[quote=ABCNEWS]
A manhunt is underway for a rogue Afghan army soldier who shot dead an Australian comrade who was on guard duty in Afghanistan.
Lance Corporal Andrew Jones, 25, was at a patrol base in the Chora Valley when he was shot by an Afghan National Army (ANA) soldier who was sharing guard duties with him.
The Afghan soldier fled the scene and escaped despite being shot at by another ANA guard.
Lance Corporal Jones was airlifted to a medical facility at Tarin Kowt, where he later died.
He was on his first deployment to Afghanistan and was serving with the Mentoring Task Force, which is involved with training the Afghan army.
The ANA has expressed its "shock and outrage" at the shooting and vowed to track the soldier down.
Defence chief Angus Houston has confirmed a manhunt is underway.
"We have his name, we have his service number. So this was not an imposter, and I would characterise him as a rogue soldier," he said.
Lance Corporal Jones was one of two Australian servicemen who lost their lives in Afghanistan on Monday in what Air Chief Marshal Houston described as a "very bad day".
In a separate incident, Lieutenant Marcus Case, 27, was killed when a Chinook helicopter crashed east of Tarin Kowt.
Lieutenant Case, the youngest of six siblings, had recently flown helicopter rescue missions for the ADF during the Queensland floods.
Lance Corporal Jones and Lieutenant Case were both from Victoria.
The Defence Force is investigating both incidents.
Prime Minister Julia Gillard described news of the two deaths as "heartbreaking" and offered her condolences to the families of the two men.
"The nation will be thinking of these two families today," she said.
"They will be thinking of them with warmth; they will be sending their sincerest best wishes at this incredibly difficult time for those two families and for our nation."
Opposition Leader Tony Abbott said the soldiers' deaths were "tragic news" which would shock and sadden the nation.
Offering condolences to the men's families, he said his thoughts and prayers were also with their comrades.
"This is a tragedy for our country," he said.
"It's a terrible personal loss for the families involved but it remains an important cause. We must support our allies in Afghanistan."
Greens Leader Bob Brown has praised the soldiers for their commitment and offered his condolences, but says it is time for Australia to get out of Afghanistan.
"It is time for a very serious review and I call on the Prime Minister to reconsider the Australian troop commitment," he said.
"Like the Netherlands, we should bring our troops home safely to our shore."
Unavoidable risk
The death of Lance Corporal Jones been described as the "realisation of a long-held fear".
Australian Defence Association spokesman Neil James said the risk of an Afghan soldier turning rogue was an unavoidable one.
He said Australian soldiers serving in the mentoring units had always known one of their Afghan colleagues could turn on them.
"The Mentoring Task Force role is inherently dangerous because it involves, just as the training team in Vietnam did, working with the security forces of the country you're helping, and occasionally one of them will prove unreliable and be an enemy sympathiser," he said.
"We've said right from the start that this is a very, very dangerous role, especially because of the trust you need to have in the Afghan security force with people you work with.
Mr James says the risk is unavoidable in that type of job.
"Whenever you have this type of training and mentoring role that requires you to work very closely with members of a society that is riven by religious and political factionalism, there is always the risk that someone you're working with will either be working for the enemy indirectly or directly," he said.
But Mr James warned against using the incident to renew calls for an end to Australia's mission in Afghanistan.
"Let's have a debate, let's have an objective debate, but let's not have it full of subjective slogans like 'Oh dear, the job's too hard so we should quit'," he said.
'Shocked and disturbed'
Air Chief Marshal Houston says all Afghan soldiers enrolled in the ANA are vetted by NATO recruiters.
"Let me stress, we have been in Afghanistan on this mission for six years," he said.
"We've worked with thousands and thousands of Afghans through those six years right from the outset, and this is the first incident we've had of this nature."
Ms Gillard said Australians would be "shocked and disturbed" that a supposed friendly soldier would turn his firearm against an Australian.
"I think we've got a really shared want to get to the bottom of this and to understand it," she said.
But she urged people not to get discouraged by the setbacks, saying Australian troops have trained thousands of Afghan soldiers without a problem.
"I, personally, when I've been in Afghanistan, have heard our soldiers compliment members of the Afghan National Army on their professionalism and their determination," she said.
Ms Gillard said the Government was determined to "stay the course" in Afghanistan.
"We are in Afghanistan because we don't want it to be a safe haven for terrorists," she said.
"It has been in the past, and if we left a security vacuum in Afghanistan, it would be filled by terrorist groups from around the world."
[/quote]
Source:
[url]http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/05/31/3231591.htm?section=justin[/url]
Goddammit another case of friendly deliberate fire.
Atleast Afgan National Army wants to catch that scumbag.
That's not friendly fire... friendly fire is fire towards friendlies unintentionally or unknowingly.
Too many Aussie's lost their lives. Another one was lost today along with the guy who was killed by the ANA soldier.
Time for us to get out.
[QUOTE=DogGunn;30156014]Too many Aussie's lost their lives. Another one was lost today along with the guy who was killed by the ANA soldier.
Time for us to get out.[/QUOTE]
From a military perspective it's good as it provides combat experience and field equipment testing.
May they both rest in peace.
We pull out, the Taliban takes over again and more lives are lost. Only difference is it won't be on TV so no one cares.
The soldiers knew what they where getting into signing up
I think if we pull out now it would of just been a bigger bloody and costly waste to all NATO nations and the People of Afghanistan. We went there to do a job, lets finish it.
[QUOTE=-n3o-;30156492]I think if we pull out now it would of just been a bigger bloody and costly waste to all NATO nations and the People of Afghanistan. We went there to do a job, lets finish it.[/QUOTE]
problem is, it's never ending. the taliban can't lay down arms.
there will always be a war and unless we pull out "arbitrarily", we'll be there forever.
Or we successfully win the hearts and minds of the people, and slowly give them control. Which I believe we're doing.
Does the Afghan army draft people from the postal service, or something?
[QUOTE=-n3o-;30156684]Or we successfully win the hearts and minds of the people, and slowly give them control. Which I believe we're doing.[/QUOTE]
Doubt it. Not with the US involved.
[QUOTE=DogGunn;30156900]Doubt it. Not with the US involved.[/QUOTE]
Huh? Um.. who do you think is doing most of the work over there?
[QUOTE=DogGunn;30156900]Doubt it. Not with the US involved.[/QUOTE]
American soldiers are just like ours, sure they have a few retards in their army but so do we.
[QUOTE=-n3o-;30156939]Huh? Um.. who do you think is doing most of the work over there?[/QUOTE]
Exactly why there is more hate towards the US than Australia. They're doing more "work".
[editline]31st May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=balloninator;30156956]American soldiers are just like ours, sure they have a few retards in their army but so do we.[/QUOTE]
It's got nothing to do with individual soldiers but all to do with the current strategy. The US alone brings itself into much hate while it's in Afghanistan. There is no way to fix the situation other than to get out.
Nah, the general opinion of coalition forces is positive, they like us more than the Taliban. The main thing is though that they would prefer neither were there and they were just left alone. Because it's in both our best interests and theirs if the Taliban doesn't come back, they don't mind so much.
Honestly I'm just glad the ANA isn't corrupt enough to just ignore this. As the article states, another Afghan guard shot at him and they're trying to track him down.
I like how everyone whines when there country loses a soldier but (Even though it is sad) it is a war and it expected. Us Canadians are the ones taking the most soldiers but I still think we should stay in Afghanistan.
[editline]31st May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=-n3o-;30156939]Huh? Um.. who do you think is doing most of the work over there?[/QUOTE]
In reality the order of work is: Canada, UK and USA.
[QUOTE=yaik9a;30158063]I like how everyone whines when there country loses a soldier but (Even though it is sad) it is a war and it expected.[/quote]
Yes it is sad, and what makes it even sadder is the fact that we should not be there anymore.
[QUOTE=yaik9a;30158063]Us Canadians are the ones taking the most soldiers but I still think we should stay in Afghanistan.
In reality the order of work is: Canada, UK and USA.[/QUOTE]
No you're not - not even close.
Number of coalition troops in Afghanistan: 133,000
Number of American troops: 90,000
Number of British troops: 9,500
Number of German troops: 4,900
Number of French troops: 4,000
Number of Italian troops: 3,800
Number of Canadian troops: 2,900
[editline]1st June 2011[/editline]
fucking idiot.
[QUOTE=yaik9a;30158063]In reality the order of work is: Canada, UK and USA.[/QUOTE]
Source?
[QUOTE=DogGunn;30158265]Yes it is sad, and what makes it even sadder is the fact that we should not be there anymore.
No you're not - not even close.
Number of coalition troops in Afghanistan: 133,000
Number of American troops: 90,000
Number of British troops: 9,500
Number of German troops: 4,900
Number of French troops: 4,000
Number of Italian troops: 3,800
Number of Canadian troops: 2,900
[editline]1st June 2011[/editline]
fucking idiot.[/QUOTE]
Not sure if you know this but Canada , Britain and American are in the southern provinces which are the worst for Taliban. The rest are in the north which although they see little to some combat are not really helping the situation as the north is a already anti Taliban area.
[editline]31st May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;30158780]Source?[/QUOTE]
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Afghan_Opium_Production_2005_2007.JPG[/img]
In the south Helmand is the primary British deployment, Kabul is the Primary American Deployment and Kandahar Province is the primary Canadian deployment. As I said the South is the worst for Taliban and also Kandahar is the birthplace of the Taliban. In the north where it was always anti Taliban so the French, German and Australian force are doing less then the Americans, British and Canadians and so far per captia Canada has lost the most troops in Afghanistan.
[QUOTE=yaik9a;30161247][img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Afghan_Opium_Production_2005_2007.JPG[/img]
In the south Helmand is the primary British deployment, Kabul is the Primary American Deployment and Kandahar Province is the primary Canadian deployment. As I said the South is the worst for Taliban and also Kandahar is the birthplace of the Taliban. In the north where it was always anti Taliban so the French, German and Australian force are doing less then the Americans, British and Canadians and so far per captia Canada has lost the most troops in Afghanistan.[/QUOTE]
Still gonna need some sources for the deployment info and where the Taliban started.
A manhunt over a dead Australian soldier huh? Ain't gonna bring him back that's for sure.
I wonder how many of the Afghan victims wanted to go man hunting when their relatives have gotten killed by whatever reason. Oh no wait, they grieve and they pray.
[QUOTE=Megafanx13;30163039]Still gonna need some sources for the deployment info and where the Taliban started.[/QUOTE]
[quote]The Taliban's first major military activity was in 1994, when they marched northward from Maiwand and captured Kandahar City and the surrounding provinces, losing only a few dozen men.[37] When they took control of Kandahar in 1994, they forced the surrender of dozens of local Pashtun leaders who had presided over a situation of complete lawlessness and atrocities.[37][38] The Taliban also took-over a border crossing at Spin Baldak and an ammunition dump from Gulbuddin Hekmatyar. In the course of 1994, the Taliban took control of 12 of 34 provinces not under central government control, disarming the "heavily armed population". Militias controlling the different areas often surrendered without a fight.[9][/quote]
[QUOTE=yaik9a;30161247]Not sure if you know this but Canada , Britain and American are in the southern provinces which are the worst for Taliban. The rest are in the north which although they see little to some combat are not really helping the situation as the north is a already anti Taliban area.
[editline]31st May 2011[/editline]
[IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Afghan_Opium_Production_2005_2007.JPG[/IMG]
In the south Helmand is the primary British deployment, Kabul is the Primary American Deployment and Kandahar Province is the primary Canadian deployment. As I said the South is the worst for Taliban and also Kandahar is the birthplace of the Taliban. In the north where it was always anti Taliban so the French, German and Australian force are doing less then the Americans, British and Canadians and so far per captia Canada has lost the most troops in Afghanistan.[/QUOTE]
Oh so it doesn't matter the amount of people the US lost because we have more of them?
[QUOTE=DogGunn;30158265]Yes it is sad, and what makes it even sadder is the fact that we should not be there anymore.[/QUOTE]
I've got to ask what you think would happen if ISAF did withdraw tomorrow, because I really struggle to see anything other than a bloody Civil War followed by the systematic extermination of all those who collaberated with ISAF.
[QUOTE=ksenior;30156451]We pull out, the Taliban takes over again and more lives are lost. Only difference is it won't be on TV so no one cares.
The soldiers knew what they where getting into signing up[/QUOTE]
I dont think it said anyway on their form "You may be shot by traitors, double agents, spies or deserters"
[QUOTE=Mingebox;30156862]Does the Afghan army draft people from the postal service, or something?[/QUOTE]
I'm not surprised when a story like this comes up to be honest. It's been known for many years that the ANA has Taliban (or perhaps it's just people payed off by the Taliban) inside it's ranks, but most of the time they are only leaking information about upcoming ops.
The German KSK refuses to work with the ANA after the incident in 2005 (iirc) that let a high value target get away before the KSK could affect an arrest, because the op info was shared with ANA commanders.
[editline]31st May 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;30165070]Oh so it doesn't matter the amount of people the US lost because we have more of them?[/QUOTE]
Um where the fuck did he say that?
[QUOTE=Bat-shit;30163393]A manhunt over a dead Australian soldier huh? Ain't gonna bring him back that's for sure.
I wonder how many of the Afghan victims wanted to go man hunting when their relatives have gotten killed by whatever reason. Oh no wait, they grieve and they pray.[/QUOTE]
Or join the Taliban.
[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;30165070]Oh so it doesn't matter the amount of people the US lost because we have more of them?[/QUOTE]
No but Canada has less soldiers and we are putting more on the line then them. We only have 3 FOB with not enough soldiers to keep up a guard up with hiring contractors to man the walls. Aside from that we have one of the worst provinces. I not trying to downplay the USA and British contribution but the rest of NATO has been lazing back in the north.
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