Muslims must embrace our British values, David Cameron says
340 replies, posted
[quote=telegraph.co.uk]British Muslims must subscribe to mainstream values of freedom and equality, [B]David Cameron will say as he declares that the doctrine of multiculturalism has “failed” and will be abandoned. [/B][/quote]
[quote=telegraph.co.uk]Entering the debate on national identity and religious tolerance, the Prime Minister will declare an end to “passive tolerance” of divided communities, and say that members of all faiths must integrate into wider society and accept core values.
To be British is to believe in freedom of speech and religion, democracy and equal rights regardless of race, sex or sexuality, he will say. Proclaiming a doctrine of “muscular liberalism”, he will say that everyone, from ministers to ordinary voters, should actively confront those who hold extremist views.
He will also warn that groups that fail to promote British values will no longer receive public money or be able to engage with the state.
His speech, to an international security conference in Munich, comes after The Daily Telegraph disclosed the extent to which the British intelligence community fears the “unique threat” of terrorist attacks by radicalised British Muslims.
Mr Cameron will promise a new willingness to argue against and “defeat” extremist ideologies that lead some to engage in terrorism.
That means abandoning the notion that different communities should be able to live according to their own values and traditions as long as they stay within the law. “Under the doctrine of state multiculturalism, we have encouraged different cultures to live separate lives, apart from each other and the mainstream,” Mr Cameron will say. “We have failed to provide a vision of society to which they feel they want to belong.”
All Britons should believe in basic values of freedom and equality, and actively promote them, he will say. That means ensuring that immigrants learn to speak English and that all schools teach “elements of a common culture and curriculum”.
The Prime Minister will accept that multiculturalism has left some members of the white community feeling unfairly treated. Racism and intolerance are “rightly” condemned, he will say. “But when equally unacceptable views or practices have come from someone who isn’t white, we’ve been too cautious, frankly too fearful, to stand up to them.”
The speech comes after Baroness Warsi, the Conservative Party chairman, caused controversy by claiming that prejudice against Muslims was widespread and socially acceptable.
Mr Cameron will draw a clear distinction between “Islamist extremism” as a political ideology, and the Islamic faith itself. “We need to be clear: Islamic extremism and Islam are not the same thing,” he will say.
The Government is reviewing its entire strategy for counter-terrorism and community cohesion amid concern that the state is working too closely with Muslim groups that do not fully endorse liberal values. Mr Cameron will say that community groups will be scrutinised in future to see if they promote democracy, equality and integration. Those that fail the “tests” will be cut off. “No public money, no sharing of platforms with ministers,” he will say. [/quote]
[url]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/david-cameron/8305346/Muslims-must-embrace-our-British-values-David-Cameron-says.html[/url]
Bolded sentence in particular. How the hell can you just "do away" with multiculturalism? It doesn't work like that. You can't just wave a magic wand and make people abandon foreign culture. He most likely won't do a thing, he probably just wants more conservative votes.
God finally... One country is waking up to this....
I cant wait intill Australia does, Hell im hearing all the time "Adapt or leave" in Australia.
And Americans do this and are called Racists
I'm still backing you up though my British friends.
[QUOTE=Best4bond;27865060]God finally... One country is waking up to this....
I cant wait intill Australia does, Hell im hearing all the time "Adapt or leave" in Australia.[/QUOTE]
I'm still waiting for this hear in the US Michigan area.
I like this.
[QUOTE=Best4bond;27865060]God finally... One country is waking up to this....
I cant wait intill Australia does, Hell im hearing all the time "Adapt or leave" in Australia.[/QUOTE]
merkel, chancellor of germany said that multiculturalism doesn't work.
[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11559451[/url]
it's about time really. let's send the muslims back to the middle east where they belong.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Racism" - TH89))[/highlight]
Good. If you immigrate into a different country, you adapt, not try to change the country.
[QUOTE=bazyboy;27865286]it's about time really. let's send the muslims back to the middle east where they belong.[/QUOTE]
[img]http://images1.memegenerator.net/ImageMacro/4202830/So-it-begins-the-great-shitstorm-of-our-time.jpg?imageSize=Medium&generatorName=White-Gandalf[/img]
I agree though
shut the fuck up you thatcherite moron
liberalism is about acceptance and allowing people to hold whatever values they want within law and almost all british muslims do so so shut the fuck up
stop exploiting a small group of people and open your fucking eyes, your hero Maggie only fucked up the country and now you wanna talk about muslims?
give me a fucking break cameron
Stupid idea generally. People are annoyed about the conflicts involved in multiculturalism, politicians are pestered about doing something to stop the short term conflict. Overall though it will end, like all other issues, with a peaceful resolution. Give people time to adjust, for people to work out all their conflicts and hates, and let the newer generations come to understand them. It'll all work out if you let it take it's course.
What would those British values be?
[editline]4th February 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=bazyboy;27865286]merkel, chancellor of germany said that multiculturalism doesn't work.
[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11559451[/url]
it's about time really. let's send the muslims back to the middle east where they belong.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Racism" - TH89))[/highlight][/QUOTE]
Let's send you back to the basement where you belong.
i'm extremely embarrassed by the fact that the country i hail from cannot stop themselves from pointing fingers at a small group that represents 3% of england.
[QUOTE=thisispain;27866299]i'm extremely embarrassed by the fact that the country i hail from cannot stop themselves from pointing fingers at a small group that represents 3% of england.[/QUOTE]
The country you are currently in has less than 1% but is still scared shitless of them. There's not many who are better than the UK.
[QUOTE=Devodiere;27866315]The country you are currently in has less than 1% but is still scared shitless of them. There's not many who are better than the UK.[/QUOTE]
david cameron is just misleading people to distract them from the ultimate failure of his administration
nothing new
[QUOTE=thisispain;27866196]shut the fuck up you thatcherite moron
liberalism is about acceptance and allowing people to hold whatever values they want within law and almost all british muslims do so so shut the fuck up
stop exploiting a small group of people and open your fucking eyes, your hero Maggie only fucked up the country and now you wanna talk about muslims?
give me a fucking break cameron[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=johan_sm;27865318]Good. If you immigrate into a different country, you adapt, not try to change the country.[/QUOTE]
pffff
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Empire[/url]
"adapting to our country/values/et al." is intentionally vague because anyone says it is really just hiding a general disdain for the culture or race of the people in question and basically saying that they want them to "go away" in an ill-defined way
i mean like thisispain said the only way you can expect them to adapt is for them to follow the laws of the country they move into, any complaint beyond that is just expecting them to be "more britishy" and "less muslimy" which is dumb as hell
[QUOTE=Pace.;27864942]You can't just wave a magic wand and make people abandon foreign culture. He most likely won't do a thing, he probably just wants more conservative votes.[/QUOTE]
You can if they're living entirely off of benefits or rely on Government licences / permits in their job.
[QUOTE=Hezzy;27866435]You can if they're living entirely off of benefits or rely on Government licences / permits in their job.[/QUOTE]
Like Chavs?
[QUOTE=Hezzy;27866435]You can if they're living entirely off of benefits or rely on Government licences / permits in their job.[/QUOTE]
you might be able to do that but it's morally reprehensible so the do-ability is sorta moot
[QUOTE=Habsburg;27866443]Like Chavs?[/QUOTE]
i know this was posted as a joke but it brings up a really good point. If David Cameron listed whatever "british values" he wants the immigrants to follow i'd guarantee that there are millions of native brits who don't follow those values either
[QUOTE=Hezzy;27866435]You can if they're living entirely off of benefits or rely on Government licences / permits in their job.[/QUOTE]
except they aren't
and if you want to tell me there are more muslim people on benefits than there are "english" people on benefits then i'd have to ask which england did i exactly live in because nothing was further from the truth than that
[quote]David Cameron will say as he declares that the doctrine of multiculturalism has “failed” and will be abandoned.[/quote]
[img]http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/01/01/article-1103511-02EC8D12000005DC-518_634x691.jpg[/img]
[QUOTE=Hezzy;27866435]You can if they're living entirely off of benefits or rely on Government licences / permits in their job.[/QUOTE]
Government economic dependence does not give them reign over all aspects of their life. At most they can influence their economic decisions but other than that it would be abuse of power over citizens.
Why is this targeted at Muslims
If Britain stands for freedom of religion maybe they should get all the christianity out of their government before they start bitching about minority religions
unless this is just rich white christians being bigoted again
I'm being told by my producers that this is, in fact, exactly what is happening
[QUOTE=thisispain;27866454]except they aren't
and if you want to tell me there are more muslim people on benefits than there are "english" people on benefits then i'd have to ask which england did i exactly live in because nothing was further from the truth than that[/QUOTE]
Whoa simmer down chap, where did I mention Muslims? I was merely pointing out that the Government will be stopping benefit funding to immigrants (READ: Not Muslims) if they're not making an effort to be British, amongst other things such as gambling licences, taxi licences, etc. Or at least, that's what the article implies; "He will also warn that groups that fail to promote British values will no longer receive public money or be able to engage with the state."
[QUOTE=Devodiere;27866499]Government economic dependence does not give them reign over all aspects of their life. At most they can influence their economic decisions but other than that it would be abuse of power over citizens.[/QUOTE]
I would argue that they're not citizens if they don't want to hold the country's values and practice its traditions. The article makes specific mention of "extremist" groups - in other words, those who would wish harm upon this country through radicalisation and violence.
Again, I must point out that this just doesn't apply solely to Muslims. The same could be said of immigrants from the Republic of Ireland.
[editline]5th February 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Zeke129;27866804]Why is this targeted at Muslims
If Britain stands for freedom of religion maybe they should get all the christianity out of their government before they start bitching about minority religions
unless this is just rich white christians being bigoted again
I'm being told by my producers that this is, in fact, exactly what is happening[/QUOTE]
It isn't. The telegraph has just spun it that way. Freedom of religion doesn't mean that ministers can't practice their own religion - in fact that's completely the opposite.
[QUOTE=Hezzy;27866814]I was merely pointing out that the Government will be stopping benefit funding to immigrants (READ: Not Muslims) [b]if they're not making an effort to be British[/b][/QUOTE]
What the fuck is "making an effort to be British"?
Do they have to go find some native americans to oppress or something?
[quote]I would argue that they're not citizens if they don't want to hold the country's values and practice its traditions.[/quote]
Again, what would those values and traditions be? Mandatory tea time at noon?
[QUOTE=Zeke129;27866833]What the fuck is "making an effort to be British"?
Do they have to go find some native americans to oppress or something?[/QUOTE]
Are you actually this stupid or are you blind
[quote=THE ARTICLE YOU DUNCE]All Britons should believe in basic values of freedom and equality, and actively promote them, he will say. That means ensuring that immigrants learn to speak English and that all schools teach “elements of a common culture and curriculum”.[/quote]
[QUOTE=Habsburg;27866849]Again, what would those values and traditions be? Mandatory tea time at noon?[/QUOTE]
See above
[QUOTE=Habsburg;27866849]Again, what would those values and traditions be? Mandatory tea time at noon?[/QUOTE]
According to this article British values are freedom of religion unless you are Muslim in which case you need to stop being Muslim and start being British ASAP
edit: yeah, exactly. "Freedom and equality". Tell me again why this was targeted at Muslims? Because that doesn't sound very fucking equal to me.
[QUOTE=Hezzy;27866814]Whoa simmer down chap, where did I mention Muslims? I was merely pointing out that the Government will be stopping benefit funding to immigrants (READ: Not Muslims) if they're not making an effort to be British[/QUOTE]
and what exactly is "being british" beyond being a citizen? Do they also have to love british comedy and soccer? Or do they have be Anglican and not eat ethnic food or something? Expecting people to change their traditions to some sort of "state-sanctioned" traditions is not the business of the state, that's (and i'm not being hyperbolic here) fascist.
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