[quote]Saudi Arabia says it has broken off diplomatic ties with Iran, amid a row over the Saudi execution of a prominent Shia Muslim cleric.
Saudi Foreign Minister Adel al-Jubeir was speaking after demonstrators had stormed the Saudi embassy in Tehran.
Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr and 46 others were executed on Saturday. Saudi Arabia found them guilty of "terrorism".[/quote]
[url]http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-35217328[/url]
[quote]The mass execution of 47 people on Saturday marked the most people put to death by Saudi Arabia on a single day since the 1980 killing of 63 rebels who seized Mecca's Grand Mosque in 1979. Nimr and three other Shiites, all accused of involvement in shooting police, attracted most attention in the region and beyond, with reports of protests in Shiite-majority Iran, as well as Bahrain, Yemen, Pakistan, and India-controlled Kashmir.
Nimr was the most vocal critic of the Saudi ruling family among the country Shiite minority. He had come to be seen as a leader of the sect's younger activists, who had tired of the failure of older, more measured leaders to achieve equality with Sunnis.
Relatives of Nimr, reached by telephone by Reuters, said authorities have them that his body had been buried "in a cemetery of Muslims" and would not be handed over to the family.
Iran's President Hassan Rouhani condemned the execution as "inhuman," but also urged the prosecution of "extremist individuals" for attacking the embassy and the Saudi consulate in the northeastern city of Mashhad, state media reported.[/quote]
[quote]UN High Commissioner for Human Rights Zeid Raad al-Hussein said it was not clear those killed were granted effective legal defense, while the scale of the executions was very disturbing "particularly as some of those sentenced to death were accused of non-violent crimes."
The 47 executions included 45 Saudis, one Egyptian, and a man from Chad. The four Shiites were convicted of involvement in shootings and petrol bomb attacks that killed several police during anti-government protests from 2011-13. More than 20 Shiites were shot dead by the authorities in those protests. Family members of the executed Shiites have denied they were involved in attacks and said they were only peaceful protesters against sectarian discrimination.[/quote]
[url]https://news.vice.com/article/saudi-arabia-cuts-ties-with-iran-as-fallout-from-mass-execution-continues[/url]
[quote]In a series of tweets, Iran’s Supreme Leader, Ali Khamenei, called Nimr a martyr whose blood was unfairly spilled by Saudi authorities, adding that “divine revenge will seize Saudi politicians.”[/quote]
[quote]Also on Sunday, a source at the ministry was quoted by state news agency SPA as rejecting Iran’s “hostile statements.”
“The Iranian regime has unveiled its real face in support of terrorism, which is considered a continuation of its policy aiming to destabilize the security of the region's countries,” the unidentified source said.[/quote]
[url]http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-protests-iran-saudi-arabia-execution-20160103-story.html[/url]
This is the better page to use for this discussion, because it's got the two sources.
-bit dickish on my part, just tired of war-
[QUOTE=Megadave;49448610]Oh well, as long as this doesn't turn into another Proxy war of US vs Russia I could care less. Bunch of terrorist sympathisers let them kill themselves. I feel for the people who are going to get caught in the crossfires though. Considering how barbaric they can be the losing side is going to get pretty fucked up. We better be prepared to take in the refugees.[/QUOTE]
I find it incredible that you're able to be so disconnected from the fact that a large part of the world is slowly tearing itself apart. Refugees are only part of a long list of consequences that can come from this.
[QUOTE=Megadave;49448610]Oh well, as long as this doesn't turn into another Proxy war of US vs Russia I could care less. Bunch of terrorist sympathisers let them kill themselves. I feel for the people who are going to get caught in the crossfires though. Considering how barbaric they can be the losing side is going to get pretty fucked up. We better be prepared to take in the refugees.[/QUOTE]
Having no diplomatic ties makes war easier and more probable to happen.
It's gonna be interesting how this will effect the US, as we've started cozying up to Iran, while still keeping Saudi Arabia as an ally. Might not mean much, but it could make negotiating shit in the Middle East a little bit more trickier.
[t]http://english.khamenei.ir/d/2016/01/02/4/1172.jpg[/t]
Poster from Iran
Left are Saudis, right is ISIS.
They are not taking this laying down
Iran rarely takes situations like this lying down.
This is not a good thing at all.
Hmm I'm starting to see a pattern of Saudi Arabia being completely unhinged fuckwits
[QUOTE=Lonestriper;49450236]Hmm I'm starting to see a pattern of Saudi Arabia being completely unhinged fuckwits[/QUOTE]
They've been unhinged fuckwits for a while now, just look at Yemen
Also oiling is falling and they know they're obviously going to get in a bit of shit too because a country that runs off oil for ~70% of their GDP is just asking to be fucked over
2016 is set to be an interesting year.
[QUOTE=Deri102;49449570]I find it incredible that you're able to be so disconnected from the fact that a large part of the world is slowly tearing itself apart. Refugees are only part of a long list of consequences that can come from this.[/QUOTE]
Why do you find that incredible? It's to be expected, the consequences from the Middle East have no affect on his daily life other then the gas prices or unless he were to run into a Syrian refugee in the states, which at this current time is unlikely which how big we are compared to Europe and how little we are taking in.
They need to keep trying diplomatic relations between most of the Middle Eastern countries, by stopping cooperative diplomacy there is a precedent set for stability.
Of course that's not the silver bullet for middle eastern instability like this, but having some sort of guiding hand by cooperative governments helps.
Course try telling Saudi Arabia that with the stubborn twats they have for govt.
[QUOTE=Deri102;49449570]I find it incredible that you're able to be so disconnected from the fact that a large part of the world is slowly tearing itself apart. Refugees are only part of a long list of consequences that can come from this.[/QUOTE]
What are we supposed to do? Just send more of our people to die? How do you suggest we solve this? Which of the evils are we going to support in this war? Both sides are barbaric scum. It's sad as fuck, but I don't see any way we can stop this without either letting it go or starting another massive war and making even more of our soldiers die. On top of that, attacking Iran means a war with Russia, and attacking Saudi Arabia would basically put every muslim against us (because of Mecca). And if we just depose the leaders this situation will just get even more worse, leaving a power vacuum to be filled by either ISIS or the next great evil. So unless you want even more american soldiers to die in a war that will probably end up zapping America of it's resources, probably causing a massive rebellion in the long run, there is really nothing that can be done. The only other way would get every other country involved, including China and North Korea. This is going to be nasty no matter what happens, I just don't want to see more American soldiers die for the same fucking land they've been fighting for the last 10 years and all progress will be reversed in a few years after we leave anyways.
[editline]3rd January 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=LtKyle2;49450295]2016 is set to be an interesting year.
Why do you find that incredible? It's to be expected, the consequences from the Middle East have no affect on his daily life other then the gas prices or unless he were to run into a Syrian refugee in the states, which at this current time is unlikely which how big we are compared to Europe and how little we are taking in.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, but a draft would have a massive impact on all American's lives, which is what it will come down to when we figure out that this is a war we should not be involved with.
[editline]3rd January 2016[/editline]
Tell me something, which side would you guys rather support? Because at this point they are nothing but 2 sides of the same damn coin. and chances are whichever side we support will end up just hating us anyways.
[QUOTE=LtKyle2;49450295]2016 is set to be an interesting year.
Why do you find that incredible? It's to be expected, the consequences from the Middle East have no affect on his daily life other then the gas prices or unless he were to run into a Syrian refugee in the states, which at this current time is unlikely which how big we are compared to Europe and how little we are taking in.[/QUOTE]
Just because something doesn't directly impact your daily life doesn't mean you should automatically not give a shit. I find that idiotic and self centered, sue me.
Right on, Iran! Tell it like it is.
[QUOTE=Megadave;49450343]What are we supposed to do? Just send more of our people to die? How do you suggest we solve this? Which of the evils are we going to support in this war? Both sides are barbaric scum. It's sad as fuck, but I don't see any way we can stop this without either letting it go or starting another massive war and making even more of our soldiers die. On top of that, attacking Iran means a war with Russia, and attacking Saudi Arabia would basically put every muslim against us (because of Mecca). And if we just depose the leaders this situation will just get even more worse, leaving a power vacuum to be filled by either ISIS or the next great evil. So unless you want even more american soldiers to die in a war that will probably end up zapping America of it's resources, probably causing a massive rebellion in the long run, there is really nothing that can be done. The only other way would get every other country involved, including China and North Korea. This is going to be nasty no matter what happens, I just don't want to see more American soldiers die for the same fucking land they've been fighting for the last 10 years and all progress will be reversed in a few years after we leave anyways. [/QUOTE]
I never implied that I had the faintest idea on how to solve this, I never even implied that you were supposed to have a solution either. I was simply pointing out the fact that the way you reacted to this event with a simple "oh well, if it doesn't affect my life i could care less" was so overly naïve that it shocked me. We live in a time plagued by attacks and massacres orchestrated by extremist groups that are forming because of events like this one. If it isn't directly impacting you now, it will at some point.
Edit: I'm not saying that I support either side. They've both participated in abhorrent and unacceptable acts. I'm just sick and tired of the "not my country, not my problem" mentality.
Maybe Iran should look in the mirror before it starts to condemn things:
[url]https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2015/07/irans-staggering-execution-spree/[/url]
[quote]The Iranian authorities are believed to have executed an astonishing 694 people between 1 January and 15 July 2015, said Amnesty International today, in an unprecedented spike in executions in the country.
This is equivalent to executing more than three people per day. At this shocking pace, Iran is set to surpass the total number of executions in the country recorded by Amnesty International for the whole of last year.
“Iran’s staggering execution toll for the first half of this year paints a sinister picture of the machinery of the state carrying out premeditated, judicially-sanctioned killings on a mass scale,” said Said Boumedouha, Deputy Director of Amnesty International’s Middle East and North Africa Programme.[/quote]
[QUOTE=Deri102;49450390]I never implied that I had the faintest idea on how to solve this, I never even implied that you were supposed to have a solution either. I was simply pointing out the fact that the way you reacted to this event with a simple "oh well, if it doesn't affect my life i could care less" was so overly naïve that it shocked me. We live in a time plagued by attacks and massacred orchestrated by extremist groups that are forming because of events like this one. If it isn't directly impacting you now, it will at some point.[/QUOTE]
I'll admit that part was a bit dickish of me, but I'm just tired of us sending in massive troops, many of them dying, then everything either goes back to normal or get's worse. Ever since Korea, all of our war progress has been erased. The only one that has halfway worked out was Afghanistan, and it's only because we still have troops there.
[QUOTE=Megadave;49450404]I'll admit that part was a bit dickish of me, but I'm just tired of us sending in massive troops, many of them dying, then everything either goes back to normal or get's worse. Ever since Korea, all of our war progress has been erased. The only one that has halfway worked out was Afghanistan, and it's only because we still have troops there.[/QUOTE]
America should have never set foot in the middle east in the first place. You reap what you sow.
[QUOTE=Deri102;49450412]America should have never set foot in the middle east in the first place. You reap what you sow.[/QUOTE]
The only bad part about this is the people who are doing the sowing aren't the ones reaping it. It's us the pawns that have to fight their wars, fix their problems, and all they get to do is sit back and watch as the world goes to shit because of their shitty decision making. I'm tired of it, let some other country deal with the shit, or even better send the people who caused this shit over there to fix it. I'm tired of paying the price for something I had no involvement in.
[QUOTE=Megadave;49450439]The only bad part about this is the people who are doing the sowing aren't the ones reaping it. It's us the pawns that have to fight their wars, fix their problems, and all they get to do is sit back and watch as the world goes to shit because of their shitty decision making. I'm tired of it, let some other country deal with the shit, or even better send the people who caused this shit over there to fix it. I'm tired of paying the price for something I had no involvement in.[/QUOTE]
On this, I definitely agree. And I completely understand your frustration, my own country (UK, flagdog lies) has been putting its feet into the same shit-pile and has suffered severe consequences for it too.
Sorry if my comments seemed aggressive, if you want to talk further about this, hit me up with a PM but let's not clog up the thread with an off-topic discussion
[QUOTE=Deri102;49450384]Just because something doesn't directly impact your daily life doesn't mean you should automatically not give a shit. I find that idiotic and self centered, sue me.[/QUOTE]
What would empty pity and sympathy bring them? What would us mourning over what has been going on for decades accomplish?
Not giving a shit is idiotic and selfish, you're right however getting involved into something like this beyond hosting a diplomatic talks and compromise session is just as idiotic and vain if we got pulled into a war with Iran.
Beyond annoying our government through petitions to not do anything stupid, we the common man face the effects of their choices.
Saudi executed a leader for being of Irans sect. Of course that'd cause shit, they knew it would.
Hopefully this doesn't end in a US invasion of Iran.
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49450700]Saudi executed a leader for being of Irans sect. Of course that'd cause shit, they knew it would.
Hopefully this doesn't end in a US invasion of Iran.[/QUOTE]
After Obama made that deal with Iran about nuclear shit? Iran could invade Iraq and Obama wouldn't budge.
[QUOTE=Cypher_09;49450387]Right on, Iran! Tell it like it is.[/QUOTE]
Iran and Saudis are about equally terrible, but between them I'm always on the side of Tehran. Because Iran at least doesn't have United States behind their backs, so the whole civilized world doesn't make its best efforts to look some other way when awful shit happens. Iran is also more secular, not by much, but it's something, Speaks in their favour too.
[QUOTE=gudman;49451228]Iran and Saudis are about equally terrible, but between them I'm always on the side of Tehran. Because Iran at least doesn't have United States behind their backs, so the whole civilized world doesn't make its best efforts to look some other way when awful shit happens. Iran is also more secular, not by much, but it's something, Speaks in their favour too.[/QUOTE]
We've been assholes to Iran, pretty much to the point of ruining any possibility of making amends.
Saudi Arabia, I frankly don't give a shit about. They're about on par with almost everyone else in the region with regards to stupidity and assholism, the main difference is that they're allied with us and buy our weapons. Like I said, I don't give a shit about them. We're not going to change them for the better, only they can do that. It's the same with Iran.
If there weren't so much violence and extremism going on over there right now, I'd say leave them to their own devices, let them sort it out themselves. Problem is, innocent people are dying by the thousands, and we bear at least part of the blame for it. We have a responsibility to do what we can for the people living there.
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