Israelis gather in Tel Aviv to protest against Israel's actions in Gaza - Polidicks

[video=youtube;gMsvo1e1SLE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMsvo1e1SLE[/video] [QUOTE]TEL AVIV, Aug 10 — More than 150 Israelis protested in Tel Aviv yesterday against a Gaza war entering its second month, in defiance of a police ban on the assembly that cited military restrictions on public gatherings in cities within range of rocket fire. The relatively small turnout was similar to the numbers that have shown up for most weekly demonstrations held since Israel launched an offensive against the Hamas Islamist militants in Gaza on July 8, underscoring the broad public support in Israel behind the war. Slogans daubed on banners held by protesters read: “Stop the massacre,” and “Free Gaza.” Halleli Pinson, one of the women who attended, said she objected to “the bombing of Gaza and basically we are calling to end the cycle of violence here”. About two dozen war supporters held a counter-protest nearby, but there were no reported clashes between the two groups. Israeli police had earlier banned the protest citing military restrictions against holding public gatherings in cities targeted by rockets fired from Gaza. But spokesman Micky Rosenfeld said none of those who attended the illegal gathering were arrested. More than 3,000 rockets have been fired at Israel, and some of them at Tel Aviv, during the past month. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said the fighting was aimed at forcing a halt to such firings and to destroy tunnels dug by militants which Israel said gunmen intended to use as conduits to infiltrate the country’s borders. Leftist Israelis, objecting to the bloodshed and civilian casualties caused by the fighting, have complained of feeling silenced by the patriotic fervor pervading much of Israel during the war. They have also cited threats published on social media pages in past weeks to assault or even kill dissenters. The private Israel Democracy Institute think-tank found in a survey late last month that as many as 95 per cent of Israelis supported the war, and only 7 per cent were opposed. [/QUOTE] - See more at: [url]http://www.themalaymailonline.com/world/article/in-israel-150-jews-defy-police-to-protest-gaza-war#sthash.of0ogYzI.dpuf[/url] [QUOTE]Since the Israeli attack on Gaza started in early July, left-wing activists have held demos in center Tel Aviv every weekend - and last Saturday was no exception. In all the demos, right-wing protesters have gathered near by, shouting racists slogans and attacking the activists. Last week, a few activists were injured at the end of the demo, and right wing protesters followed activists to their homes and attacked them. Last Saturday, as protesters were starting to gather in Habima square in central Tel Aviv, policemen approached anyone who was wearing black or holding a sign, saying he or she had to leave the area - as there was no permission for the demo. About 300 protesters did gather in the area, with the police stating to push and arrest people. As the police evicted the protesters from the square into a small street, people were shouting "Jews and Arabs refuse to by enemies" and "In Gaza and in Sderot children want to live". In the street behind the square, policemen arrested 17 activists, violently taking them into a police van and driving them to a far police station. After the arrest, the protest marched to a park near by. One protester told us" We came here every week to protest against the war, and to say there will be no solution with force, only by agreement" He added: "In previous weeks we were attacked by right wing protesters, but this week the police deiced not to allow us to gather, and it is clear that it is part of a bigger process to limit the freedom of speech of army one who speaks against the government" [/QUOTE] - See more at: [url]http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/picture-pro-gaza-protest-tel-aviv-1232393973#sthash.859stPhW.dpuf[/url] [QUOTE]Gideon Levy doesn't want to meet in a coffee bar in Tel Aviv. He is fed up with being hassled in public and spat at, with people not willing to share the table next to him in restaurants. And now he is fed up with the constant presence of his bodyguards, not least because they too have started giving him a hard time about his political views. So he doesn't go out much any more and we sit in the calm of his living room, a few hundred yards from the Yitzhak Rabin Centre. Rabin's assassination by a rightwing Orthodox Jew in 1995 is itself a sobering reminder of the personal cost of peacemaking in Israel. In his column in Haaretz, Levy has long since banged the drum for greater Israeli empathy towards the suffering of the Palestinians. He is a well-known commentator on the left, and one of the few prepared to stick his head above the parapet. Consequently, he is no stranger to opposition from the right. But this time it is different. Yariv Levin, coalition chairman of the Likud-Beytenu faction in the Knesset, recently called for him to be put on trial for treason – a crime which, during wartime, is punishable by death. "It is time we stop regarding despicable phenomena like this with tolerance," Levin said of Levy. Soon after that interview, Eldad Yaniv, a former political adviser to ex-prime minister Ehud Barack, wrote on his Facebook page: "The late Gideon Levy. Get used to it." Levy's unpardonable crime is vocal opposition to the war and to the bombing of Gaza. According to recent polls, support for the military operation in Gaza among the Jewish Israeli public stands somewhere between 87% (Channel 10 News) and 95% (Israel Democracy Institute). Even those who are secretly against the war are cautious about voicing their opinion openly. Thus public opinion went ballistic when Levy attacked those who were bombing Gaza by inverting the well-known Hebrew phrase "Hatovim La tayyis" – which means: the best ones go to the air force – by writing "Haraim La tayyis": the worst ones go to the air force. Even in a time of peace this would be seen as a provocative statement, a heresy against what Levy sees as Israel's real religion: military security. But in its current mood, this is not the sort of thing that you can easily say out loud. Even Peace Now, the backbone of the Israeli peace movement, has been remarkably guarded, carefully avoiding official participation in public demonstrations. Peace Now was founded in 1978 by former members of the military who came out strongly in favour of peace with Egypt. It helped mobilise 10% of the Israeli public – some 400,000 people – to turn out against the 1982 war in Lebanon. But this time it is a shadow of its former self. "What is different this time is the anti-democratic spirit. Zero tolerance of any kind of criticism, opposition to any kind of sympathy with the Palestinians," says Levy. "You shouldn't be surprised that the 95% [are in favour of the war], you should be surprised at the 5%. This is almost a miracle. The media has an enormous role. Given the decades of demonisation of the Palestinians, the incitement and hatred, don't be surprised the Israeli people are where they are." "So what's the point of a peace movement if it refuses to condemn a war like this?" I ask Mossi Raz, former general secretary of Peace Now. Some people have demonstrated, he assures me; 6,000 came out on the streets the Saturday before last (and were taunted as "dirty Israelis" by the rightwing counter demonstration). And in the circumstances, 6,000 feels like quite an achievement. But he admits that the mainstream protest movements and parties of the left all fall pretty silent when the sirens start to wail. "People tend to demonstrate only after the war is over," Raz explains. And he expects the same to happen again this time. During the early part of the 1982 war, before the large turnouts, polls gave military action 86% support. But during a time of war, opposition is seen as disloyalty, as siding with the enemy. People will protest at the government, but not the military. I raise an eyebrow about the idea of protesting against a war only when it is over. He nods with a certain exasperation and asks me, as a joke: "So, shall we go out now and protest the Falklands war?" Amos Oz, Israel's great literary conscience, explains to me that the peace movement was dealt a harsh blow eight years ago when Ariel Sharon pulled the army and the settlers out of Gaza only for the situation to get worse. "Since then there have been 10,000 rockets fired from the Gaza strip." Middle-of-the-road Israelis have lost faith in the idea that you could swap land for peace. For him, the current military operation is "excessive but justified" and he is scornful of the high-minded European reaction. "That's the problem with Europeans. They launch a petition and then go and sleep and feel good about themselves" – something he explains with reference to European history. I feel he is having a go at me. And I know he is laid up in bed with a bad knee. So I don't rise to the bait. He continues: "The history of warfare in the 20th century has made Europeans see things in black and white, like a Hollywood movie, with good guys and bad guys. But it's more complicated than that." Yes, he condemns the Netanyahu government and the catalogue of inaction and missed opportunities. Yes, the operation in Gaza has been disproportionate. "From one perspective it looks like a David and Goliath story, with Israel being the ruthless Goliath and the Palestinians being the poor little David. But if you see the conflict as between Israel and the whole of the rest of the Arab world, who then is David and who is Goliath?" I attempt to shift Oz off this well-trodden ground by talking about Israeli poetry, trying to come at things sideways. I tell him I have always loved the Yehuda Amichai poem "From the place where we are right, flowers will not grow in the spring." He agrees. It's a wonderful poem. "All married couples should have that poem above their bed," he says. And then he says something that feels to me like a real shift in his position. Previously he has described the Israeli/Palestinian conflict as a Sophoclean tragedy over land in which both sides have a claim to right on their side; as a battle, as he put it of "right versus right". But now, he says, this is a battle of "wrong versus wrong". No one is in the right any more. It is a very statesmanlike form of opposition. But it is hardly emphatic. "Amos Oz is not yet in a position to admit entire Israeli guilt," Levy explains. "He is a real man of peace, but he grew up in a different generation, the generation before me. He grew up in this weak state, struggling to survive, created out of nothing. This is his background." This sort of self-critical vigilance is rare but understandable given the sort of reporting that goes on in themainstream media in Israel. Most newspapers and TV channels are simply cheerleaders for the government line, offering a constant diet of fear and fallen heroes, with little evidence of any of the atrocities going on in Gaza. The problem is, ordinary Israelis have little idea what has been going on. I know so much more about what is happening in Gaza when I'm sitting in London than I do in Tel Aviv. Under this level of information manipulation, how can ordinary Israelis be expected to be critical?[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/06/gaza-israel-movement-that-dare-not-speak-its-name[/url]

Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.

Major respect to the protestors. I was actually thinking all Israelis are as indoctrinated as the poster above.

I've not been keeping up with this much - other than the bombings of UN schools. What are the militants demands in Gaza anyway? Or are they just firing rockets in blind hope it will irritate Israel.

[sarcasm]Because hamas are totally innocent in this conflict.[/sarcasm]

[QUOTE=Baron von Hax;45657983][sarcasm]Because hamas are totally innocent in this conflict.[/sarcasm][/QUOTE] [sarcasm]Because Israel is totally innocent in this conflict.[/sarcasm]

[QUOTE=Sam Za Nemesis;45657971]Honestly he has his points, Hamas has worse "indoctrination" to their population for the complete destruction if israel and they've proven multiple times they can't keep cease fires, demilitarizing them could be a good solution to keep peace to the region, the Israeli bombings have been over the top as well, although it's hard to keep much control in a urban warfare[/QUOTE] It's incredibly easy to "Indoctrinate" a populace when your enemy is targeting civilians and bombing shelters and hospitals.

[QUOTE=Sam Za Nemesis;45657971]Honestly he has his points, Hamas has worse "indoctrination" to their population for the complete destruction if israel and they've proven multiple times they can't keep cease fires, demilitarizing them could be a good solution to keep peace to the region, the Israeli bombings have been over the top as well, although it's hard to keep much control in a urban warfare[/QUOTE] Israel does all the indoctrination the Palestinians would ever need. If I lived in Gaza - I would be sympathetic towards Hamas at best, and a supporter at worst.

[quote]In all the demos, right-wing protesters have gathered near by, shouting racists slogans and attacking the activists. Last week, a few activists were injured at the end of the demo, and right wing protesters followed activists to their homes and attacked them. [/quote] That's lame, man.

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] I think we found Netanyahu's Facepunch account.

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] Uhuh. Because people protesting against the disproportionate use of force resulting in hundreds of needless civilian deaths are "traitors" now. Please do try and explain this logic, if you even can.

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] Reading SH you'd think the majority of Israeli people on this forum are brainwashed.

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] Cancerous mentality like this is what's ruining this country. Finding its way all the way up to the government and retroactively fueling this conflict. Anyone who uses 'leftist' as a derogatory term of disapproval in this country is an absolute idiot who is unfit to be taken seriously.

[QUOTE=Taggart;45658054]Uhuh. Because people protesting against the disproportionate use of force resulting in hundreds of needless civilian deaths are "traitors" now. Please do try and explain this logic, if you even can.[/QUOTE] Sounds like the kind of logic you'd find in nazi germany.

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] THREE THOUSAND ROCKETS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[QUOTE=Bobie;45658148]THREE THOUSAND ROCKETS!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/QUOTE] nooooooooo but real talk it must be p horrible and stressful living under rockets

The mentality Hammer7 uses to describe his message is something that groups like Hamas uses to it's own advantage. Because they don't feel revenge, justice or loss due enemy actions- only victory.

[QUOTE=Mecha Pirate;45658305]The mentality Hammer7 uses to describe his message is something that groups like Hamas uses to it's own advantage. Because groups like Hamas don't feel revenge, justice or loss due enemy actions- only victory.[/QUOTE] I just finished watching this documentary about the Shin Bet, and what you said really relate to it. [video=youtube;FWx0e7KXg0Q]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWx0e7KXg0Q[/video]

[QUOTE=Ignhelper;45658426]I just finished watching this documentary about the Shin Bet, and what you said really relate to it. [/QUOTE] So .. from what I understand .. the terrorists falsely accused civilians of being terrorists? Or am I missing something else that's in the full documentary?

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] Are you implying people with a different opinion are traitors? because that's what I am reading.

Also, I don't know why people call the ISA the Shin Bet. Not that it really matters anyway .. just makes more sense.

The last statement is unnecessary drama, imo.

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] JIDF pls go

Nice to see some protests coming from Israelis themselves. It's difficult, and I think brave to stand up to your fellow countrymen in peaceful protest...

[QUOTE=Kardia;45658717]Nice to see some protests coming from Israelis themselves. It's difficult, and I think brave to stand up to your fellow countrymen in peaceful protest...[/QUOTE] For what its worth, I think so far the pro peace protests have been significantly larger than the "death to Arabs" ones. [editline]11th August 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=Hammer7;45657887]Yeah, take IDF out of Gaza, shut down Iron Dome and open borders. Can't wait for more rockets and suicide bombers. Every country has a traitors and here you see a nice example.[/QUOTE] I want to say something intelligent but fuck it. Fuck you. Assholes like you are the reason "leftist" has become a derogatory term here.

Excuse me, but those are the same people who screamed for sharing the Iron Dome with Gaza. They don't give a shit about making peace with palestinians, they simply protest against IDF dealing with potential treat parroting about "mass murder". If they want to support Gaza - fine, it's their own choice. But instead of making a valid opinion it came down to generic pro-palestinian protest. And watching israeli people doing it in Israel really puts me off. I'm not supporting civilian casualties in Gaza but I'm also not supporting a bunch of idiotic protestors. Hell, if shit goes real, who's gonna protect them if not IDF? US marines? Russian troops? Who?

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45659522]Excuse me, but those are the same people who screamed for sharing the Iron Dome with Gaza. They don't give a shit about making peace with palestinians, they simply protest against IDF dealing with potential treat parroting about "mass murder". If they want to support Gaza - fine, it's their own choice. But instead of making a valid opinion it came down to generic pro-palestinian protest. And watching israeli people doing it in Israel really puts me off. I'm not supporting civilian casualties in Gaza but I'm also not supporting a bunch of idiotic protestors. Hell, if shit goes real, who's gonna protect them if not IDF? US marines? Russian troops? Who?[/QUOTE] Whatever. You're perfectly entitled not to agree with them. But the moment you label them "traitors" because they have the wrong opinion you're not just "not supporting" them. You're denying them the right to have that opinion. You're legitimizing violence against them. You're being a DICK. On the internet. Think about that for a moment. THE INTERNET!

[QUOTE=ScumBunny;45659602]Whatever. You're perfectly entitled not to agree with them. But the moment you label them "traitors" because they have the wrong opinion you're not just "not supporting" them. You're denying them the right to have that opinion. You're legitimizing violence against them. You're being a DICK. On the internet. Think about that for a moment. [b]THE INTERNET![/b][/QUOTE] *thunder cracks* I get that you have a different opinion, but it just so happens, Hammer7, that your different opinion bars other different opinions from being valid, therefore resulting in a contradiction on your behalf. You can't have a different opinion that says that you can't have a different opinion. Does that make sense? If you answered yes, then you missed the point of this post :v:

[QUOTE=ScumBunny;45659602]Whatever. You're perfectly entitled not to agree with them. But the moment you label them "traitors" because they have the wrong opinion you're not just "not supporting" them. You're denying them the right to have that opinion. You're legitimizing violence against them. [B]You're being a DICK. On the internet.[/B] Think about that for a moment. THE INTERNET![/QUOTE] Implying I'm the first person ever who did it. Guess I tried too hard for senpai to notice me...

[QUOTE=Hammer7;45659786]Implying I'm the first person ever who did it. Guess I tried too hard for senpai to notice me...[/QUOTE] Your backpedalling skills are awful.