B.C. Human Rights Tribunal to consider striking gender designation from birth certificates
279 replies, posted
[URL]http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/national/Human+Rights+Tribunal+consider+striking+gender/11081959/story.html[/URL]
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/GXTDAPJ.png[/IMG]
[quote]After successfully lobbying provincial and federal governments to make it easier to amend sex designations on key identity documents, transgender Canadians are now pushing for another change: to abolish gender references altogether from birth certificates.The B.C. Human Rights Tribunal has agreed to review complaints filed by the Trans Alliance Society and a handful of transgender and intersex individuals, who argue that doctors should stop assigning the sex of a baby based on a quick inspection of the baby’s genitals at birth when there’s a possibility they may identify under a different gender, or no gender, years later.
“Birth certificates (may) give false information about people and characterize them in a way that is actually wrong, that assumes to be right, and causes people … actual harm,” said Morgane Oger, a transgender woman in Vancouver and chair of the society.
“It’s considered true and infallible when it isn’t.”
Earlier this year, Citizenship and Immigration Canada announced that it, too, would no longer require proof of sex-reassignment surgery in order to change the sex designation on a citizenship certificate. It now will accept an amended birth certificate.
But advocates say the changes do not go far enough because governments are still certifying as true information recorded at birth which they know may be wrong in some cases.
The current regime falsely presumes there are two genders, that genders never change and that you can tell a child’s gender at birth, said Vancouver human rights lawyer barbara findlay, who is representing the complainants and spells her name in all lower case.[/quote]
We gotta conform to the wishes of the .3 percent of people who aren't Cis it seems. I guess if there's a .3 percent margin of error, that the 99.7 percent of correct diagnosis's are wrong, imperialist, and a human rights violation.
A program to easily change it later on? Sure. But this? This is just fucking stupid. At that point in life the baby literally doesn't know up from down, so mark whatever's between its legs and let things get sorted out when the kid grows up.
This is so stupid.
[QUOTE=Nikota;47813737]
We gotta conform to the wishes of the .3 percent of people who aren't Cis it seems.[/QUOTE]
I'm really starting to hate this movement because of things like this. people who don't feel that they're the gender they were born as are in an abnormal situation. why isn't it enough for society to accommodate their decisions? why should society completely invert itself just to pre-emptively cater to an unreasonable minority? it seems to me like this attitude has great potential to halt or even reverse some of the progress we've made with gender equality in the last few years.
[QUOTE=TestECull;47813771]A program to easily change it later on? Sure. But this? This is just fucking stupid. At that point in life the baby literally doesn't know up from down, so mark whatever's between its legs and let things get sorted out when the kid grows up.[/QUOTE]
The idea is the child can't know their gender so they shouldn't put it on the birth certificate or something like that.
I'm neutral.
[QUOTE=ThePinkPanzer;47813811]The idea is the child can't know their gender so they shouldn't put it on the birth certificate or something like that.
I'm neutral.[/QUOTE]
which is just utterly stupid. the concepts of Male and Female are physical things. we are all born as one of these, just like nearly every other living creature in the world. if someone decides that they're unsatisfied with the way they were born, that's their business, but that isn't a good reason to start pretending that humans aren't born either male or female.
[quote]After successfully lobbying provincial and federal governments to make it easier to amend [b]sex[/b] designations on key identity documents[/quote]
Aren't sex and gender different things, the former just referring to what genitals you're born with? This is literally people's feelings being hurt by facts.
[QUOTE=ThePinkPanzer;47813811]The idea is the child can't know their gender so they shouldn't put it on the birth certificate or something like that.
I'm neutral.[/QUOTE]
A child very much CAN know their gender.
You know how?
Look down.
If it's an innie, you're a girl! If it's an outie, you're a boy!
I'm not against transgenderism, I've talked to a lot of them and dated a few. No problem with it. But a Birth Certificate is a [i]statement of fact document[/i]. It's meant to certify you as a being.
The gender you're born as is definitely something that should be on that document.
One day society may evolve to the point in which gender as a concept does not exist and nobody discloses their sex to anyone besides their doctors and partners.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/GXTDAPJ.png[/IMG]
That's exactly what I'd expect someone pushing this to look like.
Just let em' change it later if they're so inclined. But at that age it's semi-relevant to have their actual gender on there.
[QUOTE=ThePinkPanzer;47813811]The idea is the child can't know their gender so they shouldn't put it on the birth certificate or something like that.
I'm neutral.[/QUOTE]
And when it comes down to it at the end of the day, only .3 percent of people end up as Trans. If you have a 99.7 percent degree of certainty, to say we need to change it entirely because of the will of the .3 percent of people who don't fall into the gender norms is a silly concept
[QUOTE=person11;47813868]One day society may evolve to the point in which gender as a concept does not exist and nobody discloses their sex to anyone besides their doctors and partners.[/QUOTE]
There must be good plastic surgeons in that society.
So how exactly is it useful ON the certificate?
[QUOTE=bitches;47813901]So how exactly is it useful ON the certificate?[/QUOTE]
Both your parents die and they need to know what you are without looking at your cock.
[QUOTE=Richoxen;47813905]Both your parents die and they need to know what you are without looking at your cock.[/QUOTE]
What do they need to look at it for?
[QUOTE=bitches;47813910]What do they need to look at it for?[/QUOTE]
To know what gender you are?
[QUOTE=Richoxen;47813913]To know what gender you are?[/QUOTE]
Okay, but how is that useful?
Don't birth certificates state sex, which is different from gender sort of?
[QUOTE=bitches;47813921]Okay, but how is that useful?[/QUOTE]
Possible medical reasons? So adoptive parents don't get a girl when they wanted a boy?
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;47813781]I'm really starting to hate this movement because of things like this. people who don't feel that they're the gender they were born as are in an abnormal situation. why isn't it enough for society to accommodate their decisions? why should society completely invert itself just to pre-emptively cater to an unreasonable minority? it seems to me like this attitude has great potential to halt or even reverse some of the progress we've made with gender equality in the last few years.[/QUOTE]
Why do you care? This won't negatively affect you in the slightest while opening up the possibilities for alternative expressions of gender.
[QUOTE=Richoxen;47813930]Possible medical reasons? So adoptive parents don't get a girl when they wanted a boy?[/QUOTE]
That's a good argument.
Thank you for listing your reason for being against this like a sane individual, without assuming asinine ideas about the opposition's argument, instead of shitposting along the lines of 'triggered omg liberal agenda'.
[QUOTE=thisispain;47813931]Why do you care? This won't negatively affect you in the slightest while opening up the possibilities for alternative expressions of gender.[/QUOTE]
Please tell me how a newborn will be expressing alternative genders.
why not just write birth sex instead of sex if its a problem, like how could you be offended by that, even if you get your bits converted you were still born with them
like your birth certificate is your first and definitely most important bit of identification, it should have everything they can possibly put
A Birth Certificate is a medical document, and as such is listing medical information like what parts you have. It's not something that needs to be changed, someone can change what gender they are later in life but a newborn is CERTAINLY not going to be doing that.
[QUOTE=bdd458;47813986]Please tell me how a newborn will be expressing alternative genders.[/QUOTE]
Another thing is that Children's brains literally aren't developed to make that kind of decision. If a kid says they want to only eat sweets, you don't placate it.
[QUOTE=mokkan;47813990]why not just write birth sex instead of sex if its a problem, like how could you be offended by that, even if you get your bits converted you were still born with them
like your birth certificate is your first and definitely most important bit of identification, it should have everything they can possibly put[/QUOTE]
That's actually a good solution.
[QUOTE=bitches;47813921]Okay, but how is that useful?[/QUOTE]
Not letting you into the marines, letting doctors know that you may have ovaries, letting doctors know your BMI is normal for your sex.
Personal things really.
[QUOTE=bdd458;47813986]Please tell me how a newborn will be expressing alternative genders.[/QUOTE]
That's very obvious not what I was saying but thanks, usually there are more steps to take when reducing arguments to absurdity.
By not stressing gender on a birth-certificate we normalize alternate gender expression as something healthy and positive in society. The pressure to be boy or girl will be less if it's not backed by a chief authority.
[QUOTE=d00msdaydan;47813928]Don't birth certificates state sex, which is different from gender sort of?[/QUOTE]
The way I understand it is that sex is your body and gender is you.
Brb checking my birth cert to see if it says sex or gender.
Edit:
It says sex.
[QUOTE=bdd458;47813986]Please tell me how a newborn will be expressing alternative genders.[/QUOTE]
He didn't say anything of the sort. What he implied was that assigning it at birth promotes society's ridiculous fascination with gender roles. However, I don't think removing this from the birth certificate will prevent any parents from being assholes to gender-questioning children, and that it isn't a bad thing to have listed medically speaking.
In what world is your birth certificate a medical document? I've never taken my birth certificate to the doctor; maybe in the United States it's different to Canada.
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