that time, they reported 'several', I just copied it.[/QUOTE]
In that case I suspect they really did pick it up from a German source and translated it badly at first.
[editline]edit[/editline]
[URL="https://archive.is/y91vQ"]This is what the page looked like two hours ago[/URL], likely before it was edited into the version you saw.
I wonder how often they completely replace/edit articles without notice.
(You can easily save snapshots with the [URL="https://archive.is/"]archive.is bookmarklet[/URL].
If it changes afterwards it's easy to find the previous version by using it again.)
Strange. I'm glad they got the guy. How did he get the gun if gun control is so tight in Germany?
[QUOTE=TheNerdPest14;48164347]Strange. I'm glad they got the guy. How did he get the gun if gun control is so tight in Germany?[/QUOTE]
[URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_legislation_in_Germany"]You can still own guns if you have a license here.[/URL]
It's probably not really all that rare, even though the controls are strict.
Aside from that, I very much doubt there aren't quite a few illegal firearms in the country.
You can move practically anything very freely around the [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengen_Area"]Schengen Area[/URL] once it's inside, so while Germany has very strict laws for legal gun ownership and customs for wares from elsewhere in general that's ineffective for anything inserted elsewhere into the region (or produced there. I'm not sure but I somehow doubt much of it is intercontinental trade).
Nonetheless the firearm homicide rate in Germany is relatively low with iirc ~200 deaths in total in a year.
I haven't really heard about illegal firearms being a large problem either as such (though the infamous rocker gangs here seem to be often involved with arms trafficking in addition to other kinds of organised crimes).
Since they consider a personal motive it's probably a legal firearm, but afaik that information is normally not mentioned in the reporting here.
inb4 more anti-gun laws, just when I was going to start working to get a license.
Tragic to think that this man seemed to have killed a relative of his. Has any connection been made to the cyclist yet? Seems kinda random next to an elderly relative of his.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Meme reply" - Craptasket))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Robinate;48164836]inb4 more anti-gun laws, just when I was going to start working to get a license.
Tragic to think that this man seemed to have killed a relative of his. Has any connection been made to the cyclist yet? Seems kinda random next to an elderly relative of his.[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/ansbach-schuetze-wurde-von-tankstellen-mitarbeitern-ueberwaeltigt-a-1043103.html"]According to Spiegel Online[/URL] he didn't know any of his victims.
At the gas station he put down his pistol on the counter and employee took it.
Then two mechanics subdued him.
In any case, I don't really expect them to increase legislation.
Even if they may talk about it this government isn't exactly known for knee-jerk reactions (other than shutting of nuclear power...), so if there's a hole in the law they'll probably fix it fairly accurately.
[URL="https://archive.is/HxS7u"]Overall[/URL] people are more angry about the terrible reporting as far as I can tell.
Washington Post is reporting (can't link, on mobile) the man was seeing a psych for mental health issues and had a permit for 2 firearms. Seems kinda stupid that the psych wouldn't order them seized for medical reasons.
[QUOTE=DaCommie1;48165301]Washington Post is reporting (can't link, on mobile) the man was seeing a psych for mental health issues and had a permit for 2 firearms. Seems kinda stupid that the psych wouldn't order them seized for medical reasons.[/QUOTE]
To my understanding doctors need to report mental health issues to the police if the person in question owns a ownership license. Problem is, you're not going to tell your shrink that you have license if it means it's going to get revoked :/
The shrink should be able to see that in their records, or the police should. In Canada if you're medically diagnosed with a mental illness, it doesn't matter if your doctor told the cops or not, there's a system that automatically catches it on your record and the RCMP will be by for an interview.
Glad they stopped this guy so quick, but it's unfortunate that he killed anyone in the first place.
[QUOTE=Tamschi;48164449]Aside from that, I very much doubt there aren't quite a few illegal firearms in the country.[/QUOTE]
Last time I was aware of it, about 2012-2013ish, getting a handgun in Germany was a little less expensive than elsewhere in Europe, about fifty to a hundred dollars difference, but it really depended on certain factors. I guess the conversion of replica or deactivated firearms are a big thing in Europe, (as opposed to here, where they're just stolen) so the market isn't so impressive but it's definitely there. Then there's an absolute skyrocketing in price once you make the switch to new and authentic illicit arms, and those I'm guessing are stolen from military bases because that market has some interesting options.
Of course it's been a couple years so I don't know if any of that is even relevant anymore.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;48166472][...]
Of course it's been a couple years so I don't know if any of that is even relevant anymore.[/QUOTE]
It sounds plausible, considering [URL="http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1474848"]Explosives stolen from a French military base[/URL] happened.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;48166472]
Last time I was aware of it, about 2012-2013ish, getting a handgun in Germany was a little less expensive than elsewhere in Europe, about fifty to a hundred dollars difference, but it really depended on certain factors. I guess the conversion of replica or deactivated firearms are a big thing in Europe, (as opposed to here, where they're just stolen) so the market isn't so impressive but it's definitely there. Then there's an absolute skyrocketing in price once you make the switch to new and authentic illicit arms, and those I'm guessing are stolen from military bases because that market has some interesting options.
Of course it's been a couple years so I don't know if any of that is even relevant anymore.[/QUOTE]
converting deactivated or replica firearms is extremely hard and requires tools that one could much more easily make something like a sten gun with.
Replica guns never have proper dimensions and don't have recievers made out of materials that could withstand firing a round,
deactivated firearms are usually drilled through the barrel/reciever and welded shut so reactivating them would is extremely hard and would likely result in a catastrophical failure when you try to shoot it aka explosion.
Most guns used in crimes in europe are stolen or smuggled in from eastern europe.
[QUOTE=moffe;48169586]converting deactivated or replica firearms is extremely hard and requires tools that one could much more easily make something like a sten gun with.
Replica guns never have proper dimensions and don't have recievers made out of materials that could withstand firing a round,
deactivated firearms are usually drilled through the barrel/reciever and welded shut so reactivating them would is extremely hard and would likely result in a catastrophical failure when you try to shoot it aka explosion.
Most guns used in crimes in europe are stolen or smuggled in from eastern europe.[/QUOTE]To be perfectly honest I think you're absolutely wrong. You're not [i]supposed[/i] to shoot with a barrel that's had it's holes plugged but you can with everything up to the most powerful rifle rounds. Mostly barrels explode due to squibs, but beyond that they're kind of hard to actually blow up. Mostly the real concern is fractures in the structure that can turn into fissures which lead to catastrophic failure, and receivers are far, far more forgiving since they're not being forced to contain high pressure gas.
As for replica firearms, there's no special magic steel that goes into making firearms so they use the same materials. Get some plain 3/4 inch steel rod and you'll be able to drill it out and you can put a bullet through it no problem up to .223, and if you treat the steel you'll be able to increase in caliber without worry. So all a replica firearm [i]really[/i] needs is the actual parts that touch the bullet. If it's a blank-firing pistol or rifle (why these exist I have no idea, but apparently they're a thing with Europeans) there is no guarantee that the action is functionally any different than a real firearm and likely just needs some work on the bolt, the barrel cleared of the gas choke, and probably a modification to the magazine to take real ammunition.
Yes, I get your point that it would be easier to make a firearm from scratch and that's what I would do ideally, but if I had to do something quick I'd just take a shitty .38 blank pistol and turn it into a .380 ACP and be done with it.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;48176223]To be perfectly honest I think you're absolutely wrong. You're not [i]supposed[/i] to shoot with a barrel that's had it's holes plugged but you can with everything up to the most powerful rifle rounds. Mostly barrels explode due to squibs, but beyond that they're kind of hard to actually blow up. Mostly the real concern is fractures in the structure that can turn into fissures which lead to catastrophic failure, and receivers are far, far more forgiving since they're not being forced to contain high pressure gas.
As for replica firearms, there's no special magic steel that goes into making firearms so they use the same materials. Get some plain 3/4 inch steel rod and you'll be able to drill it out and you can put a bullet through it no problem up to .223, and if you treat the steel you'll be able to increase in caliber without worry. So all a replica firearm [i]really[/i] needs is the actual parts that touch the bullet. If it's a blank-firing pistol or rifle (why these exist I have no idea, but apparently they're a thing with Europeans) there is no guarantee that the action is functionally any different than a real firearm and likely just needs some work on the bolt, the barrel cleared of the gas choke, and probably a modification to the magazine to take real ammunition.
Yes, I get your point that it would be easier to make a firearm from scratch and that's what I would do ideally, but if I had to do something quick I'd just take a shitty .38 blank pistol and turn it into a .380 ACP and be done with it.[/QUOTE]
Replica firearms are not all made from the same materials as the real thing. Zamak does not equal tool steel, and mild steal due not equal heat treated and hardened steel. You can't just bore a hole in a mild steel tube and expect it to handle 55,000 PSI of pressure coming from a .223, especially if there's a tight bore. Even a .38 blank pistol will only get one or two shots out of it because it is not intended to handle the pressure spikes that having a projectile creates. You can get away with making zip guns with .380's and 12ga shells because they're low pressure rounds to begin with, but even a 9mm could blow up in your hand because of its higher pressures.
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